Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: hogfarmr on May 08, 2001, 11:10:00 AM
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Rename id's for f4u to f4ud and f4uc. also p51b and p51d. maybe 109g and 109f, 190a, 190f and 190d.
Each plane is very different and takes different flying styles to kill.
-in real life on a good day you can spot a ww2 size plane at 15 miles, probably be able to id it at 7 or so. there is no way to do this in a game, graphics will never be that good. so you must name planes.
-we already have a 202 and 205. Also la5 and la7. no reason not to carry this over to others.
Keep up the good work HTC!
-AKHog
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While you can see the difference between some of those types at a pretty good distance (depending on the viewing angle), I would like to see someone tell an F4U-1C from and F4U-1D outside of the range made possible by the existing graphics (I don't believe an separate icon would be right). Even a P-51B and P-51D would be hard to judge from most angles and distances. Not to mention the difficulty involved with 109 and 190 variants (notwithstanding the "Dora", whose long nose is usuaully very prominent unless head on). I for one am happy with the icons as they are. Get close enough to see the target's variant, then you will know which tactic to use. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
[This message has been edited by streakeagle (edited 05-08-2001).]
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Well, the Mustangs wouldn't be hard at all to tell apart unless you were underneath or directly in front of the planes.
I have to agree with this guy's point--we should have some continuity with our ICONS. There is little visual difference between a Tempest or Typhoon, or between a 202 and a 205, yet they have different ICONS. Yet, strangely, despite the massive visual difference between the P-51's they get the same ICON.
The FW's are even stranger. The 190A's and D have the same ICON, although the D is quite a bit different looking. Yet, for some reason, the 152 gets its own ICON. This makes no sense. A 152 is easy to mistake for a D-9, however a D-9 is a lot different from the "A"-series. If ICONS were really based on how hard it is to identify a plane, the D-9 and 152 would have the same ICON, and all the "A"'s would have a different ICON.
My own guess is the ICONS were originally intended to be based on identification, but HTC basically forgot about this as more important things gobbled up their attention.
J_A_B
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id like to see it go the other way actually
on lachovin for the different la types, and macchi for the different 202-205 types etcera.
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Zig, i too would love to see this happen. but.... it would give a big advantage to people who can run high resolutions, and some many people would complain that it wouldnt last. Also many dweebs would complain just to be complaining, thats why most sims are not like this.
I'd love to have minimun icons, but it just isnt going to happen. so the next best thing is what we have now, maybe just a little more normalized with the above said changes. This IS more realistic in the sence that a good ww2 pilot could id a plane at 7 miles, since there is no way to id a plane in ah at 7 miles without icons then make the icons the id.
Maybe make planes that look the same like the 202 205 the same id. but planes like the 51 b and 51d are so different, as are the 190a and 190d that you need to have a different icon to be realistic in id ranges.
-AKHog
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Not to pick too much of a bone, but IDing a fighter at 7 miles? That's basically 37,000 ft, which is about cruising alt for today's jetliners. I look up and see a tiny speck with contrails behind it. If the contrails weren't there, I'd be hard pressed to even find the jetliner, let alone ID it. A P51 is about 32 ft long with 37 ft wingspan. A 727 is about 132 ft long with 108 ft wingspan, and the 747 is 232ft long w/ 211ft wingspan! If someone can tell the difference between a D pony and B pony or C Hog and D Hog at 7 miles, then I need some damned new glasses if I can't ID a jetliner cruising over me! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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I'd actually like to see icons give less away - just "lwf" for luftwaffe until u get close enough to id the type (1-2K perhaps) - and it doesn't have to be mandatory - I would prolly fly with "supericons" off anyway
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BigUC
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On a side note.. currently it's pretty easy to tell a p51D from a p51B due to the shiny, 'here I am', color of the D model.
They kind of 'twinkle'.. dead giveaway even before I see their icon.
Amend that:... is it my monitor and resolution making this possible.. or is everyone seeing this ?
[This message has been edited by Wlfgng (edited 05-08-2001).]
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Actually I think the slight ambiguity is nice.
Hooligan
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There's a trde off for running high resolutions.
A 'dot' for me is 1/4 of the size for someone running in 800x600. I can see them against the sky, but against the ground? Not a hope.
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Graywolfe <tim@flibble.org>
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I'm with Zigrat on this one.
Niffty,
We get icons at 6,000 yards in AH.
6,000*3=18,000ft
18,000/5280=3.4 miles
3.4 miles !=7 miles.
Still, identifying fighters wouldn't really happen at 6000 yards.
How about:
Icon (enemy/friendly) at 6000 yards.
Type ID for four engines at 5000 yards.
Type ID for two engines at 3500 yards.
Type ID for one engine at 2500 yards.
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We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother
Bring the Mosquito FB.MkVI Series 2 to Aces High!!!
Sisu
-Karnak
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IMO,
There is too much information already passed before you engage. But keep in mind, im a realism fanatic.
Would I would like to see is icons showing whether contact is friendly or foe at a distance. This allows us to determine if we should spend the time/effort approaching the bogey.
Then when you get within a certain "visual" range, id like to see the plane type displayed. Plane variant is not necessary because HT has done such a good job with the graphics that ID pretty simple within visual range.
We can go back to the icon/no icon debate but its my feeling that most participants want some type of icon.
I like an element of surprise and the ability to jump an opponent no matter how small the opprotunity.
So, it would be a little surprise to find out what plane type you are enganging within combat range. Might give you an opprotunity to turn the tables on a superior plane or vice versa.
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Karaya One
Flying Pigs Squadron
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Rumor has it, its that way because the enemy icons are set to 3 alphanumeric characters. Want consistency? There you go (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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I do recall seeing something about this almost one year ago.
Someone was asking Pyro about the icons and it WAS limited to a three character ID.
There you go.
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Vruth
(http://www.telusplanet.net/public/brandor/images/412.gif)
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thought it was "lanc" in for that plane... and "Flak" for FlakPanzer... and "PNZR" for the tank... "Typh" for the typhoon... "Temp" for the tempest... "Spit" for the spitfire.
Don't really remember the Spit being anything other than that.
So.. seems Vruth is close to accurate with "Someone was asking Pyro about the icons and it WAS limited to a three character ID."
AKDejaVu
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Here's an old post I made about Icons/ranges. I still feel this way and I do wish we'd experiment.
There have been some good suggestions made in various threads. I hope some day we give them a try.
"This icon discussion has gone on for years. I'm not a big supporter of icons as presented in the major online ACM sims.
Here's my thoughts from a post on the same subject in the Gameplay topic; I still feel this way.
Here's a few points to ponder. These thoughts are based on a non-historical arena, where all sides fly all planes. Strict Historical could/should be different.
Ranges would have to be hashed out but that's an area that affords easy experimentaion once the overall system is set.
1. At long range, a plane <whether friend or foe, fighter or bomber> should just be an unknown dot.
2. As range closes, one would be able to distinguish a dot as a bomber earlier than a fighter. Therefore, some sort of "buff" ID should show at a range that would still be a dot for a fighter. At this range you couldn't tell friend from foe.
This means a dot could be either a long range plane of either type or a closer fighter that is not yet distinguishable. You just couldn't tell.
3. As range further decreased, a fighter ID should show. You should also now be able to tell, in some way, friend from foe, perhaps just a red dot at nose, tail and wingtips. This assumes that we would <in Real Life> be distinguishing plane type. Again, this would be a different range for a bomber than a fighter.
4. Now, after IFF range, add distance information. Range info should perhaps only be shown in 1k or .5k increments to avoid the rapidly running counters. I would not show range beyond a certain distance <a yet to be determined "threat" range> and I would remove it as the aircraft comes to "guns range." Perhaps cut out range info inside of 1k or .5k at minimum. You need IFF here, but you don't need range when you're ready to shoot. That should be part of pilot skills and judgement.
5. I would have no aircraft type ID available at ranges that allow you to distinugish that info from the graphics. (determined for the lowest resolution avail). I would allow some simple "type" info at ranges where you could see it in real life.
Different colored dots, arrows, numbers...any of these could be used to provide this type of information while minimizing and shrinking the huge icons we now have.
Just some thoughts. I'm sure everyone has some ideas and I'd love to read them. I hope we can get a meaningful discussion going and
I also hope we can talk HTC into experimenting in the SEA with "alternative Icon lifestyles".
Just my .02.
BTW, Nifty, you can usually see much further at altitude than you can looking up. Instead of looking through up the heavy haze and smoke and stuff at the lower altitudes you are looking across air that is usually much more clear.
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whilst i would like to know what im fighting i dont want anyone to know what IM in! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I think the not knowing is part of the game and should not be changed.Its a lot of fun to engage someone and suddenly think 'oh toejam its a spitV! not a IX!'
makes for more interesting fights.
just remember if you get this information early you will plan your fight accordingly and this means so will your enemy.We will see more people running i bet.
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Hazed
3./JG2 (http://members.home.net/winyah999/3jg2.htm)
[This message has been edited by hazed- (edited 05-08-2001).]
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I would like to have just the enemy icon , no plane type with this added :
1. My eyes are old and getting worse . On another post they wrote about the POV that AH uses , 90 degs ( please tell me if I am wrong ), and that makes the planes smaller than in RL unless you use the zoom option . Now if I could zoom out alittle to get the correct size plane and lose some POV "without" the cockpit getting bigger that would really help . As it works now with the cockpit zooms bigger too , its not the way I would like it too work .
Maybe even a option to have the default to 75 or whatever it is suppose to be to make the planes bigger , I don't care if I lose the larger POV I just can't see the aspect angle of the plane in this game like the others . Or make the planes bigger and lose the zoom and leave it on 90 degs .
I am now using a 21 monitor and really don't have a problem with other flight games with lesser POV's .
[This message has been edited by airspro (edited 05-08-2001).]