Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: lazs2 on May 08, 2003, 10:02:56 AM
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but now they gotta go after my cars too.. New bill is being introduced to get rid of the old bill that allowed cars 30 years or older to be exempt from Californias draconian smog laws.. The democrats want to force older cars, many of which no longer even have original smog equipment availabel, to comply...
This will bring back the 'good ol days' of early smog control devices in American cars when none of em would produce more than 150 horsepower for 450 cubic inces and nothing over 250 cubic inches would get more than 10 mpg. All this to negate what most say is less smog than is made by your lawnmower or weed eater...
friggin busybody democrats..
lazs
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Solution: Forced Induction.
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No worries Lazs, in a world that gets over 100 HP out of 1 litre, welcome to the 21st century :)
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The Democrat tort lawyers are also re-starting the fast food lawsuits. If they have their way we'll all end up thin with clean lungs. That's all they really want, isn't it? :rolleyes:
ra
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they make you use the gas with the ethanol in it? here in WISCONSIN our "smog" is tooooo bad that we have to use this engine destroying fuel injector rotting CRAP to "clean the air" not to mention EPA openly STATES that cars made after 1994 have enough emmision controls in that there is ZERO effect from the new gas. nevermind you get 4-6 mpg less so you actually are putting MORE fumes in the air.
never mind that the corn growers lobby has their hand on the D**** of the dem's in our area. "the poor farmers will go bankrupt if they have nowhere to sell their corn so we have to use the ethanol somewhere". thats just great wreck my car so some hick-asre farmer can get new teeth (or should i say tooth) for his wife. FU EPA and dem's thinking MY car has ANYTHING to do with the environment. what about the millions or OTR trucks on the roads? what about the 1/16 MPG a ship on the ocean gets? hmmmm no answer?? thought so u arses. ARRRRRGH this is my second most hate inducing topic. wanna know the first>>? :mad:
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OTOH - Anyone who has been in California for more than 30 years can attest to the significant improvement in our air quality. I can actually SEE the mountains during the summer now. I rarely have the burning eyes or shortness of breath that was common in the 60's and 70's.
Lets see... Old cars or Clean Air?
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Originally posted by midnight Target
OTOH - Anyone who has been in California for more than 30 years can attest to the significant improvement in our air quality. I can actually SEE the mountains during the summer now. I rarely have the burning eyes or shortness of breath that was common in the 60's and 70's.
Lets see... Old cars or Clean Air?
Definately old cars...if someone wants clean air, they can move to a part of Cali that doesn't have a convergence zone with a mountain on one side, and an ocean on the other that acts like a filter trap. ;)
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No grandfather clause for it? We had a similar law (25 years) for exemption, but repealed it with a grandfather clause. Basically, any car 1974 or older (prior to unleaded gasoline laws) was exempt. If you guys are 30 year... looks like you'll be coming up on the same timeline soon.
If they have the grandfather clause in it, you should be OK. If not, see if you can move to Southern Oregon;)
MiniD
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Originally posted by lazs2
but now they gotta go after my cars too.. New bill is being introduced to get rid of the old bill that allowed cars 30 years or older to be exempt from Californias draconian smog laws.. The democrats want to force older cars, many of which no longer even have original smog equipment availabel, to comply...
This will bring back the 'good ol days' of early smog control devices in American cars when none of em would produce more than 150 horsepower for 450 cubic inces and nothing over 250 cubic inches would get more than 10 mpg. All this to negate what most say is less smog than is made by your lawnmower or weed eater...
friggin busybody democrats..
lazs
if the worst case comes about and the bill makes it is registering the cars under a po box in nevada doable?
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Originally posted by midnight Target
OTOH - Anyone who has been in California for more than 30 years can attest to the significant improvement in our air quality. I can actually SEE the mountains during the summer now. I rarely have the burning eyes or shortness of breath that was common in the 60's and 70's.
Lets see... Old cars or Clean Air?
it would be interesting to see how many running cars in california are thirty years old or older. im trying to remember the last time i saw a car that old on the freeway and i cant recall right now when that was.
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CARB can kiss my ass. ****ing communists.
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Originally posted by Mini D
No grandfather clause for it'
MiniD
New bill is being introduced to get rid of the old bill that allowed cars 30 years or older to be exempt from Californias draconian smog laws
By the sounds of it, they may be trying to get rid of the grandfather clause.
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several studies have been done on older cars and their effect on pollution... most are pretty clean. Plus... studies show that the milage that older cars travel a year is miniscule.....
older cars actually produce less smog with the old smog devices disabled. they were so badly deigned and fragile that the car was putting out more pollutin than if it had no devices.
this is a "feel good" law .. If you banned weedeaters you would get rid of ten times the smog these 30 year old cars produce a year but.... you would piss off a lot more people (voters)... It is a do nothing law designed to make politicians look like they "care".
rip... I can produce 100 hp per liter with a 50 year old engine design easily.
Huffers won't exempt you.
I doubt this law will pass... there is a pretty strong classic and aftermarket industry these days.
lazs
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Originally posted by anonymous
it would be interesting to see how many running cars in california are thirty years old or older. im trying to remember the last time i saw a car that old on the freeway and i cant recall right now when that was.
And to top it off, 600,000 people per year emigrate to California.
What the hell do we know...
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
New bill is being introduced to get rid of the old bill that allowed cars 30 years or older to be exempt from Californias draconian smog laws
By the sounds of it, they may be trying to get rid of the grandfather clause.
Ummm... no... by getting rid of the rolling 30 year exemption, they can be doing one of two things...
1) ensuring no more cars fall under it
2) lifting the exemption for all cars already exempted.
It hasn't really been clarified just what is being done by those down there. So, if you don't mind, keep out if it unless you actually know what's going on.
MiniD
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How about you embrace the socialism, donate your cars to the foundation of the month, declare yourself gay, buy a bicycle with a basket on the front, drink Chardonnay and just be happy there is somebody smarter than you telling what to do.
Cars kill more people than guns, word up and represent.
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Wow... imagine that...
http://www.pointhappy.com/cvcars/govt.htm
Replacing the rolling exemption with a static one (1974 and earlier). Nah... I don't know what I'm talking about. Experience means nothing. Rip knows everything.
MiniD
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Originally posted by Ripsnort
Definately old cars...if someone wants clean air, they can move to a part of Cali that doesn't have a convergence zone with a mountain on one side, and an ocean on the other that acts like a filter trap. ;)
Or we could continue to clean up our act... duh.
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deja... yes.. it appears that they want a static one but... the cars from say 74 to 84 are the ones with the worst and most useless and trouble prone smog devices. cars produce less smog over their lifespan (better milage, no failures) without said devices than with... not being able to obtain the worhtless devices anymore will mean that these cars won't be able to be driven.
thing is... 30 year old cars on the road are a rarity... everyone has a lawnmower or weedeater or blower... those things mke many times more smog than 30 year old cars... the dems aren't going after improving the air... it is more "feel good" legeslation.
Take a long trip and count the number of cars you see in a couple of days that are 30 years or older.
The air has gotten better for a number of reasons... the car part is.... the smog devices have gotten infinitly better. No leaded gas...The old smog devices don't work. with the exception of PCV valves and catalytic converters... I even have a PCV valve on my 69 helps evacuate the crankcase... got no problem with requireing that cars that came with catalytic converters keep em. The fuel is all unleaded now anyway.
lazs
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75 is the majic year though Lazs. Its why I saw the "30 year" comment and instantly did the math. Its just the basic "smog devices weren't necessarily available prior to this date... so we'll make an exception... but after this date they were." kind of thought.
Its too bad, because there are a few cars from that era I wouldn't mind hot-rodding.
I do believe we may see some kind of step function eventually on the exemption dates. I just don't believe they are going to allow the rolling dates back into the loop.
MiniD
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exactly... those cars aren't really a problem and... there are some worth saving. Heck... any way yu look at it you will allways get a lot of attention if you drive a 30 year old car because they are so rare. A 76 grand prix will run cleaner (over 50,000 miles)without it's antique smog devices (except said PCV and catalytic converters, both readily available).
lazs
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They should classify cars like that the same as 2 stroke dirt bikes..."Recreational Vehicles Exempt"
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that is basicly what the old law did... they recognized that these old cars are rare and rarely driven... And, while weedeaters and lwnblowers are annoying as hell(and a far worse pollution problem than a few old cars)..... a 30 year old or older car usually puts a smile on the face of all who see em.... for some, they are nostalgic... for others, history... still more look at them as art..... In any case... they are fun to drive and work on and see on the road.
they are a break from all the eyestrain of melted plastic looking generic sedans and suvs/station wagons killing our sensibilities with their sameness. "why didn't you wave at me the other day?" "I don't know.. what were u in?" The white toyota/bmw/honda/kia." "gee.... don't know how I coulda missed seeing you."
lazs
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Lazs, I've never loved you more than I love you right now.
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well..... uh... like I tell my girlfriend.... I'm very fond of you too.
lazs