Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Dnil on July 22, 2003, 05:10:06 PM
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PITTSTON, Pa. (AP) _ A vintage fighter jet crashed Tuesday morning in a wooded area about a mile from the Wilkes-Barre/Scranton International Airport, killing the pilot, authorities said.
The aircraft, a privately owned Hawker-Hunter, went down in Pittston Township shortly after taking off from the airport at about 9 a.m., said Federal Aviation Administration spokesman Jim Peters.
No one on the ground was hurt, Peters said. A runway at the airport was closed while the crash was investigated.
The British-made jet, of a type made predominantly in the late 1950s and early 1960s, was registered to an owner in Augusta, N.J., Peters said.
Copyright © 2003, The Associated Press
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I'm guessing engine stall. Those things don't glide well without thrust.
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(http://www.warbirdalley.com/images/hunter-chile.jpg)
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Guys privately own and fly stuff like that? Faaack me....
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They privately own bigger stuff than that - like the English Electric Lightning. A plane capable of flight at twice the speed of sound and with an amazing thrust to weight ratio even though it was designed in the 50s. I don't think the British Ministry of Defence will allow it to display in Britain because it is so capable. Or maybe it's because the company that owns it is in South Africa. One of the two anyway. :)
As for the Hunter - doesn't Switzerland still have them in service?
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After Sept. 11, 2001, there was a push to have some of these Cold Warriors "de-militarized" (i.e. rendered engineless and incapable of flight, including having the wings whacked off) because of the fact that they could fly as fast as current military jets and could be re-armed or have external tanks filled with napalm or jet fuel or other hazardous materials (biological warfare).
Fortunately, AOPA, EAA, and other GA orgs rose up and protested since it would jeopardize the value of warbirds and flying museum examples of historic aircraft.
For this particular aircraft, I recall reading that it had just been sold and was being flown to Canada. The pilot was 67, a flight instructor, and called himself "the oldest Mach 2 pilot in the world".
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Originally posted by Dowding
They privately own bigger stuff than that - like the English Electric Lightning. A plane capable of flight at twice the speed of sound and with an amazing thrust to weight ratio even though it was designed in the 50s. I don't think the British Ministry of Defence will allow it to display in Britain because it is so capable. Or maybe it's because the company that owns it is in South Africa. One of the two anyway. :)
As for the Hunter - doesn't Switzerland still have them in service?
The EE Lightning is prohibited from being flown by the CAA, along with the Buccaneer, Phantom and such like jets (I'm unsure of laws governing S.Africa). It's something to do with how many auxillery/backup systems the aircraft has, how dependant they are on backup systems and how serviceable the aircraft is to the casual owner. The main problem with getting the Vulcan back into the air is demonstrating to the CAA that you can safely keep the aircraft in the air and that you have a full electrical/engineering/spares back up with hands on experience for that particular aircraft. They may also take into account that it is still a formidable military aircraft.
As for the Hunter, I believe it left Swiss service a few years ago.
The two seat Hunter remained in RAF service until 1992/3 as it was used as the Buccaneer trainer. Boscombe Down also operated the Hunter into the 1990s as a test bed/evaluation airframe.
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There was a privately owned F-104 making the rounds of US airshows a while back.
just found this with a google search:
At least three F-104s are now flown by private owners in the USA, and several more are under restoration.
(http://www.warbirdalley.com/images/f104-02.jpg)
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BTW, found that info at Warbird Alley (http://www.warbirdalley.com/index.htm)
Very cool site for all kinds of info.
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Classic Jets operate Lightnings (unsuprisingly) Buccaneers and Hunters out of 'Thunder City' Cape Town. Currently 2 2 seater Lightnings and a single seater. Flights in the 2 seaters are availible for anyone with enough $.
http://www.classicjets.co.za/
There's also a group in the USA putting at least one back in the air. Another 2 seater T.5.
http://www.lightningusa.org/
Unfortunaely since the CAA designated them as 'complex' we're unlikely to see them in the air for at least the next 30-50 years which is a real shame. I am old enough to just remember the sight and sound of two afterburning avons going vertical at an airshow up to 40,000ft. It was pretty special.
My favourite UK based Hunter HAS to be Miss Demeanour with the psychadelic paint scheme.
(http://www.edenforge.co.uk/photo/riat01/114-1461_IMG.jpg)
They are truly beautiful aircraft, If I had the cash a Hunter would be the one I'd want to own.
Gatso
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I believe the Hunter pilot was also one of the F-104 pilots that tour the country. Not firm on that yet tho.
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Good lord, we're selling Widowmakers to civilians now? Only a matter of time before we hear of one crashing on landing.
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I'm just old enough to remember seeing lightnings display at airshows - must have been about 8 or 9 at the time. I just remember it being very loud.
Nexx - I thought funding was the only issue behind the Vulcan? The bastards at the National Lottery are quite willing to give 11 million for some London based painting that no-one really cares about, but is unwilling to splash out 3 million to secure Vulcan's future. That plane would be the star of the show across Europe.
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It's 'one' of the problems Dowding. The Vulcan is the 1st ever former military 'complex' aircraft that the CAA has given the nod too. As such the things going on behind the scenes are a great deal more complicated than normal, I think its also why the cost of getting it done has increased something like 300%.
Gatso
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Not only are they selling exmilitary British Jets to the civilians, but the beauty is there are two Mig 29's that are privately owned in the US as well as numerous Mig 23's and Mig 21's... Top that off with the Collings Foundation flying the F4 Phantom until they realised it was going to break them, and you see the direction this is headed. Give it 30 years and I bet somebody is tooling aroung in an F18 or 16 provided they have the money to operate it.
Ohh, almost forgot, two Harriers are under restoration here in the US... prolly two or three years till they fly.
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Watch out for the 104.. it's a flying brick..
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Apparentely someone has gone and registered a Harrier GR.3 so maybe this will end up down in S.Africa too?
I used to love the Lightning, although I think I'd pick the Buccaneer purely for its low-level superiority over virtually any current fighter. It was faster than a Phantom at low-level whilst carrying the same bomb load.
(http://www.f4aviation.co.uk/Oldstuff/2002/beautyorbeast/bucc.jpg)
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Woohoo
I had a friend who owned a F-104...he had a just to trade it for a WW2 bird, unsure what. If you can afford to FUEL, FLY and MAINTAIN one...all the power to you! I'd love to, but the lottery hasn't been so kind to me....
There's a cool school you can go to...Jet Warbird Center...oh, I'd love to spend a few weeks there....
http://www.jetwarbird.com/
Warning...may cause drooling and lottery ticket purchases.
"New Private Pilot Special. Come fly a 35 minute introduction flight in the rear cockpit of our L-39 then fly in the front seat of the L-39 for a one hour instructional flight. This a great opportunity to learn about flying high performance, complex aircraft and all about flying jet aircraft. Both flights plus ground training for only $2499.00"
...I'm currently pondering selling a non-vital organ....
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When did Collings decide to stop with the F-4? This was the group I was a part of when I was in Houston. I know they have an TA-4 waiting in the boneyard also. I haven't heard of this.
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Nexx - it's hard to believe we had full size carriers packed with Phantoms and Buccaneers. That was a formidable fighting force.
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Dowding, thought you might like this, scanned in from Flypast:
(http://www.btinternet.com/~nexx/HMS-ArkRoyal.jpg)
I think it was only HMS Ark Royal that had both the Phantom and Buccaneer; the others just had Buccs and Gannets. The Navy also had Hunters, not sure if they used them off carriers though.
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Originally posted by Replicant
Apparentely someone has gone and registered a Harrier GR.3 so maybe this will end up down in S.Africa too?
(http://www.f4aviation.co.uk/Oldstuff/2002/beautyorbeast/bucc.jpg)
What's that thing poking out the back? Some sort of air brake? Kinda looks like the plane had a severe lower bowel hernia.
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I also saw it in Flypast Nexx, but its always good to see it again. :) Those were the days.
gofaster - lol - yes that's the air-brake.
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The Hunter is a fine looking airplane. I don't believe that I've ever seen one before.
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There were a couple of Hunters at the Chino Air Show.
this one..
(http://www.bobafettmp.com/warbirds/Airshow03-Aircraft/Airshow03-aircraft/images/pict0002.jpg)
and this one....
(http://www.bobafettmp.com/warbirds/Airshow03-Aircraft/Airshow03-aircraft/images/pdrm0373.jpg)
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I would never want to fly in a L-29... That plane is very touchy..and gives old warbirds a bad rep for re-tried military a/c.
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Originally posted by Jack55
The Hunter is a fine looking airplane. I don't believe that I've ever seen one before.
Apart from its looks, one of the best things about the Hunter is its distinctive 'blue note' that only the Mk6 and Mk9 versions can generate. There's four cannon muzzle recesses under the nose and when the air rushes over the muzzles at around 500-600mph it generates the most amazing 'blue note' that can be heard for miles.