Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: funkedup on June 02, 2003, 05:02:39 PM
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OK Rip posted some car nerd stuff so I have to match him.
I was waiting for my OEM Bridgestone family sedan tires to wear out so I could do a Plus-1 upgrade along with an Eibach kit and a Stoptech kit. I jacked the car up to do some work and realized the Bridgestones were finally toast. But I am currently short of cash (paying off credit card debt), so I decided to just go for some high performance rubber in the stock size, and do all the other work later.
I wanted a non-directional tire because I need to rotate from side to side (too many freeway ramp skidpad runs). The P-Zero Nero was about the only tire in the "max performance" class that wasn't unidirectional, so I bought them. I had read some very good test results for these tires but they really surprised me. I did my 60 mile twisty mountain run twice over the weekend and it goes quietly through corners that used to make the Bridgestones howl. I made a tire pressure adjustment and the car is now also much more neutral than with the Bridgestones. I haven't driven the Neros in the rain yet, but in the dry these are great tires, and not terribly expensive either.
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{Crickets} :D
Bastard, I mean that in a "hold the cattle prod close to his anus" kind of way. ;)
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The hookers usually charge me $50 extra for that!
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Incidently, have you gone thru the "Which tire is best for you" program at http://www.thetirerack.com ? I highly suggest it.
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I sorta did. The Impreza club (http://www.nasioc.com) has a Tirerack rep who maintains a forum. He pointed me towards the P-Zero Nero once I told him my requirements.
Next step will be the plus-one (17"), Eibachs, and Stoptechs. After that (once the warranty is expired) I will bump it up to about 280 bhp with some turbo plumbing and ECU work. Turns out that one of the best turbo tuners in the US has their HQ like a mile from my house. Then I will be the God of Rice. Vanilla Rice in the house.
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Plus sizing yer tires and making sure it's quality rubber? Nothing wrong with that. You're still a homo tho', but that's what I like about you.
SOB
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Hey Funked, how does your car compare to a Ford Cosworth or Lancia. Im talking the street version of their rally cars.
Nice brake set BTW. It will probably stop you alot faster but youll be replacing pads faster than a teenage girl. Specially with the sloted rotors. It'll look cool though. Me Id probably paint my caliphers gold, edge of my rotors red and get those chrom rims that always look like they are spinning, even when you are stoped at a red light.
;)
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Here's more info on those brakes: http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=4&article_id=2852&page_number=1
It's not so much that they stop you faster, it's that they don't fade. There are some downhills around here (Corral Hollow or Morgan Territory) which will fade the stock brakes on just about any car.
(If you are travelling at ridiculous speeds.)
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Senna the street version of the Subaru WRC car is the WRX STi, which I don't own. They just went on sale last month here in the US. It compares favorably to any street version of a current WRC car. The only one that even comes close is the Mitsubishi Lancer Evo, which in US market form is down 30 hp and lacks the active center diff of the STi.
Historically, some of the Group B cars had street versions that were quite a bit quicker than the WRX Sti, mostly because they were lighter. These were limited production (~200 units) cars with all kinds of exotic materials and very little in the way of seating and amenities.
But since 1986 the WRC has been contested with Group A cars, and the WRX STi is more than a match for the road versions of any Group A cars that have been campaigned in the WRC.
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These are the rims I was talking about. They always look like they are spinning even when you are fully stopped at a light.
:D
(http://www.trendsetters.com/images/issues/content/20030326/GiovannaCorsica+SP6-7.gif)
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LOL those wheels are too gay for even the riciest tard. :)
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Originally posted by SOB
Plus sizing yer tires and making sure it's quality rubber? Nothing wrong with that. You're still a homo tho', but that's what I like about you.
SOB
MOMMY!!!
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Your not a real ricer until you've lost at least one car to a drag race, got a philipino girlfriend, got strobe lights or christmas lights inside/underneath your car, spend every last penny on that front airdam, make 8 bucks an hour at the mall, got an extra boost gage along right side window pillar, got NOS, got backup, and drive with your seat tilted all the way back so people can only see the tip of your cap. Oh and you gotto pickup girls while wearing a beanie in the middle of summer. Your not a real ricer yet.
;)
BTW: Wheres your license plate?
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I have them on my car, and they are absolutely fantastic. Coming from Bridgestones (Potenza SPP03, if my memory suits me well) I find them more responsive and less prone to follow each and every tarmac imperfection.
In the wet they are even better ;)
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(http://www.trendsetters.com/images/issues/content/20030326/GiovannaCorsica+SP6-7.gif)
It's jus' fo decoration, thas' it and thas all. WooWoooo!
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Funked, I just spent NZ $2000 (about US$1200) on a set of Bridgestone Duel 275/60R17's.
Your tyres are small, as is your noodle :D
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Nero's are what I'm looking towards..
I have Toyo T1-S (Directional) My right sides are wareing more then the left.. Guess I need to make more left turns.. plus I'm @ the 12K mark and will need new ones soon.
There been debate on the turn-in on these tho..Some say their good some say their as bad as these T1-S.
My question is how well do they trail? Do you feel like the car is everywhere?
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A buddy of mine put a set of Kuhmo MX tires on his M3/4. I drove more than a few twisty miles in the car and man those tires are great! Definitely my new favorite street tire, which was previously held by the Bridgestone S-02. I wish they made them in my S2k's size.
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Local police are warning people that those Spinners are like carjacker magnets. I guess they are just irresistable!
Dude!
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Rims for Subaru WRX ?
O.Z Racing's Superleggeras of course. They're on their own class :)
(http://www.kolumbus.fi/staga/superleggera_gold.jpg)
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You guys are starting to make me jones for my old '93 Civic coupe with American Racing rims and Potenzas.
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Originally posted by senna
Hey Funked, how does your car compare to a Ford Cosworth or Lancia. Im talking the street version of their rally cars.
Hmm......Lancia, I wonder.
I had P-zeros on my Lancia ( oops, said it again) Great tires.
The car didn't like them in the rain though.
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Road and Track found the Evo VIII to be actually faster on an actual rally course even with the 30hp difference.
Something about it handling better.
STIs suck!
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Umm.. Moose buddy.. that review was crap.
Not that I side with a Scuby. But, they took two cars that are ment for the 'road' and put them on a 'off-road' condition. I'd like to see both run with the same type of tires that are designed for off-road use.
I've seen the evo's out on the course(autocross) even tho their still new to the track. The Scuby's are kicking their butts..
I'd like to really see a good comparison then the monkey shine the magizine put on.
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Originally posted by nuchpatrick
My question is how well do they trail? Do you feel like the car is everywhere?
Trail brake? A lot better than the RE92s. The RE92s would give you a kind of "snakey" feeling if you tried to trail brake enteriing a turn above about 60 mph. I actually overcooked one corner slightly on Saturday and the Neros held the line real nice even though I was briefly into the ABS while turning in.
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Originally posted by crowMAW
A buddy of mine put a set of Kuhmo MX tires on his M3/4. I drove more than a few twisty miles in the car and man those tires are great! Definitely my new favorite street tire, which was previously held by the Bridgestone S-02. I wish they made them in my S2k's size.
I almost got those, but they are unidirectional.
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Those O.Z. rims are nice. That would be my pick if I were to spend a small fortune on alloy rims. Monk, what kind of Lancia do you own. Cool cars BTW. As far as "turn in" and following small road imperfections, from what I recall. Cars that "turn" in well or quick generally also like to follow road imperfections as well. In looking at the factors involved theres good and bad. Tow in/out affects turn in and causes your car to follow imperfections. Wide tires also affect that and definetly will cause more an inclination towards following imperfections along its path than narrow tires. This also includes low profile tires as compared to higher profile tires. Tire pressure plays a part also. If the pressure is higher, it will display this at faster speeds, if pressures are lower, the gremlin is noticed at lower speeds and under heavy tire loads such as breaking. Low pressure "wander" allows less feedback through wheel and high pressure "follow" will yank your wheel more, which you can sort of fight back. Camber and caster come into play too but not much you can do to change that in a street car. Two biggest culprits in turn in are too much tow out and wide tires/low profile then internal radial design. Tire pressure just exaggerates the affect or feel which ever direction it goes. Theres alot to be said about tire feel, I guess every body has their own feelings about how a tire feels to them. I personally have no idea which tires are good today but I used to like those Yokahama A008s and Eagle GTs. I went through a few sets of those, they were expensive. Also I like the directional tires better, I think thay have a less compromised radial design and better feel overall. I would just rotate diagnally unless I had different tire sizes front and rear.
Almsot forgot, how your tire wears out along the contact patch also affects this. If the inner and outer wears out differently, this usually causes a opposite bump affect that not 90 degrees etc... from road surface when your going straight. Similar to slight camber affects but because of tire wear. If a tire was overinflated most its life and wears at the center or crown, you'll feel it (pull) under heavy breaking or loads.
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ehem, so if you drive with 70 series tires none of that will affect you? Thats what I have.
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Senna.. thats why I'm asking :) See I autocross my car and I have a different alignment from stock.. so I'm use to a bit of dartyness.
Considering I have a camber set up of :
Rear
Toe: 1/32 inch (0°4.5' or 0.075°) IN per side
Camber: -1.75 degrees
Front
Camber: -1.0 degrees
Caster: 5.0 degrees
Toe: 1/32 inch IN per side
This give me a nice neutral-to-slight-understeer under constant power at speed, able to transition to oversteer with slight throttle lift to transfer weight forward
Talk about fun!!! :D
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:)
Mrcoffee, only too much tow out in 70 series tires will cause pull or drift though 70s are unsafe unless you drive like a slow grandma.
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There is only one EVO;)
Senna, a 93 Delta EVO 2.
Tuned just a bit ( as he says with a smile).
http://www.lycos.fr/graphics/webguides/automobile/reve/delta/img01pop.jpg
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Funked, those arent tires, they're pizza cutters. :D
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Originally posted by nuchpatrick
Front
Camber: -1.0 degrees
Caster: 5.0 degrees
Toe: 1/32 inch IN per side
Toe in on the front for autox??!! :eek:
Set it at zero at least and 1/32 out would be better if not even 1/16-1/8! You'll get much better turn-in response...keep you from getting behind in slaloms.
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Um... wouldnt toe in be exactly what you want for the front? And toe out for the rear?
Granted in small amount - but Ive always believed that to be the recipe for stability.
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Toe in makes the car handle a bit better on the road, if you are going to do more than drive in circles in parking lots. :)
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A little toe in on the front is great for driving on the highway. It does make the car feel more stable. But is doesn't really increase stability, rather it reduces the effects of steering inputs and creates understeer. Those are definitely safer for the average driver on the street.
But for autox you definitely don't want dampend steering inputs...you want immediate response to make corrections. And understeer is better dialed in using another method, such as swaybars. The consequence on the street is that the car is more twitchy and will track grooves in the road. But for someone who autox'es frequently, the added work while on the road is not a big deal...it is just part of driving.
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Funked,
the P-Zero Nero are quite good for drivin in the rain. I mounted them in my Audi A4.