Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: rust on July 30, 2000, 01:38:00 AM
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I had a dream I was flying Aces High (that's how you know you've flown too much) and I was chasing a bandit across the sky and when he went in front of the sun my screen was totally whited out- I couldn't even see the instruments- for just a few seconds and then it was past and I kept fighting. Go out and look at the sun. It is impossible to look into it for more than a second and you really can't see anything while you are staring at it. A realistic sun would really add a lot to the game. It would be such a cool tool for offensive and defensive manuvers. A bandit's chasing you- pull into the sun and radically manuver when he's behind you. That couple of seconds of blindness could save your life. Attack fighters out of the sun where they have extreme dificulty in seeing you and, of course, you have no icon.
I read that a pilot's trick was to put his thumb in front of his face to block out the sun and, thereby, see around it somewhat better. With our virtual cockpits, this is what the struts could do. You could move your head until a canopy strut (sorry P51s!)was blocking the sun, thereby somewhat bettering your view (but not by too much). With the amazing 3d lighting already present in the game, imaginee how cool it would look with the dramatic shadows and sunlight playing all over the cockpit as you loop around the sky.
No other sim has it... let's see what we can do about that.
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RUST
(http://home.earthlink.net/~rocketace/_uimages/rustsbucketp38small.jpg)
[This message has been edited by rust (edited 07-30-2000).]
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Agreed. Probably the biggest disappointment I had with AH was when 1.03 was released and there STILL was not a realistic sun glare.
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Indeed
One of the few good things of Janes WW II Fighters is the really BLINDING sun !!
It would be awesome if he had that in AH
We could then attack from "out of the sun" (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Moose_EAF322
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I really love Mig Alley's white out effect. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Mr. Hengist will probably think so too. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
-Mitsu
"Mew Mew to War!"
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Hear, hear.
danish
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Right, Jane's WW2 Fighters sun was amazing. We should have it here.
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Stoickov
JG54 "Grünherz"
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HI ALL:
add a thumb up key command, then you could put your thumb up to block the sun, or you could use it to thumb another pilot. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
wolf37
C.O.
THUNDER BIRDS
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If we get a thumb command, can we get a finger command too? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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HE heeee, I think you would find keyboards all over the world with the key or keycombo broken the "finger command" was assigned.
What needs to be added to the readio is the "Smilies"!!!
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WB 2.0 had a strong sun effect, and I didnt like it. Nobody did. They scaled it back, it was better but still a pain.
I would rather see development time put in to new planes and features rather than sun effect.
Just my opinion,
Dago
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Dago..why didn't they like the blinding sun ?
Ok..its not easy to fly..but that is the realistic part of it.
And you can use the sun effect, choosing from which angle you attack.
The defender has a disadvantage then...but that was also in WW II.
Moose
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I remember most people didn´t like sun glare then. I guess real wwii pilots didn´t either. But it was there. And many pilots used it as an advantage against careless pilots. I´d prefer a more realistic sun here too, though I am not sure if it´s gonna work so well w this icon system.
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Dago wrote:
"...I didnt like it. Nobody did. They scaled it back, it was better but still a pain"
Cant remember one player complaining about the sun - except of course when he was blinded and subsequently killed ;=)
Indeed to claim that "noby liked it" is rubbish.
That feature will open new possibilities in the ACM, both offensive and defensive.How high it should be on the list is another question.
danish
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Danish, I gotta wonder if you were playing WB at the time it switched from the 1.x version to the all new 2.0?
If you did, you should know, that the sun was a big problem and virtually everyone complained non-stop until they scaled it way back. If you werent playing then, you really can't comment. If you were and you dont remember, think back.
The sun effect in WB is much less now than what it was. It is a minor effect now.
Using the sun effect in the game, while sound really cool and we love to blab about how the real pilots did it, is nowhere near as easy to use in the game. This is because it is much tougher to orient yourself with the sun at your back then it was in real life. It was much easier when you had the real view, not pushing all kinds of buttons. With the sun effect in wb, it was actually pretty rare that someone used it in the attack mode. Some might try to claim they did, but it was still rare that it was actually done. It was most often useful to climb into when you had a con chasing you to try and blind him. Then, all he had to do was change relative position with you and the sun and he could see you anyway.
Sun effect is okay, and I dont really care if it's institued, but at this point, knowing HTC has a very limited development staff, I still would rather see their time invested in adding new aircraft, developing new terrains, fixing bugs, and adding more interesting and exciting features, stuff like the mission planner, terrain editor, etc.
Dago
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If they change the sun can they fix the ground too?
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i agree it would add to the game ...the best example of sun glare working well in a sim is mig alley just as a reference to what i like.
I have never played WB so i cant comment but id like to find out for myself (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Originally posted by SOB:
If we get a thumb command, can we get a finger command too? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Rather than a finger. Could we get an automatic STINGER on bailing to be used on players strafing you in your chute???? (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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(http://www.geocities.com/tas13th/sqsig/mav13.jpg)
No Mercy Asked, None Given, Just pass the ammo
[This message has been edited by Maverick (edited 07-30-2000).]
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Dago
Let me confess right away that I joined wb with the introduction of 2.0 - still followed agw from day one though.But if u say that there were major whining at that point Ill take your word for it ,=)
Cant agree on your views on the sun in current wb though ..
("With the sun effect in wb, it was actually pretty rare that someone used it in the attack mode. Some might try to claim they did, but it was still rare that it was actually done. It was most often useful to climb into when you had a con chasing you to try and blind him. Then, all he had to do was change relative position with you and the sun and he could see you anyway.)
..I used it on a standart basis and so did at least several members of wb jg53.And with some succes if I might add (yadayada).So it could\can be done.
But I guess we agree about the priorities ,=)
danish
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Good to hear some guys used the sun to good effect. It never seemed to work for me the few times I bothered. And to be honest, nobody ever surprised me out of the sun. More often I am surprised because I am watching TV while flying. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Good luck, cya up there,
Dago
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The great target fixator: TV ;=)
danish
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This is because it is much tougher to orient yourself with the sun at your back then it was in real life.
Ahh.. but AH already has, or at least HAD, that one covered (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Anyone remember Version 0.35 beta? How you would look at the ground and see a distinctly lighter circle directly underneath (and downsun) of your aircraft?
Well, if that was reintroduced, you'd merely need to maneuver so that the circle was over your enemy's aircraft. You'd then be directly up-sun from him.
In RL, I believe it's known as the 'halo effect'. Combine the halo effect with realistic sun glare and you've got all the ingredients needed for effective use of the sun in AH.
Oh God I wish they'd model it correctly.
Oh, and Dago. I flew WB from about 0.87 beta. You are greatly exaggerating when you say that many people didn't like the 2.0 sun glare.
Maybe YOU didn't like it, but ....... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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C.O. Phoenix Squadron
http://www.users.bigpond.net.au/phoenix
Aces High Training Corps
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I flew WB's from about 0.99 up thru 2.75, and I too was around during the "Sun Glare Fiasco" (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
I personally don't remember it bothering me too much (but I do think it was overdone IMO), but I remember the great gnashing of teeth and rending of clothing on AGW. I.e. alot of people really squeaked and moaned about it.
I'm with Dago on this one.
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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
"Real Men fly Radials, Nancy Boys fly Spitfires"
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Ugh. I hated the WB 2.0 sun. You couldn't escape it. It was on you like a bad suit. Even thinking back and remembering it is giving me a headache right now! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
Danish, I don't know what rock you were hiding under at the time, but there were many complaints about the intensity of the sun.
I wrote one, and only one, long letter to ICI when they introduced the 2.0 sun. I had it signed by all 25 members of my WB squad. Every person to a man in my squad hated the inescapable blinding of it.
I'm all for realism, but I guess I draw my realism line when I can't even concentrate on flying because I'm wincing from the glare. If there's a way to give the glare of the sun without it completely blinding, I'm all for it.
I'd rather that HTC concentrate on adding more clouds, if your looking for more things to add to immersion.
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What about overcast days, when the sun is not an issue? What about sunglasses? What about the natural ability of one's eyes to move away from the sun even if your plane is pointing right at it?
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Yes...a cloudy day every now and then would be awesome.
I love cloudfights..i had a few in MA and they where the fights i remember the most !!!
More clouds and a brighter sun ...and a Mosquito..then i am a happy Moose (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Moose_EAF322
European Air Force
www.europeanaf.org (http://www.europeanaf.org)
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What about overcast days, when the sun is not an issue? What about sunglasses? What about the natural ability of one's eyes to move away from the sun even if your plane is pointing right at it?
That's my point, Funked. If I remember correctly, there was NO escape from the sun's glare in WB 2.0. It was with you, always.
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just say no (also remembers w.b. sun glare fiasco)
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OK, but don't forget Page 3 <gdrlf>
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Funked hit the right spot with overcast days..
I would love to see a Fog effect,low level cloud but 1/3 the thickness of our clouds now. This would hide the icon while in the fog bank. You would need to fire a few short round & see if it was an enemy. While kill shooter is on,you could hear pings if it was one of your own. Fog effect would be great.
Dog out..........
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Ok ok guys: no need to wack me all down;=) so there were whining and moaning!(but for the life of me, I cant remember it heh).
That dosnt change that the sun we know today in WB is a plus in my book.Only a small center blinds you, but a rather large halo removes your icon.Pretty neat me thinks, and handy too if you bother to use it ;=)
HT did announce it before 1.03 but obviously left it for practical reasons (most likely a time issue I guess).I just hope it havnt been taken completly off the board..
danish
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Hey, heres an idea.
How about randomly changing the sun's brightness to simulate various weather conditions? The sun could be the way it is now to simulate overcast. It could be very bright for clear days and something in between for passing clouds- Until there is enough processing power to have tons of clouds, that is.
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Yep, I would like to see a "working sun"!
Camo
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Camouflage
XO, Lentolaivue 34
www.muodos.fi/LLv34 (http://www.muodos.fi/LLv34)
Brewster into AH!
"The really good pilots use their superior judgement to keep them out of situations
where they might be required to demonstrate their superior skill."
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Hi All,
The problem with the old WB 2.0 sun was in it's implementation. The problem was that anytime your view looked within about 90 degrees of the sun you were totally blinded by it.
In real life you can look fairly close to the sun without being blinded. Unless you look very close to the disk itself the glare is not that bad.
Additionally in the WB 2.0 sun, it was all or nothing. The glare did not increase as your view got closer to centered on the sun and the glared didn't deminish as your point of view moved away from the disk. Once your view came within so many degrees of the disk BANG! complete white out.
I'm sure that HTC can and will do a better job on the sun as soon as they get down that far on the "To do" list. And yes there was a huge outcry on the boards when the 2.0 sun first came out.
Sharky