Aces High Bulletin Board

General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Nash on June 24, 2003, 01:19:32 AM

Title: Predator attack
Post by: Nash on June 24, 2003, 01:19:32 AM
According to CNN, a Predator drone fired on cars possibly carrying top Iraqis. One Pentagon official said that before the attack there was "at least a hope" that Saddam or his sons might have been in the convoy.

Why are they trying to kill Saddam Hussein?
Title: Re: Predator attack
Post by: Russian on June 24, 2003, 01:45:03 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Nash


Why are they trying to kill Saddam Hussein?


Why not?
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Fishu on June 24, 2003, 02:53:25 AM
News flash: US has been after Saddams head since the begining of their little war.. erm... live battle test range.
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Saintaw on June 24, 2003, 02:57:39 AM
Those drones are armed now? Didn't know that.

I wonder when they are going to come here & hire the remote pileits for those... ;)
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Nash on June 24, 2003, 04:01:05 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Russian
"Why not?"


why?
Title: Predator attack
Post by: GRUNHERZ on June 24, 2003, 04:21:47 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Saintaw
Those drones are armed now? Didn't know that.

I wonder when they are going to come here & hire the remote pileits for those... ;)


They have been armed since early in the afghan war. Apparently one of them actually had Mullah Omar's personal vehicle in its sights waiting to fire but the military was not yet clear on what they were allowed to do wrt such attacks and so had to consult pentagon lawyers on the matter, in the meantime they lost track of Omar.. :(


Nash it would be nice to kill Saddam, plus it's likely they just destroyed certain vehicles in the convoy by air - in fact we know ground units were involved in the action right after the airstrikes. Our soldiers even chased some of the convoy riders into syrian territory which caused a minor skirmish with syrian border gurds some of who were wounded and are still being treated by US Army medics.
Title: Re: Predator attack
Post by: Hortlund on June 24, 2003, 04:29:48 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Nash

Why are they trying to kill Saddam Hussein?


Because Saddam Hussein is a madman, presumably still in control of some fraction of armed terrorists (ex iraqi military) and possibly still with access to wmd's.

He is still a threat to us, and he is DEFINITIVELY a threat to US forces in Iraq.
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Maniac on June 24, 2003, 04:32:51 AM
Quote
Because Saddam Hussein is a madman, presumably still in control of some fraction of armed terrorists (ex iraqi military) and possibly still with access to wmd's.


Yes. if he "still" has access to WMD´s i think he would have used them by now, after all hes an madman...
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Hortlund on June 24, 2003, 04:33:42 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Maniac
Yes. if he "still" has access to WMD´s i think he would have used them by now, after all hes an madman...


Yes, and "reasonable logic" is applicable on insane persons since when?
Title: Re: Predator attack
Post by: Staga on June 24, 2003, 04:34:35 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Nash

Why are they trying to kill Saddam Hussein?


Its common practice for U.S to assasinate/eliminate leaders/ex-leaders of the other countries.

Not sure how correct this list is but if even 1/3:rd is right... wtg :)

1949 - Kim Koo, Korean opposition leader

1950s,1962 - Sukarno, President of Indonesia

1951 - Kim Il Sung, Premier of North Korea

1953 - Mohammed Mossadegh, Prime Minister of Iran

1950s (mid) - Claro M. Recto, Philippines opposition leader

1955 - Jawaharlal Nehru, Prime Minister of India

1957 - Gamal Abdul Nasser, President of Egypt

1959, 1963, 1969 - Norodom Sihanouk, leader of Cambodia

1960 - Brig. Gen. Abdul Karim Kassem, leader of Iraq

1950s-70s - José Figueres, President of Costa Rica, two attempts on his life

1961 - Francois "Papa Doc" Duvalier, leader of Haiti

1961 - Patrice Lumumba, Prime Minister of the Congo (Zaire)

1961 - Gen. Rafael Trujillo, leader of Dominican Republic

1963 - Ngo Dinh Diem, President of South Vietnam

1960s - Fidel Castro, President of Cuba, many attempts on his life

1960s - Raúl Castro, high official in government of Cuba

1965 - Francisco Caamaño, Dominican Republic opposition leader

1967 - Che Guevara, Cuban leader

1970 - Salvador Allende, President of Chile

1970 - Gen. Rene Schneider, Commander-in-Chief of Army, Chile

1970s, 1981 - General Omar Torrijos, leader of Panama

1972 - General Manuel Noriega, Chief of Panama Intelligence

1975 - Mobutu Sese Seko, President of Zaire

1976 - Michael Manley, Prime Minister of Jamaica

1980-1986 - Muammar Qaddafi, leader of Libya, several plots and attempts upon his life

1982 - Ayatollah Khomeini, leader of Iran

1983 - Gen. Ahmed Dlimi, Moroccan Army commander

1983 - Miguel d'Escoto, Foreign Minister of Nicaragua

1984 - The nine comandantes of the Sandinista National Directorate

1985 - Sheikh Mohammed Hussein Fadlallah, Lebanese Shiite leader (80 people killed in the attempt)

1991 - Saddam Hussein, leader of Iraq

1998, 2001-2 - Osama bin Laden, leading Islamic militant

1999 - Slobodan Milosevic, President of Yugoslavia
Title: Predator attack
Post by: GRUNHERZ on June 24, 2003, 04:38:57 AM
1970 - Salvador Allende, President of Chile

Good call! :D
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Maniac on June 24, 2003, 04:40:24 AM
Quote
Yes, and "reasonable logic" is applicable on insane persons since when?


We could argue on forever about what "reasonable logic" is in this case...
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Dowding on June 24, 2003, 05:09:05 AM
So Saddam Hussein has the WMD in the back of his car, ready to be deployed at 45 minutes notice?
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Hortlund on June 24, 2003, 05:14:44 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Dowding
So Saddam Hussein has the WMD in the back of his car, ready to be deployed at 45 minutes notice?


Was that what I said?

My bet is that they are hidden somewhere, and Saddam Hussein knows where. Now I have no idea exactly where they are hidden and how... But if there is ANYONE who knows where they are, it is SH.
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Staga on June 24, 2003, 05:14:56 AM
Maybe he ate beans and some spicy iraqi food before that car trip?
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Maniac on June 24, 2003, 05:16:34 AM
Quote
My bet is that they are hidden somewhere, and Saddam Hussein knows where. Now I have no idea exactly where they are hidden and how... But if there is ANYONE who knows where they are, it is SH.


Maybe the correct tactic would be to try to capture him alive then?
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Hortlund on June 24, 2003, 05:25:09 AM
Nah. The important thing here is threat-neutralization.
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Maniac on June 24, 2003, 05:30:24 AM
Quote
Nah. The important thing here is threat-neutralization.


Yeah thats good logic.
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Hortlund on June 24, 2003, 05:58:41 AM
Yeah, I think so too. Thanks.
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Weavling on June 24, 2003, 06:10:06 AM
Hmm, according to Staga, if any leader of any country is asassinated, the U.S. was to blame. Think he's been living next door to Weazel too long.
Title: Re: Re: Predator attack
Post by: Hortlund on June 24, 2003, 06:14:44 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Staga
1957 - Gamal Abdul Nasser, President of Egypt


LOL!!

So the americans were behind that one huh? Care to explain the logic behind that?
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Maniac on June 24, 2003, 06:15:33 AM
Dont forget.

1986 - Olof Palme
Title: for the record
Post by: Saintaw on June 24, 2003, 06:19:23 AM
Patrice Lubumba was not assasinated by the US per se.

he was dragged out of the airplane oh his return to Elisabeth Ville (Kinshassa), put in a Jeep... driven off to a nearby jungle patch, beaten to pulp and then shot in the head by Mobutu's men.

this is not the official version, but from an eye witness I can trust.
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Fishu on June 24, 2003, 06:54:06 AM
I didn't see John F. Kennedy being mentioned...
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Imp on June 24, 2003, 07:02:55 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Saintaw
Those drones are armed now? Didn't know that.

I wonder when they are going to come here & hire the remote pileits for those... ;)


I think they use Hellfire missiles like the Apache.
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Imp on June 24, 2003, 07:16:08 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Fishu
I didn't see John F. Kennedy being mentioned...


Lee Harvey Oswald had a magic bullet Fishu, everybody knows that ;)

And what about is brother.
Witnesses say they heard 7 or 8 shots being fired.
The presumed assassin was using a revolver?
How did he have the time to recharge?
Was security that crappy?
Or did he get shot by a security guard standing behind him?
A photographer's photos were taken and never given back too.
Maybe they showed something some people didnt want the world to see or maybe they just got lost :rolleyes:

Lots of suspicions, not many answers.

Someday we will know, when everyone involved is 6 feet under so they cant be punished. :mad:
Title: Re: Re: Predator attack
Post by: _Schadenfreude_ on June 24, 2003, 07:19:19 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Staga
Its common practice for U.S to assasinate/eliminate leaders/ex-leaders of the other countries.

Not sure how correct this list is but if even 1/3:rd is right... wtg :)

1949 - Kim Koo, Korean opposition leader

1950s,1962 - Sukarno, President of Indonesia

1951 - Kim Il Sung, Premier of North Korea

1953 - Mohammed Mossadegh, Prime Minister of Iran

1950s (mid) - Claro M. Recto, Philippines opposition leader

1955 - Jawaharlal Nehru, Prime Minister of India

1957 - Gamal Abdul Nasser, President of Egypt

1959, 1963, 1969 - Norodom Sihanouk, leader of Cambodia

1960 - Brig. Gen. Abdul Karim Kassem, leader of Iraq

1950s-70s - José Figueres, President of Costa Rica, two attempts on his life

1961 - Francois "Papa Doc" Duvalier, leader of Haiti

1961 - Patrice Lumumba, Prime Minister of the Congo (Zaire)

1961 - Gen. Rafael Trujillo, leader of Dominican Republic

1963 - Ngo Dinh Diem, President of South Vietnam

1960s - Fidel Castro, President of Cuba, many attempts on his life

1960s - Raúl Castro, high official in government of Cuba

1965 - Francisco Caamaño, Dominican Republic opposition leader

1967 - Che Guevara, Cuban leader

1970 - Salvador Allende, President of Chile

1970 - Gen. Rene Schneider, Commander-in-Chief of Army, Chile

1970s, 1981 - General Omar Torrijos, leader of Panama

1972 - General Manuel Noriega, Chief of Panama Intelligence

1975 - Mobutu Sese Seko, President of Zaire

1976 - Michael Manley, Prime Minister of Jamaica

1980-1986 - Muammar Qaddafi, leader of Libya, several plots and attempts upon his life

1982 - Ayatollah Khomeini, leader of Iran

1983 - Gen. Ahmed Dlimi, Moroccan Army commander

1983 - Miguel d'Escoto, Foreign Minister of Nicaragua

1984 - The nine comandantes of the Sandinista National Directorate

1985 - Sheikh Mohammed Hussein Fadlallah, Lebanese Shiite leader (80 people killed in the attempt)

1991 - Saddam Hussein, leader of Iraq

1998, 2001-2 - Osama bin Laden, leading Islamic militant

1999 - Slobodan Milosevic, President of Yugoslavia


mmm doesn't look like they suceeded very often
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Ripsnort on June 24, 2003, 08:34:39 AM
Here is your answer Nash.

Quote
By David Anthony Denny
Washington File Staff Writer

Washington -- Those who supported the Clinton administration's armed interventions in Bosnia, Haiti and Kosovo have even more reason to support a U.S.-led war with Iraq, according to Brookings scholar Kenneth Pollack.

During an abbreviated digital video conference (DVC) March 14 with three State Department posts in India, Pollack argued that the case for armed intervention in Iraq on humanitarian grounds is as strong or stronger than those instances when President Clinton ordered U.S. military intervention during the 1990s. Pollack, who now is director of research at the Brookings Institution's Saban Center for Middle East Policy, is the author of "The Threatening Storm: The Case for Invading Iraq." He was previously director of Gulf affairs at the National Security Council during the Clinton administration, and before that was a CIA military analyst for the Persian Gulf. He holds a doctorate in political science from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology.

Pollack asserts that Saddam Hussein is one of the worst tyrants of the past 50 years. He notes that the United Nations' Special Rapporteur for Human Rights in Iraq says that Saddam Hussein's regime is comparable to the World War II-era Soviet Union under Stalin and Nazi Germany under Hitler. Saddam Hussein is reputed to have killed more than a million Iraqis -- his own people -- a figure which must be compared with Iraq's population of about 24 million. Pollack also notes that Saddam Hussein is considered to have attempted genocide against both Iraqi Kurds and Marsh Arabs, which constitute crimes against humanity.

In addition to the human rights considerations, of course, Pollack emphasized the strategic rationale for armed intervention -- Saddam Hussein's possession of biological and chemical weapons of mass destruction (WMD), and his ongoing, decades-long quest to develop or acquire nuclear weapons. Pollack considers Saddam Hussein uniquely dangerous among contemporary rulers for his view of nuclear weapons not as a defensive assurance against outside attack, but rather as an offensive enabling factor allowing him to pursue a foreign policy of aggression and conquest.

Pollack emphasized to his Indian audience that having nuclear weapons per se is not the problem. He sees India's possession of nuclear weapons, or Britain's, as non-threatening, because the governments are not expansionist or aggressive. But Saddam Hussein, by contrast, wants nuclear weapons so that Iraq can become a superpower, can control the Persian Gulf's oil and can destroy Israel. And, Pollack says, with nuclear weapons in his arsenal, he believes even the United States would be unable to effectively prevent his accomplishing those goals. Saddam Hussein's brother is famously noted as saying Iraq needs nuclear weapons in order to have a strong hand in re-drawing the map of the Middle East, Pollack said.

A questioner from Calcutta asked why war with Iraq must happen now since containment was working with U.N. inspectors in Iraq. Pollack answered that containment was not working, but failing. For instance, he said, Iraq has increased its smuggling from $300 million a year several years ago to $3 billion ($3,000 million) in 2002, enabling Saddam Hussein to acquire almost everything he needs militarily. Pollack also insisted that containment only seems to be working now because both the Security Council members and Saddam Hussein himself recognize the presence of 250,000 U.S. and coalition forces in the Persian Gulf region ready to force Saddam Hussein's hand if he does not cooperate.

Moreover, Pollack said, for containment to be effective, it must last 10-20-30 years -- the life of the current regime, including not only Saddam Hussein but also his sons, who are likely successors. Finally, the United States is not hearing anything from France or Russia that would lead it to believe either country is serious about containment, Pollack said.
 


 

Title: Predator attack
Post by: Yeager on June 24, 2003, 09:10:41 AM
As a military leader Hussein is a legitimate military target.
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Saurdaukar on June 24, 2003, 09:32:51 AM
I read on the internet that they killed Gumby's horse, Pokey, too... bastards.
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Syzygyone on June 24, 2003, 10:27:20 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Saurdaukar
I read on the internet that they killed Gumby's horse, Pokey, too... bastards.


Damn, Gumby was never a threat to the United States.  It;s just redikulus!
Title: Predator attack
Post by: rpm on June 24, 2003, 01:06:05 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Imp
I think they use Hellfire missiles like the Apache.


This Washington Post (http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2001/Apr-19-Thu-2001/news/15903646.html)  report from April 2001 has some Predator info. Predators were not designed for attack. The  X-45A (http://www.dfrc.nasa.gov/Newsroom/NewsReleases/2002/02-60.html) is a true UCAV with a 3000 lb weapons payload. Look for these bad boys in combat soon. (http://www.dfrc.nasa.gov/gallery/photo/X-45A/Small/EC02-0295-1.jpg)
Title: Predator attack
Post by: john9001 on June 24, 2003, 02:20:56 PM
saddam is the leader of the iraq freedom fighters jihad, and saddam is trying to free the oppressed people of iraq from the yoke of the imperial oil crusader infidels of the boosh/channy/halburton oil cartel.
Title: Re: Re: Predator attack
Post by: mjolnir on June 25, 2003, 08:08:35 AM
Quote
Originally posted by Staga
Its common practice for U.S to assasinate/eliminate leaders/ex-leaders of the other countries.


1959, 1963, 1969 - Norodom Sihanouk, leader of Cambodia

Wow, we killed this guy 3 seperate times over a 10 year period?  Must have been really bad.
Quote

1991 - Saddam Hussein, leader of Iraq

Yup, we assasinated him good....

Staga, where'd you get that list from?  Sounds to me like someone fed you some bad poop.
Title: Predator attack
Post by: midnight Target on June 25, 2003, 10:26:14 AM
That list is even funnier than the "Mysterious deaths around Clinton" list.
Title: Predator attack
Post by: AWMac on June 25, 2003, 10:37:16 AM
What about Kenny from South Park?:rolleyes:


:D
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Syzygyone on June 25, 2003, 11:09:38 AM
Quote
Originally posted by AWMac
What about Kenny from South Park?:rolleyes:


:D


They killed Kenny?.....


When?
Title: Predator attack
Post by: funkedup on June 25, 2003, 01:43:07 PM
OMG THEY KILLED KENNY!
Title: Predator attack
Post by: midnight Target on June 25, 2003, 03:24:40 PM
Those Bastards!
Title: Predator attack
Post by: Krusher on June 25, 2003, 03:50:55 PM
Quote
Originally posted by funkedup
OMG THEY KILLED KENNY!


Back on Air Warrior we had a scenario where a very large group of B17's were being escorted deep to Berlin. I know this really dosnt have anything to do with Kenny, but we had a fellow with the cpid Kny flying with us. There was a graphics glitch that caused his B17 to be viewed as a parachute. If you have played AW you will recall that when you bailed out you screamed all the way down. Anyhow try flying in formation with a Chute screaming Ahhhhh ahhhhh ahhhhhh ahhhhh ahhhhh all the way to berlin :)
Title: Predator attack
Post by: RacrX on June 25, 2003, 03:56:06 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Krusher
Back on Air Warrior we had a scenario where a very large group of B17's were being escorted deep to Berlin. I know this really dosnt have anything to do with Kenny, but we had a fellow with the cpid Kny flying with us. There was a graphics glitch that caused his B17 to be viewed as a parachute. If you have played AW you will recall that when you bailed out you screamed all the way down. Anyhow try flying in formation with a Chute screaming Ahhhhh ahhhhh ahhhhhh ahhhhh ahhhhh all the way to berlin :)

Thats too funny lol.
Title: That's why
Post by: Syzygyone on June 25, 2003, 04:12:37 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Krusher
Anyhow try flying in formation with a Chute screaming Ahhhhh ahhhhh ahhhhhh ahhhhh ahhhhh all the way to berlin :)


I never bailed in AW.  Sounded to *****!
Title: Predator attack
Post by: 10Bears on June 25, 2003, 05:02:47 PM
Quote
Originally posted by Ripsnort
Here is your answer Nash.



Why of course!.. we need to kill Saddam cuz Clinton told us to.  :eek: