Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: lazs2 on March 12, 2003, 08:47:43 AM
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If we can't have an early war area or closer fields then... Why not just add 40 or 60 carrier groups? Nobody doesn't like a good cv fight (except those who don't get to participate and feel left out).
lazs
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I like CV fights but they generate a lot of squeakin'. Maybe if there were more and thus each one were less important we wouldn't hear so much? Then again, I ususally have little problem tuning it out. A trait I might add that my wife is very proud of, or is it frustrated with? :confused:
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Sounds good to me!
I say take a map like the NDIsles map and put a port on each island except Furball Island (it would get a Tank City or Tank Jungle in the middle instead) and you'd really have something.
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Originally posted by gofaster
Sounds good to me!
I say take a map like the NDIsles map and put a port on each island except Furball Island (it would get a Tank City or Tank Jungle in the middle instead) and you'd really have something.
Hey map makers! How difficult would this (see quotes) be to do? This would be great IMO.
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Add a "troop ship" to each group, that can be sunk to disable LVTs. Then there will be no need to kill the carriers to protect fields from capture.
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Dale has a plan
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Originally posted by popeye
Add a "troop ship" to each group, that can be sunk to disable LVTs. Then there will be no need to kill the carriers to protect fields from capture.
I like that idea, even in the present maps. Though there'd need to be 2 or 3 of 'em I think.
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just a straight early war map (where all late war planes were disabled) would be good...would really spice things up...
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having more cv's would be great.
...but the TG's closest approach to land should be extended. Its kinda lame to have a TG parked so close to land that the ack umbrella extends over an airfield.
Even with the above restriction it would make for some really nice fights.
F.
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rude... i heard that he just told you that because he knows how gullible you are.
oh... pop.. that was a really good idea. and so was the "port at every isle" one.
lazs
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Originally posted by lazs2
oh... pop.. that was a really good idea. and so was the "port at every isle" one.
lazs
Hey! Give credit where its due! The proper reference is "GoFaster's Port At Every Isle Idea" (tm).
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The only thing I really detest about the CV groups is the 5 inch guns. You can mop the floor with some guys, and instead of coming back for more they hide in the 5 inch guns and just hold the trigger down... if the 5 inch guns weren't there I'd vote yes for more CV groups.
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CV fights are gayer then pork and auger.
You get ack huggers, pt dweebs, 5 inch dweebs and suicide pork and auger types all in 1 place.
or do you mean cv fights are fun because you can drive 1 up to an nme field and thus have a 20 sec flight time?
If thats so then you dont need cvs for that just place the af's closer on the maps. Atleast they cant be sunk and then sent 3 hours away after they respawn.
Since I dont fly cv planes my experience may be different but when a cv gets parked offshore I usually go else where. Now if we could have a bunch bases like a4 / a5 on the island map or a8 / a27 that would be much better. The furballs at these 2 places are the best in any game ever.
CV sux worse then night time.
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Originally posted by Urchin
The only thing I really detest about the CV groups is the 5 inch guns. You can mop the floor with some guys, and instead of coming back for more they hide in the 5 inch guns and just hold the trigger down...
Then EL Guapo would have nothing to do!!
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CV fights are the best.
Period.
That's the little "dot" at the end
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Originally posted by lazs2
If we can't have an early war area or closer fields then... Why not just add 40 or 60 carrier groups? Nobody doesn't like a good cv fight (except those who don't get to participate and feel left out).
lazs
I have to agree with Lazs...(ouch that hurt)
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How about a CV map, lots of CV's and a few dotted Islands. A battle of Midway type scenario. The big pacific carrier battles alway appealed to me and I'm sure a few others. I know it can be done on in CT etc but the big numbers are always in the MA. Sure there is bound to be some whining. But land based aircraft can fly off the islands. Hmmm maybe I'll design it myself, it can't be too hard all that sea, easy.
I like CV attacking and defending. The wall of flak thrown up is might impressive, just like something out of the newsreels.
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On the point of closer airfields to encourage furballs etc. It always seemed to me that the wide scattering of airfields, towns, factories, ports, vehicle hangars and all is neither realistic or conducive to enabling major battles. After all in real life towns, factories and airfields are grouped together by their very nature. New York, Paris, Rome, LA, Ok not LA bad example. In AH we have the capital somewhere in the mountains, a port somewhere miles from the nearest airfield, factories dispersed God knows where. VH's up the side of some bloomin' mountain.
My idea would be to cluster them all together, or some of them anyway. The capital should be defended by airfields, say three or four or five mutually supporting with the radar factory, possibly on the coast near the port and a couple of satellite towns nearby. Troop barracks, fuel and all the rest of the would soon build into a major metropolis. There could be one or more of these megapolis (megapoli?) in each country as in real life set back perhaps from the front lines. But one big city based around the capital.
The advantages of this as I see it would be to to draw in participants into a major fall of Berlin type scenarios. Obviously the enemy would have to take the big city to win the war. This can be done in a number of ways.
Strategic raids by bombers escorted by flocks of fighters. Bombers really are underused in the MA. This would encourage their use in the way intended as strategic weapons. Throughout any war the city would have to be reduced even if the front lines were miles away. It would be a tough nut to crack with massive flak defences too. This would avoid those big overwhelming Jabo raids. Formations would have to fight their way in and out.
Meanwhile the normal attritional attacks on the rest of the country could go on gradually working closer and closer to the megapolis. The trinity map would be ideal for this as it's large size would allow the capital to be set well back and give a focus to the war.
Eventually the enemy would be at the gates and a major battle would ensue. With mutually supporting airfields around the capital it would be less easy to smack down one field in a vulch fest when you can up from a nearbly field and tackle the intruders.
I think this or a variation could satisfy everyone. The buffs would get their moment in the sun. Strategy afficionados could make their plans and the furball fans would get all the targets they want. If the big city is on the coast the CV heads can get involved too with maritime landings.
One of the irritations for me is the relatively scattered and unfocussed attacks going on all over the map. Many is the time I've chopped and changed looking for the action only to find it's all gone away by the time I get there. This would allow everyone to know to see what the war is about. The road to Bishopton, or Rooklyon or Knightsbridge.
What do you think?????
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Whatever you build, leave a corner of the map with 3 airfields, uncapturable, with unporkable fuel. I don't care about any of the other stuff, strat, captures, whatever. Its all way outside of my zone of interest. Just give me a field to fly from, close to two other enemy fields that like minded folks can fly from, and you need not add anything more to the game. Keep us waaaay out in a corner too so we don't interfere with any of the arm chair air commanders out there.
...er, other than a squelch for Ch 2 for when the "join mission!" or "play the game my way" racket fills the test buffer. But I digress, the 3 remote fields on all maps would be a great start. Easiest and best addition one could make to the game.
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Remember the anchored CVs in AW DOS?
Nothing really but an airstrip sitting out in the ocean. How about three of them anchored off in some uninteresting corner of the map, make them unsinkable and give them somewhat deadly short range ack to cut the vulchin way back. Anchor them closer than our fields are but not too close.
Should be easy to implement; would make a nice furball corner.
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Originally posted by Toad
Remember the anchored CVs in AW DOS?
Nothing really but an airstrip sitting out in the ocean. How about three of them anchored off in some uninteresting corner of the map, make them unsinkable and give them somewhat deadly short range ack to cut the vulchin way back. Anchor them closer than our fields are but not too close.
Should be easy to implement; would make a nice furball corner.
That's cool for CV furballing but it's a limited planeset like CT. You'd still be screwed if you liked to furball in the Huri2c, P-40 or Spit1, etc...
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Originally posted by Vortex
Just give me a field to fly from, close to two other enemy fields that like minded folks can fly from, and you need not add anything more to the game.
It's right there in the DA on the East side of the map, just need to get more folks in there.
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Originally posted by BNM
It's right there in the DA on the East side of the map, just need to get more folks in there.
Multi-arena formats never seem to work that well. As you note, one just needs to get people to use the DA for that to be of any value. That's a near-impossible feat though. I'd think that taking that DA chunk of map and dropping it in the corner of every map we have would be a much better path to take. In the end though, if you can keep everyone in the same arena things are far more likely to succeed.
I'm not sure how AH II fits into this. It seems to be pulling things in a more structured, mission oriented direction. I have no problem with that as long as I can ignore it all entirely and just furball. Perhaps there's answers to these issues there...or perhaps its just going to make the problem worse than it already is. I dunno.
The stationary CV's in the corner isn't a bad idea at all. As noted though the plane set is then limited, which wouldn't be good.
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I agree... multi arena formats don't work and.... the cv's shouldn't be able to get so close to the shore that their ack umbrella covers a field or even the shore line. I also think that troopships is a great idea.
As for the luftweinies not having anything to do.... well... they would.. they could take off somewhere else and just ignore the cv's or... they could take off from the fields close to the cv's or... we could have the mythical 109 t... simply add about 1000 lbs or so to a 109 e for carrier use.
lazs
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Make the carrier decks really long and enable all the early war planes too. They get airborne pretty quickly anyway.
OK?
;)
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the field that is being attacked can up any plane type it wants.
lazs
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Originally posted by lazs2
the field that is being attacked can up any plane type it wants.
lazs
but the only planes they will ever face in that fight are CV planes. Where is the variety in targets for them? ;)
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There is a plan
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nifty.. where is the variety now? At least the CV ups about 5 different planes... the usage is pretty well spread out between british, American and jap planes.
rude... he is just telling you that because he knows you are gullible.
lazs
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You aint gonna get better fights then what ya get now. They will get worse. You will get more ack huggin/hidin/runnin. More pork and auger, only it will take less bombs to "close" a cv by sinking it then "closing" a medium field by bombing the hangers and/or fuel dead. Once a cv is dead it takes 17 min to cross 1 key pad in 1 sector. 51 min to cross 1 sector.
Then you have 5 inch dweebs that can pic you off more easily then manned ack.
You wont get the vulching but the pork and auger types will love it.
I assume you like "cv battles" because it allows for short flight times. Other then that I cant see where you would prefer an arena where just 2 guys can ride 8k worth bombs into a cv sinking them over and over. It doesnt sound like much fun at all.
I like flying an a6m5 and my lifetime k/d in a dhog is 9 to 1. Its all the other stupid stuff that makes CVs no fun.
Now if you want unsinkable cvs or some other nonsense that will never happen. It would better to open the TE and make yourself a map with 1000 fuel tanks at a field and 1000 hangers. Then set the fields 10 miles apart. Also give them 1 ammo bunker so when its dead no more bombing.
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Why not move the bases farther apart and put a fighter only base between with limited plane set for defense of farther base.
The fighter base can not be captured but can be stopped by taking out hangers.
If the bad guys manage to take the rear base, fighter base defaults with it.
This might also promote better buff raids and fighter escort.
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batz... interesting opinion but not born out by the facts.. The best fights in the arena are at the cv's right now. People have a ball at those fights those who act as you say just don't get into the action and are ignored. I think that the fights could be improved if some of the suggestions here were taken tho such as not being able to bring the cv so close as to have overlapping ack. but that has allways been suggested from time to time. No problem with that from anyone I have seen...
those who don't like to fight, the sky accountants and the terminaly timid... would still have the rest of the map to hide from eachother in.
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the Bk's
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Yeah your right we never see guys auger in to kill a cv, it never happens. I dont have any films of dive bombing lancs killing cvs either.......
As for cvs being the best fights no way a8 / a27 and a4 / a5 on the island are some of the best fights ever in ah.
CVs take take 8k bombs to kill and thats it. You then wait 15min for it to jump back to port and another hour for it to cross 1 sector.
Atleast at airfields you only gotta wait 30 min for the hangers to rebuild.
But I am sure your right a map with a bunch CVs (which would be easy as hell to make) would end all the pork and auger.
But wth make a cv map and see if ht goes for it.
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Sax that might be cool a main field with several satelite fields around it. But then they would just go after the fuel at the sat fields and they would be worthless.
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batz... not sure what your point is... i am as against suicide guys killing the cv as anyone same for a squad of suicide jabos killing a fields fuel or fh's... it happens but... not every time.. not even most or at least, not for a while.
last night at 145 was an over an hour slugfest with a cv parked off the coast... it of course was the only fight worth a damn in the whole infinity map too... there was no problem with the cv being too close and the numbers were about even and large... not many dweeby pt's... over an hour before som attention starved or well intentioned idiot sunk the cv...
We knew it was about over tho when the 190's and typhies and such came in from another field at high alt and tried to horn in on the only action on the map but they were a minor annoyance.
Anyone who participated (with the possible exception of said terminally timid late war jocks and missguided strat people) had a friggin blast.. musta been 40 people all having fun in one little spot while the rest of the terminaly boring infinity map was doing it's best to showcase either gangbanging strat methods or the skill of hiding from each other or.... testing compression speeds of late war ac.
lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BKs