Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: AndyH on April 25, 2003, 06:35:12 PM
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1) From the London Daily Mirror, Monday April 7th 2003, page 4
A Furious British Helicopter Pilot who came under "friendly fire" from American troops landed yards from them, leapt out and exchanged punches with a US Marine.
The Chinook pilot shouted at him: "When was the last time you saw a f******* Iraqi in a helicopter?"
The pilot and the marine had to be pulled apart as American troops advanced on the north of Baghdad
British military spokesman Group Captain Al Lockwood said: "I'm afraid it would be an RAF kind of thing to do. "These guys are not known for tolerating fools gladly."
2) The following was broadcast live on CNN on the 24th of March .In front of camera is the CNN anchor.
He is joined by three American military experts (one being a retired two-star general from the 'elite' Delta Force) and an ex SAS soldier. Footage on side-screen shows Iraqi soldiers surrendering to coalition troops.
CNN Anchor: "We've no current verification as to whether these are US or British troops the Iraqis are surrendering to.
Yank 1: "They look to be ours - only US troops wear boots like those."
Yank 2: "Indeed, and they appear to have the standard issue camouflage fatigues."
Yank 3 (Delta Force): "I'm not sure - we'll have to get close-up images of them to be 100%. We'll definitely be able to tell from the shape of their Kevlar helmets if they're ours."
Ex SAS: "I'm surprised to learn you're all experts. Since when did US forces carry the SA80 rifle as standard issue? Their DPMs could've been bought, as could their boots and webbing for that matter, so you're chasing rainbows if you can I.D them from their clothes!"
Anchor: "I think you're right."
Ex SAS: "Of course I'm bloody right - anyone with half a brain and basic military training should be able to I.D a British soldier by his rifle unless he's special forces! Not to mention the fact that they're covering all their arcs of fire properly, not shouting "woo yeah!" randomly and haven't raised a flag in direct contravention of their orders!"
At this point one of the Americans pulls his mic off and leaves the floor. The other two look very uncomfortable.......
Anchor: "I think we can safely say that the soldiers on your screen are British.......Now for these messages......."
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...and yet the British managed to win the war despite the American presence.
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The Chinook pilot shouted at him: "When was the last time you saw a f******* Iraqi in a helicopter?"
and when was the last time the Iraqies launched fighters into Patriot batteries range? (tornado incident). :rolleyes:
Some dude joins the army, thinking: "cool man, I'll get medals and everything". He gets some fancy uniform and a shiny new weapon. He's just dying to try it out...
The "overly motivated" are as dangerous as the enemy.
Bozon
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yeah yeah yeah ok, lets not go over the friendly fire crap again.
It's funny, ok? nothin more.
Yanks do have a habit of going "hooyah", us Brits dont. See the funny side and take a pill.
(http://image1ex.villagephotos.com/extern/640697.jpg)
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At one point my friend was serving in a coastal gun battery and commander of their casemate ordered to load charge but forgot to order to load projectile.
When ammo loaders asked if he knows what he is doing he told them to STFU.
Loaders kept their mouth shut and results were stunning: a huge muzzle flash which burnt ground in front of the casemat and started some nasty fires...
Conclusion: even the idiots can serve as officers in the armies... :D
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Originally posted by Swoop
yeah yeah yeah ok, lets not go over the friendly fire crap again.
It's funny, ok? nothin more.
Yanks do have a habit of going "hooyah", us Brits dont. See the funny side and take a pill.
(http://image1ex.villagephotos.com/extern/640697.jpg)
Hey ... I saw the funny side! I met my fair share of idiot PR brass. It didn't threaten me in the least. How can Americans not admire his outspoken and blunt demeanor when they are traits most of us hold so dear? :D
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Not to get off subject, but fellas who ask "do you know what your doing?" or other meaningless questions instead of directly pointing out the problem aggrivate me.
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Originally posted by ra
...and yet the British managed to win the war despite the American presence.
yes , and don't forget the british won WW1 and WW2 in spite of the bumbling americans just getting in the way.
i heard "monty" would have been in berlin 3 weeks after D-day if the americans hadn't slowed him up.
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Are there still some out there that doubt we can do what we set out to do?
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OH, so my 1st post is like yours above it?
:D
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Originally posted by GScholz
Funny how every time the proficiency of US forces are being questioned someone mentions WWI and/or WWII ... wars that were fought more than 60 years ago ... like it has any relevance to the argument.
Funny how Brits consistently insist upon instigating dick measuring contests around this board.
Funny how NONE of the Brits I work with do that.
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Well, maybe this helo pilot flew too close to HMS Cardiff or something, eh?
The Brits are good, agreed.
But so are we. :D
And we just keep getting better.
Doesn't it just burn ya? :D
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Originally posted by GScholz
How many US lives were lost to British action? How many British lives were lost to US action? How many US lives were lost to US action?
Who has a reason to hold a grudge?
How many Brits were there compared to US?
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All in all I'd say it was a VERY successful campaign by both the US and the UK. Many are saying the most successful military campaign of all time.
There will always be those that are envious and anxious to get in their knocks anyhow they can. Kinda pathetic imo.
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Originally posted by GScholz
Oh I think there were plenty more US troops, and still you managed to kill more of them than they did of you..
So, US won the war?
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Which war was it that had no "blue on blue" incidents?
Did you recognize the HMS Cardiff reference?
No comment on professionalism there?
You really are pretty much like the others, I think.
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Originally posted by GScholz
Eh? I was talking about British casualties to US actions.
Oh, ok
I thought it was about hilleriuose anqudotes that accured during the "war", showing that US soilders couldīnt tell who was friend or foe.
And that someone stated that US won the war, alone, both ww I and II
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Originally posted by GScholz
The US haven't fought an equal opponent since Korea!
Yeah.. think about that. Talk amongst yourselves. It'll come to you.
(BTW, we didn't have an equal opponent in Korea, either. The ROE just made it seem that way. Can you say Yalu River bridges?)
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and when was the last time the Iraqies launched fighters into Patriot batteries range? (tornado incident).
Bozon
You seem to lack the basic knowledge that the Patriot system (as I understand it anyway), cannot tell between a low trajectory missle and a fighter aircraft. I also believe there was a lack of communication from the British aircraft to warn of their approach. Either way, I find it deplorable to use the death of brave men as someones little jabbing point, whether they died in battle or accidentally to friendly fire.
How many US lives were lost to British action? How many British lives were lost to US action?
How many Brits were there compared to US?
Excellant point, and one I was going to point out myself.
GScholz seems to be determined to point out a less than well thought out point. Imagine if one German soldier had been there, and killed by friendly fire. The US would then have killed more Germans than the German would have killed US soldiers now wouldn't he? Don't forget, the US bore the brunt of air defense, as of course they bore the brunt of most everything else.
Its time to make this statement for guys like GScholz, as far as I am concerned, with your constantly finding things to put down the US about, you can kiss my ass.
All in all I'd say it was a VERY successful campaign by both the US and the UK. Many are saying the most successful military campaign of all time.
There will always be those that are envious and anxious to get in their knocks anyhow they can. Kinda pathetic imo.
Very well said, I couldnt agree more!
dago
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Originally posted by GScholz
Oh I think there were plenty more US troops, and still you managed to kill more of them than they did of you. My point exactly.
You make no sense. If the US had the LARGE majority of forces, it stands to reason that US forces would be more likely to be involved in friendly fire accidents.
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How does it apply?
Are you saying "blue on blue" is only unprofessional in this war? Or only if it is "US on blue"?
I see you made no comment on "unprofessionalism" by the "professionals".
How does it apply? It applies because there's been "blue on blue" in every major conflict I've ever read about... by every army/nation involved.
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Toad I think you should ask Boroda about this, he will state that it never accured with soviet forces, so, thats not true, not all conflicts/wars
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Originally posted by GScholz
The US haven't fought an equal opponent since Korea! Again this is not the issue here.
LOL!
Does the US have an equal apponent?
By the way, the US could have wiped Korea, China and Russia off the map during the Korean war if we wanted to. Nothing on earth could have stopped us from wiping out Korea, China and Russia combined if we had allowed ourselves.
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Originally posted by NUKE
LOL!
Does the US have an equal apponent?
By the way, the US could have wiped Korea, China and Russia off the map during the Korean war if we wanted to. Nothing on earth could have stopped us from wiping out Korea, China and Russia combined if we had allowed ourselves.
Donīt blow yourself up like that, NUKE, you will end up soiling your pants.
But you are a real comedian, but please, dont quite your daytime job
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Sweden ... a force to be reckoned with. ;)
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Originally posted by crabofix
Donīt blow yourself up like that, NUKE, you will end up soiling your pants.
But you are a real comedian, but please, dont quite your daytime job
Why dont you tell us all who is an equal opponent to the US.
Then explain to us why the US would have not been able to destroy China, North Korea and Russia together during the time of the Korean war.
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Oh, and GScholz... explain the professionalism that cost two of the Queen's Royal Lancers their lives in a Challenger near Basra.
Blue on blue is absolutely tragic. But it happens. And it happens in ALL armies.
But you go right ahead.
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Originally posted by Arlo
Sweden ... a force to be reckoned with. ;)
Finely, someone who gets around and knows about things.
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And some told me I had no future in politics! Bwahahahaha! :D
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Originally posted by GScholz
The soldiers that fought in those wars are now retirered. Comparing for instance the US Army in VN with todays US Army has no merit what so ever. Same goes for the British, but if you insist I think the Royal Navy has yet to shoot down a civilian airliner.
Again how many US casualties were caused by British action in THIS war? I'm not sure, but I don't remember hearing of a single one? Every 2 out of 3 coalition tanks were British, yet I don't remember hearing any of them shooting up M1A1's? I do remeber M1A1's killing a Challenger, and I do remember British soldiers getting killed, and I do remember a Tornado being shot down.
Again, the professionalism of TODAYS armies cannot be determined by wars not fought by THAT army. The only other war that would count in this argument is GW1, since many of the veterans of that war are still in service.
Hey dummy, if there are 5 Brits compared to 1000 US, don't you think the incidents might be scewed based on the numbers?
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Originally posted by NUKE
Why dont you tell us all who is an equal opponent to the US.
Then explain to us why the US would have not been able to destroy China, North Korea and Russia together during the time of the Korean war.
Now, who ever is writing these jokes for you, this one was a little over the edge. You might concider to change him out
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their vehicle was hit by a shell from another British tank (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/2886715.stm)
So, are you now going to diss the Brits?
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Originally posted by crabofix
Now, who ever is writing these jokes for you, this one was a little over the edge. You might concider to change him out
In other words you will not answer the question: 1. who is an equal apponent to the US ?
2. Do you think the US would not have been able to destroy Russia, Korea and China during the Korean war?
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Originally posted by NUKE
In other words you will not answer the question: 1. who is an equal apponent to the US ?
2. Do you think the US would not have been able to destroy Russia, Korea and China during the Korean war?
I wont answer the Question, because you already know it, NUKE.
Theres more then 1 equel opponent, you named 2 of them.
Both china are very big contries, you didnt have the capability to take em both out in one blow, wich would be needed.
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Originally posted by GScholz
I'm not diss'n anyone. This blue-on-blue incident is just as tragical as any of the US incidents.
You don't get the point do you? The US forces have caused a lot more of these incidents than the Brits. In GWII the US had more troops than the UK, and the UK had more armor than the US. Still the US forces caused more blue-on-blue casualties in BOTH troops and armor (and aircraft). Friendly fire is pretty much unavoidable in major conflicts like this one, but IMHO the US forces have been more rekless than the British in GWII.
NUKE, you really need to have your head examined.
you seem to be stupid. If army A has 5 times as many troops as army B, you would expect army A to be repsonsible for more friendly fire incidents than army B.
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Originally posted by crabofix
I wont answer the Question, because you already know it, NUKE.
Theres more then 1 equel opponent, you named 2 of them.
Both china are very big contries, you didnt have the capability to take em both out in one blow, wich would be needed.
Ok. In the Korean war, the US had the capabilty to wipe Russia, China and North Korea off the map with our nuclear and conventional capabilties.
Even now, China TODAY could not even take Taiwan on it's own!
Today, who do you think is an equal power to the US? NOBODY!
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Originally posted by GScholz
You seem to have a problem with arithmetic. Using your exampe, if army A causes 5 FF incidents army B should cause 1, statistically. How many incidents were caused by US and UK troops?
The UK had twice the number of tanks. Now that means that for every US armor FF incident the UK should cause two, statistically. How many were there?
so you are saying that only tanks can kill tanks? How old are you?
Maybe the tanks on the same battlefield might make a point, but how many US tanks were on the same battlefield as UK tanks?
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No, it's you that doesn't get it.
Here's the total FF as of 8 April that involved British troops.
FRIENDLY FIRE INCIDENTS:
March 22: A British Royal Air Force (RAF) Tornado jet is accidentally shot down by a US Patriot missile. The Tornado's two crew are killed.
March 24: Two British soldiers are killed when their tank is mistakenly targeted by another British tank in southern Iraq.
March 28: A British soldier is killed and four others are injured in the region of Basra when a US A-10 ground attack aircraft fires on them.
3 Brits killed in 2 incidents by US forces. 2 Brits killed in one incident by British forces.
Now, the Patriot FF incident investigation AS YET hasn't turned anything up. But Patriot is a highly automated system dependent upon specific IFF procedures. So who knows whose "fault" this on is? I don't, do you?
As to "dissing"... I think I'm not the only one in this thread that feels that you most assuredly are.
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Originally posted by GScholz
I don't know whether to laugh or cry. I'm 29, mentaly I would say you are about 12.
Btw. The Soviets had nuclear capability in 1949, a US/Chinese/Soviet war would not have been winable.
Please, laugh, you soon will realize how great he is, as a comedian, just give him some time.
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What's been established is that in FF events that are not highly automated, where there has been a human eye in the sight and a human finger on the trigger (excluding the Patriot) there have been two FF events that resulted in the deaths of British soldiers.
One by US hand, one by British hand.
So you're entire thesis on British troops dying to US FF is pretty weak.
There have been more FF incidents overall in this war by US hand, obviously.
Some of them are just the result of pure stupidity. One US officer, out of full uniform, just wearing a T-shirt and trousers rushed up to a recently abandoned Iraqi tank and climbed up on the turret. Other troops fired on him from a different location and killed him. That's an FF incident that simply can't be blamed on the guy pulling the trigger.
You like to lump them all together as "avoidable" if the shooter is professional but if you've done what you say you've done and been where you say you've been then you KNOW this stuff happens despite all the safeguards.
Everyone hates blue on blue. But to castigate an entire army as "unprofessional" over BoB is ...... unprofessional.
And I think you know it. Combat decisions are often "monday morning quarterbacked" by the "armchair observers". In reality, most true soldiers know it can happen to anyone in certain circumstances.
But I think I see you for what you are now, so go ahead. :D
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BTW, I think your overall comparison of totals is skewed by the campaign itself.
British troops did not have the same mission as US troops, nor did they operate over as large an area or in as great a number.
So I think it's not "apples to apples" as you apparently would like to paint it.
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incidentally:
okay, I'm a left-wing liberal academic who's still opposed to the war, based on the iraqis he's known. The situation sucked before, and it's gonna suck in the future.
Still, I like to think I've got some understanding of military procedure.
And I've watched _WAY_too much TV.
I have no information either way on the RAF ****hook pilot. BUt I'd think we'd have heard of something before getting it in an email circular.
With respect to the other "CNN" incident. I dunno -- the only military commentators who claimed to be former seals or something like that I've seen were on Fox TV. For special forces, MSNBC stopped at General Dowding, and CNN's front guy was Wesley Clark. Fox has Ollie North and a bunch of special forces grunts. So, no, I have no idea what the second incident is about, and would be surprised if it occurred. The closest CNN gets to that is Larry King, who brings in Andy McNab.
So, yeah, I call bull****. Show me details, then I'll shut up.
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Originally posted by AndyH
Yank 1: "They look to be ours - only US troops wear boots like those."
Yank 2: "Indeed, and they appear to have the standard issue camouflage fatigues."
Yank 3 (Delta Force): "I'm not sure - we'll have to get close-up images of them to be 100%. We'll definitely be able to tell from the shape of their Kevlar helmets if they're ours."
Why aren't these "yanks" speaking american ? When is the last time you heard an american talk like this ? When was the last time you hear US soldiers use terms like "kevlar helmet" or "camoflage fatigues" ? They don't .
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love the way americans get all pissed off if someone makes fun of em! :D
How the hell can you confuse a chinook with an iraqi helicopter? isn't it like the most recogniseable helicopter in the world?
And toad, i dont think anyone was questioning the effectiveness of the US troops in combat vs. the enemy. The point is just they seem a little 'Gung Ho' or Trigger Happy, whereas the british forces seem to think first.
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Originally posted by Furball
love the way americans get all pissed off if someone makes fun of em! :D
How the hell can you confuse a chinook with an iraqi helicopter? isn't it like the most recogniseable helicopter in the world?
And toad, i dont think anyone was questioning the effectiveness of the US troops in combat vs. the enemy. The point is just they seem a little 'Gung Ho' or Trigger Happy, whereas the british forces seem to think first.
That's it! I'm going to have to accidently shoot you now!
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rofl :D
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But then of course no one here knows what the American officer saw or was thinking that caused him to jump out of his vehicle and charge up onto the Iraqi tank without donning a more recognizable uniform. Nor will we ever know.
But go ahead and judge him.
And as to the "shoot first" remark, again I'll point out the difference in missions. One column jumped off from Kuwait and surrounded Basra and pretty much stayed only in that area for the entire war. The two other columns jumped off from Kuwait and drove to Baghdad, passing through various towns under fire until they went right into Baghdad. Then there was the SF/173 Brigade action in the North.
Not exactly apples to apples.
And I'm pretty certain I don't see things your way at all.
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Why are you guys letting GScholz push your buttons?
He's from Norway for God's sake (no offense against Norway, my Grandmother is from there) and is prone to anti-United States sentiments...
Since the war in general went so well (much to his dismay no doubt), he's got to dig elsewhere to bash the U.S.
It's similar to the left-wing news media first stating that our troops are "stalled and regrouping" against the resourceful Iraqi's, then three days later saying we're bullying the poor Iraqi's as we marched into Baghdad.
Take it for what it is gentleman...
I myself love the British humor of our brothers in arms... They are some funny SOB's...
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You guys do realize that much of this war was fought in a quite warm desert by guys much of the time in full chem suits (ever wore one of those things?) with zero visibilty due to high winds causing heavy sand storms. In other words, conditions were less than ideal.
Let's try to keep things in perspective shall we?
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sweden... just like the swiss except that they can't make watches or chocolate.
lazs
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Originally posted by Arlo
Hey ... I saw the funny side! I met my fair share of idiot PR brass. It didn't threaten me in the least. How can Americans not admire his outspoken and blunt demeanor when they are traits most of us hold so dear? :D
i thought it was hilarious, especially the brit chopper pile it.
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Originally posted by GScholz
This thread is IMHO about the lack of professionalism shown by some elements of the US armed forces, resulting in blue-on-blue insidents and loss of British lives.
Well your just obtuse then. The post is about humor at americans expense. The brits have had just as many friendly fire accidents
as american forces, maybe more. I didnt keep score but there were many on both sides.
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Originally posted by GScholz
Again dragging in previous wars, and this one didn't even involve US forces. How does it apply to this discussion? And which "others" are you refering to?
It applied to this discussion because mistakes happen in every war. US doesnt have a corner on the market. Like you are insinuating.
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Originally posted by Furball
love the way americans get all pissed off if someone makes fun of em! :D
How the hell can you confuse a chinook with an iraqi helicopter? isn't it like the most recogniseable helicopter in the world?
And toad, i dont think anyone was questioning the effectiveness of the US troops in combat vs. the enemy. The point is just they seem a little 'Gung Ho' or Trigger Happy, whereas the british forces seem to think first.
Yeah , but the brits were not guilty of being gungho when they killed their buddies in the tank. Its a stupid argument and it carries no water. your stupid for making the comparision.
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Originally posted by X2Lee
Yeah , but the brits were not guilty of being gungho when they killed their buddies in the tank. Its a stupid argument and it carries no water. your stupid for making the comparision.
We know nothing about the circumstances when the challenger was hit. The engagement was probably at night. And im sure telling one tank from another through a thermal sight is much more difficult than identifying an RAF chinook, maybe he confused it with a SCUD.
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Ok That's it, In the next war everyone will have to turn on "Kill Shooter"
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Originally posted by Suave
Why aren't these "yanks" speaking american ? When is the last time you heard an american talk like this ? When was the last time you hear US soldiers use terms like "kevlar helmet" or "camoflage fatigues" ? They don't .
Just thought I had better say that this joke came to me by email, I am not inferring that there is any truth in it.
Never let the truth ruin a good story :-)
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OH ! You broke the Trolls creed and betrayed your own troll !
for shame .
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Originally posted by Furball
We know nothing about the circumstances when the challenger was hit. The engagement was probably at night. And im sure telling one tank from another through a thermal sight is much more difficult than identifying an RAF chinook, maybe he confused it with a SCUD.
and you dont know that the guy yelled HUAH! before he downed the chinook, like I said before its a stupid statement.
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It was/is a war
The U.S. did not target Brits
The Brits did not target the U.S.
Friendly fire incidents happen.
It's sad.
Someone break out that pic that says something about arguing on the internet and being a retard.
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We spend a lot of money to train them to be very dangerous and aggresive.
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Originally posted by X2Lee
and you dont know that the guy yelled HUAH! before he downed the chinook, like I said before its a stupid statement.
Did i say he did?
all i said was :
The point is just they seem a little 'Gung Ho' or Trigger Happy,
Which is the common perception of US forces throughout the world, as this post proves. I didnt mean to start an arguement with anyone, nor upset anyone.
How is that a stupid statement?
and obviously you didnt read the thread properly if you think he downed the chinhook
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Originally posted by Furball
Did i say he did?
all i said was :
Which is the common perception of US forces throughout the world, as this post proves. I didnt mean to start an arguement with anyone, nor upset anyone.
How is that a stupid statement?
and obviously you didnt read the thread properly if you think he downed the chinhook
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Ok pardon. I still thought the bad bellybutton brit chopper pile its was funny :D
Ya gotta picture dowding jumping on a burly marine to get it I guess...
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Originally posted by X2Lee
Ya gotta picture dowding jumping on a burly marine to get it I guess...
Dowding would be jumping on him for all the wrong reasons tho :D
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actually, my favorite incident was the US plane that destroyed a Patriot radar with HARM missile.
either he was revenging his tornado buddies or he just had no clue where the front is. Firing at a SAM on the opposite direction of the front and the patriot is not located even close to the front line... I guess they had a good laugh at his expense in his squadron :D
the best thing is no one was injured.
Bozon
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I am a little sick of GScholz sitting on his ass, the brave little armchair warrior deciding he is some ultimate authority qualified to judge soldiers actions in a war zone.
Has he ever faced an enemy in combat? Has he ever been shot at with automatic weapons, ever been shelled by artillery or motars? Has the self-appointed GScholz ever spent a night in a hole knowing there is an enemy out there somewhere who wants to kill him, ever wondered if he would actually see the dawn? How many times has GScholz had to rapidly put on a chemical suit and gas mask when the sound of incoming rounds was sounded?
Tell me Mr GScholz, Judge of all he has not done, how many of your close friends have you held while they died in your arms as a result of enemy gunfire? What are your memories of the smell and sights and sounds of death in combat? What was it like to leave behind your home and family to board an aircraft or ship to a land you knew nothing about, other than there were persons there who wanted to kill you?
Tell me of the fear, the sadness, the pure terror one must feel when under attack. Tell me of the cries of the wounded and dieing, tell me of the blood on your clothes as a result of tending to your best friends wounds.
If and when you can tell me about these things from a first hand point of view, I will more easily accept that you should be allowed an opinion about the actions of soldiers in a war. Then maybe I will not feel you are less than a despicable piece of cowcrap for berating or judging those whos shoes you cannot begin to fill.
Until then, I strongly suggest you keep your mouth closed, and your fingers off the keyboard and stick to your little simulator games.
Dago
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lol Dago.
good monolog, slightly over dramatic, but just good enough to go in some holywood movie.
you dont need to cary injured friends and get shot to recognize a stupid act.
yes, people here are armchair warriors, but a few do have some common sense. And soldiers have common sense as well (at least most of them)
Bozon
edit:
btw, war is a lot less of a holywood movie and much more of "catch 22".
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Now cool off a tad my dear Americans. GScholz may be burning your pride a bit, but I think he is correct, and there is no use getting personal and offensive about this.
The US army has been known for trigger-happiness since WW2, and that "cowboy" reputation will take a long time to shake off.
My great uncle flew in WW2, he got fired at and bombed by the US, and also observed that they would even keep their fire button unlocked during landing!! A common knowledge at the time was to be careful around the Americans, for they often fired before establishing a proper ID. Happens in war, anyway.
Aside from this point, I am sensing some arrogance towards the British, as if they had merely been in GWII as a sideshow. Now that is nothing but a naive attempt to an insult, - the British were there at the US side, mounting a considerable force on ground and air (and 2/3 of the armour), and getting into heavy engagements many times with very acceptable results.
Just face it, there were friendly fire incidents in which the US were mostly responsible, that's it, it happened and is to be learned from for improvement rather than defending it's credibility to the bloody end.
Finally, I belive GScholz is a veteran soldier, not just the armchair version :D
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Slightly dramatic, yes, intentionally.
I am just sick and tired of armchair quarterbacking, judging others who are in tense situations they havent experienced themselves.
My apologies if you have fought in some terrible war GScholz. Feel free to share with me about the engagements you participated in please share, so I can learn and be better informed, how many Norwegians were killed in those battles. I have tremendous respect for soldiers who fight for their countries.
With all that went on in Iraq, the actual total of friendly fire incidents from all I have read and heard about is actually extremely low. Extremely low. I find it deplorable that someone could sit in the comfort of their home and sterotype the whole of an armed force engaged in battle by two or three incidents. Considering the amount of territory covered and held, the amount of troops involved, I rather think this extremely low rate of friendly fire is a testament to their training and professionalism rather than an indictment of the soldiers.
I am, as you can tell, sick and tired of pathetic little turds who use this board as a way to insult and berate the US, it's people and it's armed forces for any reason, real or imagined that they can come up with.
I guess many do this out of envy, but it gets old. Maybe someday when these peoples countries matter again in the world arena, they can stop attempting to berate others.
dago
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I knew dudes who had the misfortune of being deployed to Bosnia. It was a big deal because they made US soldiers wear blue helmets and some soldiers were punished because they refused . My friends didn't see any combat but they said when shells would land in camp or a sniper would shoot the first things they did was throw that damn blue helmet as far as they could .