Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: [Sg]ShotGun on August 06, 2000, 02:10:00 PM
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just forget it...
[This message has been edited by [Sg]ShotGun (edited 08-07-2000).]
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Nevermind
[This message has been edited by Jigster (edited 08-06-2000).]
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Took the words right off of my keyboard Jigster (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
(http://pages.hotbot.com/games/davekirk/images/Logos.jpg)
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CyberPilots have bigger Joysticks
BANDITS ON MY SIX!!!! (http://members.xoom.com/_XMCM/rowgue/goose2.ra)
<< MILENKO >> (http://pages.hotbot.com/games/davekirk/milenko.html)
ACES HIGH ASSASSINS Website (http://www.cybrtyme.com/personal/hblair/mainpage.htm)
WB/AH ASSASSINS Website (http://members.xoom.com/rowgue/assassins.html)
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Shotgun wrote:
<----extremely bad pilot(just ck score)
What does this code of conduct says, again?
Say, if you had a personal message for hblair, why did you put it on the BBS?
Also note that you should add "never write in IRC grammar" in your supposed code of conduct. When I see text written as if by sound, I usually stop reading, as most of the time it will prove not worth reading (besides it really gets on my nerves).
From now on, .squelch [SG]ShotGun for me.
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DrSoya
308 (Polish) Squadron "City of Cracow" RAF [AH]
303 (Polish) Squadron "Kosciuszko" RAF [WB]
Part of the Northolt Wing (http://www.raf303.org/northolt) (First Polish Fighter Wing)
[This message has been edited by DrSoya (edited 08-06-2000).]
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Hmmmmm Guess you were never an Amateur Radio Operater Doc since most messages sent by CW (continous wave) used that type of spelling to shorten transmissions. Now please post your definition of "communitcations" since mine is "that if the message is recieved and understood it is successful" this of course leave's out "educated" types like yourself who seem to think that if "they" don't care for it then the "world" should comply. I suggest you look at a dictionary and see how many NEW words and meanings have been added over the years.
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spent many a hour chasin both the turds , no huge alt or e adv all tulips and heels lol.great pilots lol
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Ya coulda emailed me.
My point was this...
You are known by more pilots than just me to be a guy who not only runs(no big deal), but runs *and* bails with no damage (just to save face?).
Then when I chase you down and get a kill on you, you get pissed because *I* wouldn't fight you on *your* terms.
Thats a crock my friend. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
You wouldn't even speak to me on private when I gave you a <S> only a "F U" on open channel.
Funny stuff really. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Hehe... I agree Hblair... it is funny stuff. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
I suppose this thread is dead though.. he's currently opening a new thread with the reply to this one... Meet ya there.
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BigJim wrote:
Now please post your definition of "communitcations" since mine is "that if the message is recieved and understood it is successful"
Good thing that you speak of communication and the key word here is understanding.
Have you stopped to think about the origin of posters here?
For example, have you taken a look at the location described below my username?
I am from Canada. From Quebec City more precisely, which is in Quebec.
It does not take an educated American to know that Canada has two official languages. That a quarter of its population speaks French as first language, and it's mostly located in Quebec (but it's most probably not known to non North Americans).
The following may be a fact unknown by most Americans though: a very small part of that French-speaking population speaks English proficiently. Amazing, isnt't it?
So English is a second language for me. And I worked damn hard to be reasonably fluent in it. And after 15 years, my learning process is not over yet, for while I'm reasonably fluent with the written form, I'm still uncomfortable with the spoken form.
Let's get back to our subject, written communication. Have you reflected on what happens when you read? On how you actually decode symbols into words then in concepts? You probably haven't, since as an American (assuming you were born there) you never had to (really) learn another language.
What actually happens is that you don't decode letters one by one. You recognize a word as a whole. It's the shape, the pattern you recognize. Else it would take you a lot longer to read, no? This is made the more clear when studying a completely foreign language, like Russian with its different alphabet. I can easily recognize Russian words that are part of my (infinitesimal) vocabulary, but I have to painstakingly decode new words cyrillic letter by cyrillic letter. You also can see it in a child who's learning to read. It takes him/her time to decode new words.
Now take a text which is written in what I call "IRC grammar", where words are written by sound. An expression like "b4" is not in the dictionary. To a non-IRC chatter (or a non amateur radio operator) its pattern is unfamiliar, unrecognized. So it has to be decoded character by character. When groups of letters are replaced by numbers, it adds difficulty to the decoding process, for the result doesn't make sense at first.
It doesn't help either when vowels are left off, as in the word "dragn" above. It took me almost half a second to decode "dragn", for the first word that came in my mind was "dragon".
Add to that the personality of the reader, and I mean visual or auditive. I'm a very visual person. For example when someone takes on the task of explaining to me driving instructions, I simply stop listening and just make "uh uh" sounds from time to time, then ask for the address. Then I go find a map, locate the place on the map, and picture my route from it. I don't care about how many turns I have to make, or if there's a MacDonald's on the previous corner, for it doesn't help me. I just want the address and a map.
I depend a lot on the visual aspect.
So when I find myself with a text such as written by [Sg]ShotGun, what happens?
Every word written by sound requires of me more effort, more time. The speed at which I can read (which is already significantly less than the speed at which I can read French) such a text is then greatly reduced. This irritates me in the extreme.
Now, in my experience, I have found that most people who resort to using "IRC grammar" are the kind that I don't want to bother with: people with "mental laziness".
The (usually but not always) young people with no respect for the others, who don't care about the feelings of the others, who resort to insults when things don't go their way, and even when they do go their way, who show little sportsmanship, who show very little flexibility and are unwilling to discuss civilly or intelligently in the respect of others.
(Sidenote: I have found that a lot of those characters are typical Quakeheads, who are the main reason I stopped playing those kind of games, and to my distress I'm seeing more of those persons in AH than I expected.)
You may say it's paradoxical to complain of laziness when I say I don't want to spend the time decoding "IRC grammar", but make no mistake about this: I'm always willing to make an effort when it's worth it. I have found that in most cases, with the "IRC grammar" crowd, it's not worth it.
this of course leave's out "educated" types like yourself who seem to think that if "they" don't care for it then the "world" should comply.
I do care. I care about how people treat one another. I care about other people's lives, about their pains, their joys. I don't want people to do my bidding.
I may be "educated", but I work in a technical profession. I have met non educated people who have more analytical minds than some educated types I know, and people who make sure you see their engineer's ring or doctor's degree get on my nerves.
I'm sorry if I have offended you or anyone. It was not my intent. As I said, "IRC grammar" gets on my nerves, and I'm seeing too much of it on this BBS for my taste. (More than on AGW anyway. <G,D,R> (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif) )
It's not a question of being educated or not. It's just a question of facilitating communication. And writing as good English as one can is the best way to have good communication.
BTW I'm not a doctor. My handle is a self-reminder so that I never take things too seriously. (Obviously it fails most of the time.) See the link in my profile.
Cheers,
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DrSoya
308 (Polish) Squadron "City of Cracow" RAF [AH]
303 (Polish) Squadron "Kosciuszko" RAF [WB]
Part of the Northolt Wing (http://www.raf303.org/northolt) (First Polish Fighter Wing)
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Ever try to read a Doctors handwritting? Now thats a failed attempt at communication (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Lizard
"Engage the enemy; not the keyboard"
Hangtime
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Well Doc it so happens that I lived in Vermont for 27 years and know quite well where Quebec City is, who Rennie Lavec is, how the frankophones have destroyed Quebec's bilingual situation (even tho there are PLENTY of anglophones in Quebec who are natives) and I suspect you work for Bombardie (since most of Quebec City does). I would write this in French but I am very rusty since I left Vermont (where many DO speak French) so I am not very simpathic with your arguments so far. I got very little simpathy in Montreal when I wanted to order food in English so why I should I accord any different to the French speakers in my country.
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asdf
[This message has been edited by BagPiper (edited 08-07-2000).]
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SG you are 3 for 3 this weekend on threads that belong OFF F(*&ING TOPIC!!! TAKE YOUR PERSONAL S*(& ELSEWHERE!!!
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Although I sometimes use "IRC speak", I can understand where "DrSoya" is coming from.
Point 1:
As I am learning a new language, I can understand how someone who does not count english as his/her 1st language, can find it difficult to read "IRQ Speak" posts.
Online, I sometimes forget that the internet is international and not everyone speaks/reads english fluently. (or at all)
Point 2:
I also have noticed that a fair amount of people who post in "ICR Speak" SEEM to fit in the ignorant, rude youngster category that he
mentions.
BigJim:
you said....
"I got very little simpathy in Montreal when I wanted to order food in English so why I should I accord any different to the French speakers in my country."
Guess what...
THIS ISN'T YOUR COUNTRY....
THIS IS THE INTERNET, WHICH IS INTERNATIONAL.
Although I have experienced the same anti-english attitude in Quebec, I DON'T lump all Quebecois in the same category.
I also DO NOT subscribe to the common belief that all U.S. citizens are rude, loud, racist people who:
- think Canada is a full of snow 12 months of the year.
- expect everyone in a foreign country to speak english to them while on holidays
(without making a small effort to speak the local language).
- watch Jerry Springer
- <Fill-in-the-blank>.
Therefore I think it's bad that you pre-judge "DrSoya", or anyone else, in that way.
If you were not be prejudical, and I just misunderstood, then please excuse my comments.
Regards,
Snoopi
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SG you are 3 for 3 this weekend on threads that belong OFF F(*&ING TOPIC!!! TAKE YOUR
PERSONAL S*(& ELSEWHERE!!!
I agree 150% funked. Well said (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Lt. Col. Aaron "txace-" Giles of the 457th BG
"Fait Accompli"
[This message has been edited by texace (edited 08-07-2000).]
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heheheh Snoopi the last time I looked GrapeVine, Texas WAS in MY country.
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"Which way is Old Orchard Beach?"
(most asked question by French Canadians in Maine)
"Ayup. Thot so... Whaelp; yah cain't get theya from heya.. Yah gots ta go ovah theya fusst."
(most common answer; followed by wildly inaccurate and incomprensible directions to Vermont)
Downeasters have known the truth fer decades. And, no; they they don't have or need maps. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Hang
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LOL nope Hang the answer is "I don't care" or "I ain't lost"
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I shoulda put a smiley though. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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BigJim, Bombardier is nowhere near Quebec City. By FAR. As for the bilingual situation, well one or two persons I know in my area speak as good or better English than I.
Your post shows ignorance, not knowledge.
So, what you're saying is that you don't like francophones and that you don't care. I don't see why I should continue this matter with you further. I guess all I can do is just .squelch you then.
I play and discuss AH to have fun, to relax. Not to serve as a channel to pass anyone's frustrations.
DrSoya
308 (Polish) Squadron "City of Cracow" RAF [AH]
303 (Polish) Squadron "Kosciuszko" RAF [WB]
Part of the Northolt Wing (http://www.raf303.org/northolt) (First Polish Fighter Wing)
[This message has been edited by DrSoya (edited 08-08-2000).]
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Hmmm I dunno BigJim. I've been to Montreal twice and found people quite understanding when I spoke English, and they went out of their way to get an English speaking employee if we had trouble understanding eachother. Also I met some very friendly people on the Metro who had no problems conversing in English.
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I any of you want to have a mistic experience, hear my speaking in english (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Well Funked I lived very close to Quebec for a number of years, shared boating on Lake Champlain with them ( AND we sent a BUNCH of GUYS to Quebec City to train for employment with Bombadier when they opened their railcar shop in Barre, Vt) and there are some great guys in Quebec to be sure but I just didn't care for the "radical" change after Rennie Levec took over and all the English Signs had to be taken down etc etc etc. Then to have the same "ilk" to me at least get on some kids case and then LATER use the language excuse just didn't sit well with me. Now he claims I am a lier about Bombadier and next he will claim Quebec City is NOT on the St Lawrence River so I sure as hell hope he does squelch me as I sure don't want to hear him.
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Thank God I don't treat all people from the U.S. like crap just because I met a U.S. citizen who was an idiot or I didn't like U.S. politics !
Geeee... I didn't realize the internet was specifically in Grapevine, TX. You learn something every day. Next time I log in it should say "Welcome to Texas".
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LOL well snoopi for THIS part of the internet it sort of does say welcome to the US since this particular net is based in the US LOL. I am not quite sure why you are so vigiorosly supporting a Province that wants to break away from your Conferderation tho??? in fact if the Parti De Quebecois had its way they would no longer even be in Canada LOL
BigJim
[This message has been edited by BigJim (edited 08-09-2000).]
[This message has been edited by BigJim (edited 08-09-2000).]
[This message has been edited by BigJim (edited 08-09-2000).]
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Al Gore DID invent the internet you know! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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LOL COBRA ! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
Uhhh.. Yeah ! That's right our friend Gore did that didn't he ! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
BigJim:
I'm not supporting the province of Quebec.
I'm saying don't generalize and don't blame all Quebecois for what happens politically in their province.
I guess since Clinton is your President, then I must judge you by what he does ?
I assume you must be getting tail from your secretary ?
DrSoya was just explaining a language problem he was having.
What are you gonna say when users from Finland,Germany,France have the same issue ?
For what it's worth:
The majority of Quebec do not want to separate from Canada. A vote proved that.
If they did separate from Canada, it would be a problem for both sides.
But democracy should prevail.
You who is living in a country that was created by just such a separation (albeit more violent) from England, should understand that.
Snoopi
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The place is probably crawling with torque,s.
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[I'd have sent this by e-mail, but your profile doesn't list it.]
Snoopi, you're an alright guy.
If you ever pass in Quebec City, I'll buy you a beer.
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DrSoya
308 (Polish) Squadron "City of Cracow" RAF [AH]
303 (Polish) Squadron "Kosciuszko" RAF [WB]
Part of the Northolt Wing (http://www.raf303.org/northolt) (First Polish Fighter Wing)
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Well Snoopi having spent most of my life within a stones throw of Canada, either Quebec for 27 years or Ontario when I was growing up and again now that I am back home, I guess I have as good a "feel" for Canadians as they do for American's. I am 80 miles from Winsor, Ont now and was 125 miles from Montreal when in Vermont. I know why the folks in Quebec voted to stay with the Confederation and it showed good sense for them to do so. I know why "we" broke away from England and it was good sense then to do so, although I can hardly equate the two on a level playing field. Had your friend illuded to the language problem in his FIRST post I would have been more simpathic, but he didn't, it was quite curt and cold and smacked of elitism. After I up braided him for it he THEN brought out the language reason (which I felt was "convient") and I then refused to accept that and things have spiraled down since then, suffice to say I have said all I intend to on this subject and a "big" salute to you for defending your countryman.
[This message has been edited by BigJim (edited 08-10-2000).]
[This message has been edited by BigJim (edited 08-10-2000).]
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Originally posted by BigJim:
Well Doc it so happens that I lived in Vermont for 27 years and know quite well where Quebec City is, who Rennie Lavec is, how the frankophones have destroyed Quebec's bilingual situation (even tho there are PLENTY of anglophones in Quebec who are natives)
LOLOLOLOL what a crock of toejam. I live Not too far from Ottawa, and most small towns between there and the Quebec border are an equal mix of french and english. Know what...we all get along just fine.
I have been to montreal many many times, and have not once had a problem communicating with anyone in english. Montreal is largly and english city. A friend of mine went to college there, and english college, he doesnt speak french. And you say you couldnt order food? Whatever (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/rolleyes.gif)
I could start insulting americans lumping you all into one group, like the cars with ski racks loaded with skis crossing the border into canada in the middle of july but I wont do that cause it wouldnt be nice (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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LOL Rosco that's because the Candian's are buying ski's in July LOLOLOLOL
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You betcha, off season discount.
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BigJim:
I didn't see his first post.
I was only agreeing that people that don't count english as their 1st language could have trouble with ICQ speak.
And I just refuse to otherwise judge/generalize about people based on their nationality or current home.
I would defend anyone, Canadian or not, in that regard.
I, like you, will say nothing more since we are wasting network bandwidth.
Regards,
Snoopi