Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Syzygyone on May 09, 2003, 08:33:40 AM
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This is from the May 9 NYT:
As the team and members of the Iraqi National Congress arrived at the Mukhabarat [Iraq secret police] headquarters, soldiers found a well-dressed, physically fit young man with a neatly clipped beard and mustache moving into the building.
Team members said he was carrying false identification papers and a telephone directory with numbers from Arab countries including Yemen. One member of MET Alpha, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said he seemed to be well versed in counterinterrogation techniques. The man, whom the military did not publicly identify, was turned over to military authorities for questioning.
the team's intelligence analysts found a section of a manual about ways in which the Bush administration's Department of Homeland Security planned to defend Americans against unconventional attacks. The phone number on the cover sheet and pages indicated that the material had been faxed from Iraq's United Nations office in New York.
Hmmmmmm.......:)
Oh, and almost all of that stuff that was "looted" from their national museum, wasn't. It was put in safe storage!
I know I know, Dowd and Blix and some of y'all still want to see those WMD sites. Well, I'll bet they'll be unearthed soon.
Cya Up!
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Irak was not a threat American to just plane redikulousness.
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It's too late to explain now.
Shoot first, find reasons later.. US policy of today.
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Originally posted by Syzygyone
Oh, and almost all of that stuff that was "looted" from their national museum, wasn't. It was put in safe storage!
realy ?
(it's a candid question I'm so busy currently I've not time to keep up with news)
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http://www.snickerplanet.com/humor_saddam_bomb.swf
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Originally posted by Siaf__csf
It's too late to explain now.
Shoot first, find reasons later.. US policy of today.
EDIT: Shoot when reasons are established, give reasons to "friends" later.
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Originally posted by Siaf__csf
It's too late to explain now.
Shoot first, find reasons later.. US policy of today.
Thats policy is only if the person in question is FRENCH
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Originally posted by straffo
realy ?
(it's a candid question I'm so busy currently I've not time to keep up with news)
Yep:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,86262,00.html
I suspect that what is still misisng will also be found.
:D
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Originally posted by Siaf__csf
It's too late to explain now.
Shoot first, find reasons later.. US policy of today.
You see how the USA hating saddam lovers are allready positiong themselves to disregard any evidence of terror support found in iraq. Mind you they have allready stated that any WMD found in iraq will be planted by the CIA...
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Thats policy is only if the person in question is FRENCH
And then who cares if there is a reason? :)
You see how the USA hating saddam lovers are allready positiong themselves to disregard any evidence of
Next they will say the Iraqis didn't even have any guns, all those firearms were planted by the CIA.
How ironic the French being in the UN, since they are probably the most guilty of violating UN resolutions regarding sale of banned items to Iraq.
Buy American!
dago
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Originally posted by Syzygyone
the team's intelligence analysts found a section of a manual about ways in which the Bush administration's Department of Homeland Security planned to defend Americans against unconventional attacks. The phone number on the cover sheet and pages indicated that the material had been faxed from Iraq's United Nations office in New York.
Hmmmmmm.......:)
DHS has a plan? Hmmm... I thought it was just a black hole that we throw tax dollars into.
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Originally posted by Sandman_SBM
DHS has a plan? Hmmm... I thought it was just a black hole that we throw tax dollars into.
Hope this means you are for smaller government...
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DHS has a plan? Hmmm... I thought it was just a black hole that we throw tax dollars into.
Yeah, you know.... yellow alert, orange alert, red alert.
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France's policy: reason, reason, reason, reason, reason, surrender.
I don't think any French person should be criticizing any other country's policies.
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The alert thing is funny... it'll never be "green" because then we won't need a DHS and if it goes to "red" without an actual attack, that would mean the DHS is ineffective... so it will always be "blue," "yellow," or "orange".
What a gig... I tell ya... in government there is no job security like security.
Oh... and yeah... absolutely, I'm all for smaller government.
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:D
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Originally posted by Dago
And then who cares if there is a reason? :)
Next they will say the Iraqis didn't even have any guns, all those firearms were planted by the CIA.
How ironic the French being in the UN, since they are probably the most guilty of violating UN resolutions regarding sale of banned items to Iraq.
Buy American!
dago
J'ai cru voir un trou du cul ?
Je me trompe ?
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Originally posted by straffo
J'ai cru voir un trou du cul ?
Je me trompe ?
Hey straffo please pick up an english dictionary on your way to McDonalds... :p :D
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Oops my bad ....
// begin sarcasm
because I spend all day long with those surrending stinking cheese eater french monkey from time to time I forgot to post in the right (US made) language :D
// end sarcasm
// translated version of my previous post follow :
(calimero reference not translatable ...)
Did I seen an ass-hole ?
Or I'm mistaken ?
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I knew you loved America! :)
BTW straffo still no second e-mail dude.. :(
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Actually it's not astonihing (etonnant) fisrt because I didn't got the time to rewrote it and seconde becasue I'm a bit drunk currently so I'm heading to my bde and I won't rewrite it today :p
Polish Vodka rulezzzzzzzz !
Took me 5 hour to kill the bottle but now seh's death !
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Originally posted by Siaf__csf
It's too late to explain now.
Shoot first, find reasons later.. US policy of today.
Whatever.
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Actualy Gray Goose vodka from France rules..
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Grey Goose is good... Crater Lake is better.
MiniD
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Chopin from Poland. The second best thing to ever happen to the potato. (The best is chili-cheese tatar-tots from Sonic)
:D
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J'ai cru voir un trou du cul ?
Je me trompe ?
Est-ce qu'il, Chirac à la télévision ou vous dépend était regardent-ils dans de miroir?
Straffo, I understand, if you are French, you will not find humor in my posts, and I don't blame you.
Some of what I say is tongue-in-cheek, but some does reflect the true feelings of many of my countrymen with your government. It is a very rare government that has not made mistakes, sometimes very bad mistakes when viewed in retrospect. But I happen to think Chirac and some French companies acted with extremely poor judgement in regards to Iraq. It was no secret that the Hussein regime was a brutal regime, guilty of mass murder of it's own citizens. Greed cannot be excused when it turns a blind eye to human suffering.
dago
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Dago if you use more smilies in your post I'll find it amusing too because I'll understood ,in fact the very same post wrote by FunkedUp ,SOB or GRUNHERZ will make me laught.
But not knowing you I'll have an hard time decoding it and so I'll jump on the easy conclusion : the poster is yetanotherfrenchbasher ...
Not that I'm always agreeing with (or proud of) my governement but like any citizen of any country I'm very defensive when I face an agression (or something I interpret as an agression).
I hope you understand me ,I can wrote a more complete post but it will have to be wrote in french to preseve all the subtilities.
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Originally posted by Syzygyone
This is from the May 9 NYT:
As the team and members of the Iraqi National Congress arrived at the Mukhabarat [Iraq secret police] headquarters, soldiers found a well-dressed, physically fit young man with a neatly clipped beard and mustache moving into the building.
Team members said he was carrying false identification papers and a telephone directory with numbers from Arab countries including Yemen. One member of MET Alpha, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said he seemed to be well versed in counterinterrogation techniques. The man, whom the military did not publicly identify, was turned over to military authorities for questioning.
the team's intelligence analysts found a section of a manual about ways in which the Bush administration's Department of Homeland Security planned to defend Americans against unconventional attacks. The phone number on the cover sheet and pages indicated that the material had been faxed from Iraq's United Nations office in New York.
Hmmmmmm.......:)
Oh, and almost all of that stuff that was "looted" from their national museum, wasn't. It was put in safe storage!
I know I know, Dowd and Blix and some of y'all still want to see those WMD sites. Well, I'll bet they'll be unearthed soon.
Cya Up!
Ahhhhhhhhhh, MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMHHHHHH, another guy to torture. Lovely :D
I would love to see those bad countries which plan to invade the US just being nuked :D
Regards Blitz
btw Did the bad guys in the white house already found these huge iraq wmd ressourses or they just want us to forget about the main reason they presented us for their aggression war ?
Iraq was in no way a threat to the USA, it was just plain ridiculous
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Originally posted by blitz
btw Did the bad guys in the white house already found these huge iraq wmd ressourses or they just want us to forget about the main reason they presented us for their aggression war ?
Iraq was in no way a threat to the USA, it was just plain ridiculous
Why is it the very same people who advocated giving Hans Blix another six months to find WMD, think that the occupation forces should have found them in just a few weeks?
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
Why is it the very same people who advocated giving Hans Blix another six months to find WMD, think that the occupation forces should have found them in just a few weeks?
Turn the same question around... The administration believed Blix was taking too long to determine the location of the WMD because US intel was so reliable... and then it turns out that apparently this intel isn't so accurate, they whine about needing more time. The position Bush took was one of, "We know where it is and we're waiting for Hussein to admit it."
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I recall the issue was one of non cooperation with Blix. I recall the argument was that if Iraq were to show inspectors evidence of it's compliance, the whole thing could have been done quickly.
Sort of like me, as an honest taxpayer, proving to the IRS that I payed my taxes correctly. It may be a pain, but logistically it is easy to do if one wants to do it.
If I were a cheat and I actively attempted to hide, mislead, lie, and obfuscate, it would take more time and effort on the IRS's part to show I was a cheat.
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Key difference is Bush wanted proof of the non-existence of WMD.
Flaw in the logic there.
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No, we (not just GWB) wanted proof of complaince. (don't forget the UN wanted it too.)
Show a credible paper trail of the weapons program, and destruction of chemical and biological weapons that were documented to exist by the UN, and it would have been easy to avert the destruction of his government.
Using my IRS analogy, the auditor says "show me the receipts for these business expenses." And then I show him. A credible paper trail is shown, and I stay out of trouble.
The argument is about how much time it takes to willingly cooperate.
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That's all nice and all... but Bush didn't choose to invade because Hussein was non-compliant. Bush decided to invade because Hussein was "a clear and immediate danger" or words to that effect.
Of course... that was before our army spent just 26 days waltzing across their country.
Some threat they turned out to be.
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My point is,...... if Iraq had been compliant within a few months after the first Gulf war, no wind in the sails of GWB.
Iraq would have been able to sell oil freely instead of UN mandated Oil-for-Food. No 12 years of hardship for the citizens of Iraq, no 1000 kids a week dying due to SH reactions to UN sanctions.
I wonder if Saddam ever made a good policy decision.
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Guess he wasn't planning on an illegal invasion...
He erred.
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Originally posted by Holden McGroin
I wonder if Saddam ever made a good policy decision.
Ask the USA hating leftists, he was the best leader for Iraq! If only that tryrant Bush and his evil father before him hadn't been so mean - it was all, naturally, America's fault.... :rolleyes:
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Sheeesh... enough of the "WMD" rhetoric.
Here's a synopsis for those who don't get it:- Saddam Hussein led Iraq invades a sovereign nation.
- Coallition forces push his forces back into Iraq.
- Saddam continues to spout off about the great satan.
- Saddam ran Iraqi government offers rewards to suicide bombers in pallestine
- Suicide "bombers" fly two jets into the world trade center and one into the Pentagon
- Talliban officials dance in celebration
- Iraq officials dance in celebration
- Talliban destroyed
- Iraq government destroyed
- U.S. asks if anyone else wants to dance in celebration of 9/11
Anyone that is playing the "prove it" game with Saddam and state sponsored terrorism is being quite simply ignorant. The French have been hiding behind "prove it" for some time, the Russians just choose to because a) they don't feel anyone cared when state sponsered soldiers were in Chechnia and b) they want oil money.
The rest is just a facade to appease the "court of world oppinion". Everyone knows why we went in... and they just wanted a plausable excuse... not necessarily a good one.
MiniD
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MiniD I feel your simplistic, black and white interpretation of 9/11 as a "bad" thing will offend many of the sensitive and nuanced "USA is always evil" crowd - care to rephrase your brutish thoughts in a more genteel manner? :D
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Saddam ran Iraqi government offers rewards to suicide bombers in pallestine
followed by...
Suicide "bombers" fly two jets into the world trade center and one into the Pentagon
You're really trying to link these two things into some kind of cause and effect? I dunno man... That's a hell of a leap, even leaving out the fact that this reward stuff happened in March of last year, well after the WTC attack.
Mark me down as one of the people "that still don't get it."
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No need to mark anyone down for anything. Its readily apparent that some will choose not to get it.
Truth is, the only argument against is "Yeah... we know he may have had something to do with it, but PROVE it."
Nah... we don't need to. We know. You know. They know.
but... but... war is bad. And any excuse people can come up with to "prove" that war is bad is equally as rediculous.
America has a wide spread reputation as a paper tiger. We roll over whenever there is an act of agression against us because the polititians are too afraid of protesters. Sorry, but those days are gone. And those protestors that are now being ignored are the most pissed off of all.
I'll also laugh at anyone that even remotely tries to link 9/11 to the U.S. government and then turns around and criticizes the U.S. for any involvement in Iraq. Seems to be alot of that type of behavior going around these days. I mean... I doubt there's really a double standard or simply a desire to post contrary to what others are posting simply to be anti. Funny thing is... those doing it don't really see themselves as puppets. Thinking contrary to the masses is still letting the masses determine your train of thought.
MiniD
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I'm not really sure what you're getting at with the last paragraph. I think you're saying that you doubt that people are posting contrary replies just for the sake of being contrary or 'anti-'... and if so, I totally agree with you. Sure, there is the exception - on both sides. But what I see most often are people's positions dismissed simply because they're perceived to be 'anti' for no other reason than to be... well... anti. As if one couldn't possibly hold a substantive opposing view and actually mean it. There used to be regular healthy debate here. Now we quickly categorize the posts according to a perceived motive and file them away with the appropriate dismissive (or sarcastic) remark.
Heh... the days of 'political correctness' have got nothin' on what we're into these days. I don't know what you'd call it and I don't even know what it is, but I've got a feeling that in the years ahead when people look back to this time, the actual wars will be overshadowed by something else...
Now, as far as the first part of your post... the actual uh, points... When you start off by saying that unless I happen to agree with you "I choose not to get it"...
Why bother?
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I don't know nash.. why bother?
It really is as simple as I've listed above. You have to actually chose not to believe it based on... um... lack of sufficient evidence?
In leu of 9/11, the U.S. government sat down and decided what actually made someone a threat to the United States. Do you really believe that Saddam Hussein did not fit into virtually every category they came up with?
Man.. I can't fricking believe people are actually playing this stupid. Well... except for blitz.
MiniD
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Blitz like a few others ..very small few are still really morons..
Let them live in France..
DIE DIRBAGS DIE...(In virtual skies..DIEEEEE)
Love
BiGB
xoxo
( I think if these people think USA is so Wrong...go protest next to that bulldozer over there)
:D
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"It really is as simple as I've listed above. You have to actually chose not to believe it based on... um... lack of sufficient evidence?"
I don't think so.
Besides faith, there are a couple of ways you can come to believe in something. One way is to witness something or have something demonstrated to you. In that case there's no choosing to believe - what is, is what is (depending on your definition of is :D ). Another is having someone tell you something. In that case you must make a choice to believe it (based on the likelihood, the credibility of the source, etc.).
When you apply the above to your list and Iraq's involvement in the WTC attack, the only people making choices here are the people who want to believe that this connection exists. Some people have asked you to believe it and you chose to do so. Me? I'll believe it when I see it.
It's funny to me that we're constantly given these scraps of information... such as Hussein paying Palestinian suicide bombers... and finally that we must be going out of our way if we don't believe in Iraq's involvement. Nevermind that the hyjackers weren't Palestinian suicide bombers. Nevermind that Hussein rolled this thing out some 8 months after the WTC attack. To be frank, I think I'm being quite charitable with you over this Iraq/WTC business.
It's always the same thing though... Like I'm supposed to ignore the peices that don't fit and make these huge leaps of faith in the construction of a theory (because ladies and gentlemen, at this point that is all it is), or else I'm just being... anti-.... a pain in the arse... *choosing* not to believe. Deth to Amreeka.
You seem to be saying that in the Deja world of jurisprudence one needs only to come up with a theory, bolster it with unrelated events, and call it fact until proven otherwise; as the burden of proof now lies with those who'd dare not accept the charges outright. Futher, to not accept the charges is to be playing dumb. Not a whole lot of wiggle room, is there?
All that being said, why in the world would I or anyone actually go out of my way not to believe something? It doesn't make sense to me. If somethings there, if it's real - show me, I'll believe.... Why wouldn't I?
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Originally posted by Mini D
Sheeesh... enough of the "WMD" rhetoric.
Here's a synopsis for those who don't get it:- Saddam Hussein led Iraq invades a sovereign nation.
- Coallition forces push his forces back into Iraq.
- Saddam continues to spout off about the great satan.
- Saddam ran Iraqi government offers rewards to suicide bombers in pallestine
- Suicide "bombers" fly two jets into the world trade center and one into the Pentagon
- Talliban officials dance in celebration
- Iraq officials dance in celebration
- Talliban destroyed
- Iraq government destroyed
- U.S. asks if anyone else wants to dance in celebration of 9/11
Anyone that is playing the "prove it" game with Saddam and state sponsored terrorism is being quite simply ignorant. The French have been hiding behind "prove it" for some time, the Russians just choose to because a) they don't feel anyone cared when state sponsered soldiers were in Chechnia and b) they want oil money.
The rest is just a facade to appease the "court of world oppinion". Everyone knows why we went in... and they just wanted a plausable excuse... not necessarily a good one.
MiniD [/B]
Sure everybody knows why Iraq was attacked.
After cold war has been won and the USA was the last remaining superpower it's evil government decided that it was about time to change the world to the benefit of the USA.
First they tried to abuse the UN and Nato to hide behind them but as soon as they faced all that resistance they dropped their mask and did what they wanted: Capture Iraq, got new statetic bases and put their hand on Iraqs oil. They didn't care about
International law as they knew they have the biggest WMDs and the biggest economy to blackmail every country that dares to show some resist.
Regards Blitz
Wanted, dead or alive : The BTO = Bush Terrorist Organization :D
Iraq was in no way a threat to the USA, it was just plain ridiculous
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Thanks Bliz, Could´nt have said it better myself
:D
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Originally posted by blitz
After cold war has been won and the USA was the last remaining superpower it's evil government decided that it was about time to change the world to the benefit of the USA.
And the lefties wonder why some from the US on this board are encouraged to bash other countries. With loonies like blitz and crab it's just too hard to resist.
Of course I realize that these guys are likely on the lunatic fringe and not representative of the average person in their countries. Still, anti-American sentiment is pretty high in their countries and it's hard not to equate that with the rantings on this bb.
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Originally posted by AKIron
Of course I realize that these guys are likely on the lunatic fringe and not representative of the average person in their countries.
You are wrong, I am representing the average persons feelings and opinion in my country, concerning the Iraq.
I think the opinion would change a little, if some proofs where shown to us that Iraq really did posses WMDs and that Your countrymen, having total control, should have found them by now.
It just goes to prove that My country man, Hans Blix, should have been given a little more time.
Now, getting rid of Saddam was a good thing, though, not a valid reason.
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Originally posted by crabofix
Now, getting rid of Saddam was a good thing, though, not a valid reason.
Truer words of the impotent have never been spoken - when you cant do you criticize and attack those who can..... :)
Face it buddy (old)Europe is weak - weaker than chit... :p
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Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Truer words of the impotent have never been spoken - when you cant do you criticize and attack those who can..... :)
Face it buddy (old)Europe is weak - weaker than chit... :p
Sure it is, doesn't make any difference to the point that BTO acted like mad dogs, though :D
Regards Blitz
Iraq was in no way a threat to the USA, it was just plain ridiculous- all the time
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Phuiii, smells like Fart, or something Brownish in here, phuii
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Face it buddy (old)Europe is weak - weaker than chit...
Says an German man.... Hey lets all move to the US and then when we are there lets bash the **** out of Europe!!!
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Im not german... I just play one in AH. ;)
BTW Thats a parody of an old US TV commerical about a man who plays a doctor on a TV drama and appears in a medicine ad. :D
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Originally posted by Mini D
:- Saddam Hussein led Iraq invades a sovereign nation.
- Coallition forces push his forces back into Iraq.
- Saddam continues to spout off about the great satan.
- Saddam ran Iraqi government offers rewards to suicide bombers in pallestine
- Suicide "bombers" fly two jets into the world trade center and one into the Pentagon
- Talliban officials dance in celebration
- Iraq officials dance in celebration
- Talliban destroyed
- Iraq government destroyed
- U.S. asks if anyone else wants to dance in celebration of 9/11
Anyone that is playing the "prove it" game with Saddam and state sponsored terrorism is being quite simply ignorant. The French have been hiding behind "prove it" for some time, the Russians just choose to because a) they don't feel anyone cared when state sponsered soldiers were in Chechnia and b) they want oil money.
The rest is just a facade to appease the "court of world oppinion". Everyone knows why we went in... and they just wanted a plausable excuse... not necessarily a good one.
MiniD [/B]
1- yes
2- very good...ya had international help.
3- Bush squeakes about EVIL(same as the great satan)
4- most arab nations love em for that...go figure
5- they where from Saudi Arabia...there crazy ideology was learnt in Saudi Arabia.....there training WAS PROBABLY in iraq....assumption...nothing to do with iraq
6- most of the arab world did.....Taliban has nothing to do with iraqis invasion....assumption again.
most of the world saw you invading a soveriegn nation because you wanted its natural resources.....we all knew Saddam was a basket case.....but not enough for you to INVADE, says the world.
but who cares what the world thinks......
shot first ask questions later.....