Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Hajo on June 02, 2003, 05:10:19 PM
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A couple weeks ago Pepe and I got into a great 1 on 1 BF109G10 against P47D30. It went on for seems like forever. I'd just miss the angle etc. Even though Pepino won I really enjoyed the fight! They are becoming all to rare, and I miss those kinds of fights.
Here's hoping I run into more of those.........makes AH worthwhile!
Pepe and thanks for the fun!
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Ndisle's 'Furball Isle' provides some fun action when there's 2 or 3 planes for each side.. Had a lot of fun with it today, too bad the 'strat dweebs' (which is just a relative term for the people porkin stuff when you're having fun) just loooove to shut down the bases and 'make us' fight for the 'cause'.
Oops, i'm ranting.
Don't reply, hajo will take away my sheep for thread hijacking :D
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Rut LOL :D
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Ah screw it, i'll hijack the damn sheep too
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Hajo!
That's what I like most about AH, no doubt. Saving my oh so frequent tendence to increase Bish global perk account by taking off from vulched fields, and the negative consequences for my temper (HO shooting and ranting on Ch1), this is my usual choice of flying, and what justifies the monthly fee.
As I told you in MA, if the fite were more on Jug's terms (aka. over 30K) I think I would be the one hitting the silk.
Wonderful flying on your side, usually fites against Jugs down low are much easier to win in G-10. ;)
Thanks for a really fun fight!
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Pepe how did u spot Hajo's orbiting Jug ? :D :D :D
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Originally posted by fffreeze220
Pepe how did u spot Hajo's orbiting Jug ? :D :D :D
It's pretty easy when the jug enter atmosphere you just have to spot and follow the trail :
(http://www.astrologieholistique.org/images/Gif/etoile_filante.gif)
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Chased a Jug in a G-10 on the deck a while ago, took quite long and didn't want to use WEP because of limited fuel left.
The guy was smart, pulled off a great reversal with some G which I totally failed to counter, stressing the point that a G-10 with gondolas (had been hunting buffs) is NOT a fighter. Got some pings but could accelerate away and land, quite humiliated, with my last drop of fuel.
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I disagree, Hongebor.
IMHO, G-10 is a really outstanding fighter, as long as you use the vertical. It can be countered effectively by a lot of planes, but it's also true that errors against a G-10 are very frequently fatal, given an average/good pilot behind the Bf stick. Errors that are, in most of the cases
On the other hand, I find no other plane easier when it comes to turning the tables....leaving aside La-7's under 12k aprox. ;)
[edit]Ah! Leave Gondolas in Venice...taters are more than enough, if not overkill ;)[/edit]
Cheers,
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Hehehe Rutilant, you MUST have a deathwish with that avatar. :D
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Pepe, of course the G-10 is an excellent aircraft. The problem was that I was flying with gondolas. I have had reasonable succes in knocking B-17's down with them, that was the reason I took off with them in the first place.
However, my piloting skills are average to good at best and I'm not used to the G-10 and do not know how to fly it at its limits in a classic 1 vs. 1. For dogfigthing I pick the La-5, FM-2 or P-51B mostly.
The P-47 pulled up, did a wingover and came towards me head-on, we were both at low altitude at max speed. I wanted to get the hell out of there, being low on fuel and not having succeeded in surprising the P-47. I however completely misjudged timing and my relative position to the P-47 and found him at 350-400 on my six. Got a few pings but could accelerate away with a bit of twisting to throw off his aim.
Still, even in aircraft I am more familiar with, I sometimes get surprised by maneuvers in heavy planes like F6F's, P-47's and Typhoons I haven't got an answer to.
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There are lots of pilots in AH that are better than me. Saying this first, I will venture to tell you that G-10 has only one factor to care about: energy judgement.
If there is an aspect where G-10 excels is in gaining energy. She boths accelerate and climb like no other plane in AH, saving low La-7's. So all of my fights in G-10 are very similar. If I am in disadvantage, I try to suck my opponent's energy. That involves taking some risks, often giving them bad gun solutions (i.e. high AOT shots). If the bandit choses to take the shot, he will be pulling some serious G's, and losing energy. If he choses to extend, G-10 will gain more energy than him.
If I manage to turn tables, I try to stay over my enemy at all costs, and try to keep the fight as slow as I can (around 200 kts. is best), since G-10 is very sluggish at high speeds.
The best manouver (IMHO) in G-10 is the spiral climb. It's good both clockwise or counterclockwise, of course better counterclockwise. But no plane in Ah can follow a G-10 climbing like that.
If the bandit chose to follow, he`s pretty much dead meat. On the typical climb, once speed falls below 140 kts he will be flopping around fighting the stall some 1 to 2k below the G-10. Using rudder the G-10 will then flop over and turn nose to the then stalled bogie, which will be a pretty easy target.
If the bandit is wiser, he will break at around 200/250 kts. Then the G-10 driver would make a lazy low G turn with substantial vertical component or something similar to reengage his target. If you find yourself against a bandit like this it's all about sucking his energy, making him lower and slower with each of his manouvers. If you judge relative energies efficiently, you will find the bandit trying to break turn or Split-S lower and lower each time.
The bandit which makes me most uncomfortable is a fast plane (Pony, Dora, F4U, and the likes) making a barrell roll. Very difficult to find a gun solution and easy to overshoot in a G-10. Besides that, the bandit will loose only limited energy with this, leaving open the chance to take a shoot if the G-10 choses to climb away.
All in all, G-10 is a beautiful plane especially with tater gun alone. It makes you feel the fight very close and personal, since you have to get real close to actually hit your enemy. When you turn your nose against a lower bandit after a spiral climb, you can almost feel their fear as your distance quickly close from 1k to 150 yds....Boom! :D
Flown correctly it will take you back home almost every time, yet will allow you the chance to fight aggresively every plane seen.
What a lovely plane! :)
(and sorry for the brick, hehehe)
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Freeze LOL ya dweeb :D
I was rtb at approx 8K when I spied a 109 about 5.4 off my 6. Saw him gaining quickly and knew it was a G10. Turned to fight at approx 2.7 off my 6 and the mini furball was on. From 8K down to the deck. In over 3 years of playing AH I can remember only 2 other fights like that one. Was well flown......lots of good ACM and both planes were used to the fullest of their capabilities. Was great!
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Hey that sounds like it was fun! :D
Part of our suqad along with Pepe did some c202 sweeps last night, loads of fun too! The highlight was drooling over a low Hurri 1 I found out later to be DadRabit ( :mad: )
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Agrgrneu! And an another G10 escapes my Jug:mad:
Bring on the M *&^%$#@ so we can rat race with D9s and G10s with a bit more of a chance.(http://home.cfl.rr.com/rauns/signature.jpg)
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Frenchy,
You don't need the M to kill a zillion Me's and Fw's, whatever mark. I've seen/suffered it ;)
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4 reasons I find the 109G10 difficult. [list=1]
- roll rate not good
- elevator sluggish as all hell
- having to get sooooo close
- no chance for wide angle deflection shots.
Help me! I get a few kills in it (check stats for recent tours) but it's damned hard work!
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I've shot down many G10s.......going through my stats I've got a very good k/d against 109s in general. G10 is just so good in the verticle that if the jug and G10 get on the deck and the G10 goes up......the Jug just can't get his nose up in a slow fight.
In other words the G10 has to make a mistake....the D30 will turn with it, but as soon as the G10 gets over the Jug, it dictates the fight from that point on. This is on the deck. At 20K the Jug can hold it's own nicely if the Jug stays up.....and forces the G10 into a turning match.
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Originally posted by Pepe
Frenchy,
You don't need the M to kill a zillion Me's and Fw's, whatever mark. I've seen/suffered it ;)
Heck I do! I'm getting old... my reflex are slower, my gunery not too precise ... I guess it's my eyes. My SA is slopy ... my brain just shuts down ... I keep staring at my gunsight like a sailor looking at a hooker after 6 months at sea.
And the strenght ... too heavy those controls, I can't jerk the plane around like I used to.
Getting old .... what a misery ... need to compensate agressiveness and ingeniosity with ubber performances:)
Beetle, you should have no problem flying the G10 ... remember, you are in control of the fight in a G10 as you can climb away or run away. So you have all the time in the world to place yourself for the 30mm kill.
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Originally posted by SFRT - Frenchy
Beetle, you should have no problem flying the G10 ... remember, you are in control of the fight in a G10 as you can climb away or run away. So you have all the time in the world to place yourself for the 30mm kill.
Can't be better said in less space :)
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Originally posted by BNM
Hehehe Rutilant, you MUST have a deathwish with that avatar. :D
Hehe :D
It looks so... Doom-esque tho..
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Originally posted by SFRT - Frenchy
Beetle, you should have no problem flying the G10 ... remember, you are in control of the fight in a G10 as you can climb away or run away. So you have all the time in the world to place yourself for the 30mm kill.
Well allrighty, then. I followed the advice given here, and went out in a G10 with 60 potatoes loaded. Got two 6-kill sorties back to back, so must be doing something right, though not doing everything right. Could someone look at the first sortie - film attached (1.41MB) (http://www.alanadsl.legend.yorks.com/109G10_tour41_6.zip) - and comment as you see fit. ;)
Thanks, guys.
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I had some luck in G-10's of course... but it is challenging bird due to the reasons mentioned earlier. I'm just not comfortable in it.
It is flown poorly so often, I shot down scores of them in my humble FM2.
It might be a good idea to fly it more with the difficult cannon and try Pepe's tactics but it seems to me that those will make you vulnerable to slashing attacks.
I mastered to some extent the FM2, P-51B, F4U-1 and La-5, each with an unique set of characteristics, good and bad. Maybe time to try the 109. I rather like the G-2 sometimes but why not take a challenge and start with the G-6? Hmmmmm...