Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Habu on March 21, 2003, 01:55:52 PM
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France opposes U.S.-run administration in Iraq
Canadian Press; Associated Press
Refusing to end his opposition to the United States and Britain over Iraq, French President Jacques Chirac threatened Friday to veto any UN resolution to let them run the Persian Gulf country after the war.
Allowing Washington and London to oversee the creation of a new government in Iraq would reward them for starting a war that flouted world opinion, Chirac said.
France would veto any attempt in the United Nations to "legitimize the military intervention (and) ... give the belligerents the powers to administer Iraq,'' Chirac told reporters after a European Union summit.
"That would justify the war after the event,'' he said.
In Washington, U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell brushed off the French threat, saying "we're going to put in place a better life for the people of Iraq, a representative form of government.''
The French leader's comments indicated the major rift in the West could get worse. France and Germany, backed by Russia and China, waged a sustained diplomatic campaign on the UN Security Council in an attempt to avert military action. That, in turn, created a crisis in transatlantic relations.
The war badly split the EU as Spain, Italy, Denmark, the Netherlands and Portugal backed Britain's pro-American stance, while the other countries lined up with France and Germany. In all countries, public opinion had been overwhelmingly against the war.
Chirac's warning came after British Prime Minister Tony Blair earlier urged the other EU nations to support future moves at the UN to forge a post-Saddam "civil authority in Iraq.''
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Who cares what france wants? shreck em let them eat cake. They are irrelivant.
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Can we all say WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!
A saying we had back in football when someone did not want to do the drills required was "Oh does your p***y hurt?" Well Frenchy's does it hurt because you didn't get your way? Oh cry my french tickler baby's. I hope that the EU collapses around you and the German's.
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France just wants to keep the oil to themselfs!
Big suprise!
Personally I don't think France should have ANY say on what happens to Iraq.
They didn't want to help end SH's threat to the world mainly because they were a part of the problem. They knew he wouldn't hurt them because they were Allies.
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They're getting desperate and making more mistakes... threatenting to veto again? Didnt they learn the first time? Chirac is not helping France at all... if they are meaningless in the eyes of the rest of the world now, they will be worthless in their own eyes after they pull this stunt.
Much like the Dixie Chicks, France is done.
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It is quite apparent that the countries with real influence in the world ignore France.
It reminds me of my little sister growing up. Always trying to get me in trouble, crying to my parents that I shouldn't be allowed to go to the movies alone, just because she couldn't. When she grew up, she got the freedoms of being an adult also.
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http://www.cafeshops.com/francesucks
I'm going to buy one on my next payday :D
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Originally posted by Saurdaukar
Much like the Dixie Chicks, France is done.
So true.
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France? didn't they used to be a country?
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aaaah ... stupidity is very good bussines in the US
is anyone surprised ?
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eag.. you're making yourself look stupid.
sorry man, but it's true.
Possibly, you should adhere to being more objective in your rampant posts.
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eag, you really shouldn't type sentences that declare someone else is stupid, when the very sentences you type have misspelling in them.
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France is doing what any sovereign state does - looks after its interests, especially when $60 billion debts are at stake.
Granted, they're hardly doing it in the right way, but competent diplomacy seems to a be a rare commodity these days.
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Originally posted by Dowding
especially when $60 billion debts are at stake.
The operative word here is "were."
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Why is France "protecting its interests" and the US is "Not listening to world opinion?"
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So the US is just protecting financial interests, like France would like to?
I'd say it was more complicated than that.
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Originally posted by Dowding
So the US is just protecting financial interests, like France would like to?
I'd say the US led coalition is liberating Iraq, even as France and a few others protest this heinous crime. Guess their billions are more important to them than someone elses welfare.
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(http://www.spiegel.de/img/0,1020,252167,00.jpg)
Straffo,
Your government sucks arse. I hope you are ready to sleep in the bed chirac the worm has made for you and your countrymen!
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;)
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I did hear we're giving France the bistro concession on the Left Bank of the Tigris. They seem happy with this.
But that's it. All food and drink establishments on the Left Bank of the Euphrates are going to Spain. Tapas!! Doooood!
The Right Bank of the Euphrates will be English Pubs. Stout!
The other bank of the Tigris has been reserved for Hooters. By request of the Iraqis themselves.
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now *thats* my kind of woman!
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By request of the Iraqis themselves.
damn, these folks CAN be saved!
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now *thats* my kind of woman!
You mean a model hired by www.protestwarrior.com to entice you to visit http://www.protestwarrior.com Web site so that you can buy one of their t-shirts, bumper stickers or posters?
The site's owners do have an interesting philosophy on the region, not one of the ones we've pushed though:
...Take the issue of the Palestinians. The Arabs have six million square miles of land. They could give their Palestinian brothers a state tomorrow, and with one day's oil profits give every one of them a bar of gold. Instead, the Arab dictators prop up Arafat and his loathsome gang of oppressors, and brainwash their people to be pure monsters. When mothers happily send their children off to bomb buses and schools, this is not based on any rational grievance. No, this is endemic of a sick, utterly immoral, anti-life culture that serves only one purpose: to keep tyrants in power.
For the last 50 years, Israel has been the shock absorbers for Western Civilization, taking the blows, fighting the fight. But Islamic fundamentalism has escalated this war into a global clash of civilizations. It's similar to the Cold War in that it is Freedom vs. Statism, but what makes it even more dangerous is that Islamic terrorists are so utterly irrational, so willing to kill just for the sake of killing. This menace must be stopped...
Here's a founder Kfir Alfia, with the protest model. He looks to be a strapping young guy of military age. I guess he could be serving in the military and actually fight for his cause, but he would rather sell you a T-shirt.
Charon
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And your point is?
That people that get out and protest tend towards the extreme ends of the bell curve? Either end? ;)
Or that capitalism is a wide and varied opportunity?
Or that cute chicks dig entrepreneurs?
What?
:)
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Maybe he did serve in the Military. What is military age?
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Stop this childish yelling at the French and any other country for that matter. You may not agree with their standing on things but lame whining about them does not make things any better. It is possible to state your opinions without this kind of "debating"
Remember.... This may come back to bite us hard in the arse in the future.
I used to think that that we were a great nation that went out to do some good in the world, not insulting others for their belife.
Atlest stop it in respect for the French players in the AH community and to HTC as a company that has customers all over the world.
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Not a hope in hell, AronL. Commendable idea, though.
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Originally posted by AronL
Stop this childish yelling at the French and any other country for that matter. You may not agree with their standing on things but lame whining about them does not make things any better. It is possible to state your opinions without this kind of "debating"
Remember.... This may come back to bite us hard in the arse in the future.
I used to think that that we were a great nation that went out to do some good in the world, not insulting others for their belife.
Atlest stop it in respect for the French players in the AH community and to HTC as a company that has customers all over the world.
So let me get this straight. You and left wing eurostudmuffin USA resenting buddies can bash us about the war on terror all day long but when good patriotic americans respond in kind then it becomes a problem...
Well Whoop Dee Dooo... :rolleyes:
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AronL........you forgot your "C", bud.
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Originally posted by Turdboy
France just wants to keep the oil to themselfs!
Tardboy, who was it again, who wants to keep oil to themselves and are actually fighting for it at this very moment? :rolleyes:
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It's "free speech" Grun.
"We can say WHATEVER we want about you but you have to shut up! ..... Ahhh! Zip it!"
Gotta love it, eh?
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Hope HTC are happy about loosing customers because you guys find it so funny to post your thrash.
They just lost one.
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Damn Toad you and I are just too dam mean and scary... we gotta stop.. :D
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You know Toad I was thinking about that earler today. The liberals consider it a violation of their free speech rights when people oppose their arguments. Did you see that whole Dixie Chicks thread, a few of them nearly compared the radio boycotts to a nazi police action...
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He quit flying/playing Aces High because not everyone agrees with his views on the HTC BBS?
Have to wonder about that. He could just "fly" and not read the BBS right? Or read the other forums and ignore the O-Club.
Or does the thought that people who don't agree with his simplistic and basically unsupported O-Club arguments also get to fly in the same Main Arena with him offend his sense of "free speech"?
Guess we'll never know now.
But I'm not mean. :)
I never called him names or accused him of anything. I just mostly asked questions about his views and posted my own. Is that mean? Or did I violate the terms of my "frees speech" parole?
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I think my other post cleary shows you are actually human right viloator. How dare you question his precious opinion.
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Stating your opinion is one thing, but the way its done is another matter.
Poof.
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Is that a genuine real "poof"?
Or is that the old "head-fake poof right, post in O-Club again, on 2, BREAK!" poof?
You don't like the way I state my opinion?
Please enlighten me. Where's the problem?
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That guys a shade he didnt pop up on the BBS until the war was on. Then he in his profile he said he was a "Submarine Engeneer"
So I suspect you are correct in the
head-fake poof right, post in O-Club again, on 2, BREAK!
but with a twist........ a fake substitution. He will come back with a different nic and fool us all.
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Roger that, Wotan. ;)
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Well, considering he can't spell Connecticut and he supposedly lives there, I'd guess he did a google search for submarine bases, saw one there and rolled with it.
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Location now Unknown.
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Originally posted by Martlet
Well, considering he can't spell Connecticut and he supposedly lives there, I'd guess he did a google search for submarine bases, saw one there and rolled with it.
Oh I dinnae.. I lived in CT for like 4 years before I bothered to spell it right :D
Kinda wondering if it's someone I know (if it's not a trolling alias).
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Hey vector do a little reading before you post your BS.
Who gets oil from Iraq now?
Who has been helping SH for 30 years?
Who signed a U.N. resolution to act if SH didn't cooperate and then backed out of the deal we he didn't?
Who is NOW trying to get the U.N. to inforce contracts signed with Iraq for oil?
Who has flat out said they would veto ANYTHING the U.S.A. put before the U.N. regarding Iraq? Before the war even started!
All these questions can be answered with 1 word FRANCE!
The U.S./coalition forces has said when they get rid of SH they will let the people of Iraq decide who leads them.
The U.S. is also going to provide billions of dollars to the Iraqi's to help rebuild their country.
What is France going to do?
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Roger that, Wotan.
My heads to big for shades, everyone knows its me.........
:cool:
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And your point is?
That people that get out and protest tend towards the extreme ends of the bell curve? Either end?
Or that capitalism is a wide and varied opportunity?
Or that cute chicks dig entrepreneurs?
What?
Toad
Well, my point developed like this. Looking at the image I think, wow, that looks like a model there. Imagine that, a model on the Internet who is not taking her clothes off for some moderate quality Eastern European Web porn. Then, hmm, all those signs have a Web address on them. Since I have a background in PR and work as a journalist today, leading to an entirely cynical view of the world based largely on first hand experience, this set off some red flags: "marketing alert!" :) I went to the web site.
First thing I notice is the lack of banner ads. Well, that's a good sign. You see some rather rabid political philosophy, a philosophy not really shared by many of the pro war protestors but a philosophy certainly embraced by some factions. Fine, there are many special interests and general interests being debated on both sides of the issue.
But then I notice the TOC on the side promoting protest materials like $3.00 bumper stickers without being able to find even the vague: "Portions of the proceeds will be donated to..." Then you look at their "counter protest" activities and the PR side of me realizes how effective these counter demonstrations can be at generating a buzz and awareness of this admittedly excellent pro war product line. Having just watched news of the second set of allied casualties roll in, I suppose it just pissed me off. Just like the "professional protest organizers" I saw interviewed on the news that night pissed me off. So I posted my outrage at like 2:00 am.
A small point of outrage, but then I tend to be serious as a heart attack sometimes, and have the entirely irrational view that everything in the world should be proper, rational, well-considered and intellectually honest :) What do you be I won't live to be 50 before I have the mother of all strokes.
Most of the anti-war protestors piss me off; the some 40% of the people in that recent NY poll who supported the war because they believe Saddam Hussein was directly involved in 9-11 piss me off; Saddam Hussein pisses me off no end; the beltway journalists who are more interested in "access" than real reporting piss me off (thank god for Helen Thomas, who doesn't give a damn at this point in her life); Whitehouse spin calculated to best "sell the war" to the American people pisses me off; the Turks piss me off but are hardly a surprise; the Democrats who rolled over months ago and now decide to have a backbone piss me off (fire them all); the war profiteers at all levels piss me off; the French piss me off; North Korea scares me; the think tank warriors like Wolfowitz piss me off... about the only people who don't piss me off are the troops who need to do their duty like the warriors they are and wrap this **** up and get home, hopefully sometime in this decade.
My dream right now is that this war will be so successful, with such a low loss of life and with such a remarkable realignment of the region that a fair peace and solid security result. I really want to be leading the charge to elect Bush to his third term, or perhaps Rumsfeld to his first. We get to find out how smart his advisors really are now.
Charon
BTW, as for the protest guys getting the chicks... sad but true. However, this guy paid for that chick. He even had a "grip and grin" I posted which shows he has a ways to go in the marketing sophistication department (you just don't put that on the site, regardless of how pleased you are with yourself :)) I could help him with his message development and copy -- make it a bit more mainstream, obscure the message a bit -- but I'd rather see him humping a pack out in the desert somewhere getting paid about $2.00/hr (we are talking 20 hour days here) to support the USA.
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So what? Someone made a site to sell and distribute anti-France goods. And who implied that such a thing needs to have its proceeds donated to some organization?
I haven't done it, but I bet if you go to an anti-war site they will be selling goods as well.
I think I'm lost.
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He must be doing something right, because I have a strange desire to buy a T-shirt.
AronL, you still spell like s-h-i-t.
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Charon, I read all that.
Tell me that you didn't write that much just to say that guys that make money off protest signs piss you off.
Please.
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Originally posted by Turdboy
Hey vector do a little reading before you post your BS.
Who gets oil from Iraq now?
Who has been helping SH for 30 years?
Who signed a U.N. resolution to act if SH didn't cooperate and then backed out of the deal we he didn't?
Who is NOW trying to get the U.N. to inforce contracts signed with Iraq for oil?
Who has flat out said they would veto ANYTHING the U.S.A. put before the U.N. regarding Iraq? Before the war even started!
All these questions can be answered with 1 word FRANCE!
The U.S./coalition forces has said when they get rid of SH they will let the people of Iraq decide who leads them.
The U.S. is also going to provide billions of dollars to the Iraqi's to help rebuild their country.
What is France going to do?
Why don't you read my BS before writing yours?
Where did I say French doesn't think of oil?
I'm not any cheerleader for France, actually, in my eyes Chirac and Bush are both absurd clowns.
Of course USA is only thinking of Iraq ppl wealth and is the only reason for being there right now, no arguing about that...
Yet another interesting information is "Number of Years a Country's Oil Reserve is expected to last" -from UN site:
1. Iraq 129 years
2. Kuwait 127 years
...
USA 10 years
Draw your conclusions as you want, but facts remains.
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Originally posted by Vector
Draw your conclusions as you want, but facts remains.
OK. I conclude that we'll have to buy oil on the world market from folks like OPEC and such. I conclude we'll be happy to pay in dollars and they'll be happy to take dollars.
In short, I conclude it'll work the same way it has for the last 30 years or so.
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Toad despite my best attempts to educate you I still dont think you got the point - America is going to steal the oil in Iraq...
Heres a catchy little tune to help you and everyone else remember that fact:
No war for oil!
No war for oil!
No war for oil!
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Grunherz, you idiot! First we have to kill all the Iraqi civilians, THEN we steal the oil!
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Vector,
Draw your conclusions as you want, but facts remains.
You may have a few facts, but that does not mean your conclusions are correct. Any more than my fact that Finland is not in this war leads to the conclustion that it is because they must have 100-years of reserves.
Evidence that the USA is not in the practice of stealing land for oil is the first Gulf War. Afterall, Kuwait is in complete control of its own country and oil reserves. When Iraq is free from their dictatorship and once again an autonomous country in control of their oil fields, will you come back and publicly apologize for misreading your crystal ball? If by chance the USA actually steals the Iraqi oil fields, I'll publicly apologize for my country's actions.
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Originally posted by Raubvogel
Grunherz, you idiot! First we have to kill all the Iraqi civilians, THEN we steal the oil!
Doh! How shameful of me to not remember... Then again America is so evil that one is bound to forget one of its atrocities from time to time..
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I was just venting a little Toad.
And yeah Puke, whether you're making money off the pro-war position and using protests as a marketing opportunity, as these tools are, or making money off the anti-war position, as the professional protest organizers are, well, I find both equally disagreeable. Do you find them both agreeable? I remember a few people finding all the patriotic merchandising after 9-11 disagreeable and the musicians etc. trying to captialize on the moment disagreeable.
But it is the American way, and always has been. You can find examples at least to the Civil War, and likely to the Revolution if you look for it. As my rambling post covered, I have an idealistic view of what America should be even though I do know better. In fact, even though it isn't perfect it works pretty dammed well compared to the rest of the world. But, when we are at war, crass consumerism that uses the war effort as a marketing tool just pisses me off. Apparently it's just my personal problem.
Frankly, maybe I should give the guy a call. With some fine-tuning and a broader PR campaign to build on his grass roots efforts, he could probably open up his product line to a much broader customer base. Could probably pay for the new fence I want for the back yard.
Charon
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Vector nice facts but they don't answer ANY of my questions.
Is the USA after oil? Maybe
I can't sit here and honestly say that we are not. Just don't know BUT I do know that the other reasons we are there are more important.
It's funny how almost everyone agrees that SH violated UN resolutions but no one could agree on what to do.
The UNSC members failed to do their job because of personal dealings with SH by a few members so there was NO solution in sight.
What do we do then as a Nation? Do we sit back and wait for SH to build up his arsenal to a point where all the countries around him are to afraid to say or doing anything because of the fear of being attacked?
AND on top of everything else who would be called in to handle SH if the UN had done the right thing in the first place?
The US and UK. (others also but mainly these two)
So here we are knowing the UN will not be able to do anything because a couple of countries with personal stakes in Iraq. Are we supposed to sit back and allow things to get worse? Knowing the longer we wait the harder it's going to be when we do finally go in.
What do we do?
This was the only option left to us.
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The language Grunherz uses is quite remarkable considering he's not even a real american. He's what, first generation american?
Heck, his immigration stamp hasn't even dried properly and he's already the loudest moron on this UBB, insulting his own roots of which he for some reason thinks he's separated after changing his nationality. He has become a super american.. Or an immigrant trying to convince the bureau that he's worth keeping.. Pfft.
You're easy to see through Grun, I'd laugh if it was funny.
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Charon,
It all depends on what the money is being made from. Actually, I think this guy is just providing a service to those who are upset with France right now. Someone walks away with a shirt that he probably could not creat on his own, and someone walks away with a few bucks. I for one do not have silk-screening equipment in my house and if I wanted an anti-France t-shirt, I would not expect this person to supply it to me for free.
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Originally posted by Siaf__csf
The language Grunherz uses is quite remarkable considering he's not even a real american. He's what, first generation american?
Heck, his immigration stamp hasn't even dried properly and he's already the loudest moron on this UBB, insulting his own roots of which he for some reason thinks he's separated after changing his nationality. He has become a super american.. Or an immigrant trying to convince the bureau that he's worth keeping.. Pfft.
You're easy to see through Grun, I'd laugh if it was funny.
i find his credentials as an american far more apealing than yours.
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The language Grunherz uses is quite remarkable considering he's not even a real american. He's what, first generation american?
Hmmm, so what is THAT supposed to mean. I wasn't aware of any time requirements.....My ancestors came over on a boat during the Irish Potato Famine in the late 19th Century........do I qualify as an American?
USAF SSGT 1975-1982
Never underestimate the power of human stupidity,
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I'd like to ask you all to stop bashing France, lest they stop their primary exports of snails and French-aimed derisive laughter.
Must... have... snails!
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fu*k the french government, fu*k anything that looks like it's french, fu*k anybody that does buisness with the french, and fu*k the son-a-squeakes that defend the french.
fu*king bellybutton licking french cokesackers are directly responsibile for every coalition life lost thanks to their obsructionisim politics, economic support and the moral support they have given saddam since 1991.
same goes for those french dick lickers in the german and russian government.
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Originally posted by Udie
(http://www.spiegel.de/img/0,1020,252167,00.jpg)
Straffo,
Your government sucks arse. I hope you are ready to sleep in the bed chirac the worm has made for you and your countrymen!
I'm so ****ed that I can't barely sit in front of my computer (and having a fried mobo don't help either).
It hurt plenty.
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Originally posted by straffo
I'm so ****ed that I can't barely sit in front of my computer (and having a fried mobo don't help either).
It hurt plenty.
Reap it.
Bastards.
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Originally posted by Siaf__csf
The language Grunherz uses is quite remarkable considering he's not even a real american. He's what, first generation american?
Heck, his immigration stamp hasn't even dried properly and he's already the loudest moron on this UBB, insulting his own roots of which he for some reason thinks he's separated after changing his nationality. He has become a super american.. Or an immigrant trying to convince the bureau that he's worth keeping.. Pfft.
You're easy to see through Grun, I'd laugh if it was funny.
The only thing that's funny is your misunderstanding of what Amereica is about. I am willing to bet my years income that there is not a single person on this BBS that is a 'pure blooded' American. My ancestors range from both Ireland and England, to a couple of countries on the mainland of Europe. And there's a little American Indian in me too.
It's not time in country, it's attitude and beliefs.
Grun
edit...LOL, yes I am a mutt :D
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hu ?