Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: AKWeav on August 08, 2003, 02:47:17 PM
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(sos)=same old stuff, with regards to the way things are handled there.
First the reasons I left in the first place:
1. Game refused to recognize my usb CH pro rudder pedals, had to unplug them so the twist on my MS PP would work.
2. Lack of any tech support on the part of the game providers to rectify problem 1.
3. Tired of having the plane in my sights wink out (because of a 64 plane limit).
4. Hunting to hell and back to find an airfield offering the plane I wanted to fly.
The story: Surfing around and I see where ww2ol is reactivating accounts for former subcribers for a free trial. I figure AH2 ain't here yet, so just for something to do I take them up on it.
I get my account reactivated with no problem, get the dl installed, and open up the offline practice to get everything mapped out. Problem is the MS PP has long since died, and has been replaced with a usb Saitek X-45 joystick and throttle. Still have the CH pedals.
The keymapper for ww2ol will not give any indication of which button on your controllers you're pushing, so I go into windows, controllers, advanced, and push each individual button to see which number lights up. I then write them in the Saitek manual next to the corosponding pictures of the buttons on the joystick.
Back to the ww2ol keymapper, and spend 20 minutes setting everthing up, just as I did earlier under my other account. Save everything, go back to the selections screen and grab a Spit V and launch. Hmm, views don't work, aircraft controls don't work, nothing works.
Exit out of the offline game and head to the ww2ol forums to see if anyone has an answer. See, that the way it works there. Need tech support? You have to get it from the community, and that may or may not work. It can be a long process.
Anyway, I head to the forums, get logged in, and try to start a post in the "Hanger" (dedicated to discussions of the air side of things). When I click on the start a new post button, I'm rewarded with the message: "It appears you have a trial reactivation account. Only members with a premium account may post on these boards."
I could only laugh. I have no more energy to waste in generating any frustration with these folks (CRS).
Is it any wonder why when their customers post on other games boards to try and get people to try ww2ol, that they are met with such distain and intolerance?
I would venture that there are most likely more ex/customers out there who have had a negitive experience with that group then positive. Mine have certainly not been positive in nature, in any of the mutiple times I have tried their product.
Nuff said, I now leave you to go and de-activate my trial account, and remove that waste of harddrive space from same.
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LOL i did the same damn thing it took em 2 days to send me my creen name and password (i figured it out first)
Still a crappy crappy game and the support sucks balls!
only thing i got good to say about it is it has nice explosions!
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A friend of mine, who I convinced about a year and a half ago to try WW2OL, forwarded the offer they sent him to me with only a 2 word comment:
"as if"
I must have sat and played with his machine for about 40 hours back then because he had the dreaded "head-shaking" bug due to the fact that he had a Dell. That doesn't count the hours of discussions on the BB attempting to find an answer.
Then CRS released a patch which fixed it after essentially denying that there WAS a bug....tough to deny anything when they never actually responded to my e-mails, it was more like the fanboys who would say that it wan't the game it was his machine.
No way am I spending the time trying to do what you did...no way.
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Lol, alittle more to the story: can't find any way to delete the trial account:D And of course, no way to get help doing so!:D :D :D
Guess I'll just have to let the trial run out.:rolleyes:
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I don't think there is a need to delete the account (from my experience with past free trials on WWIIOL).
MiniD
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The GUI still sucks herring turds, I still get killed thru base walls, my available weapons are now limited to just the rifle, pistol and grenade for I'm a lowly ranking soldier (bless those selfless, magnanimous players who post missions with goodies), enemy and friendly contacts still wink in & out a lot (obviously the con bias issue is still there), dying to sudden, soundless shots is still a crowd pleaser, enemy infantry continue to walk and run like they're on the moon's surface, soldiers still have to use Q and E to look left and right 45deg, my radio requests for help and queries on where to go to help out go ignored and I still cannot use my CH sticks 8-way hat which I like to use in aircombat.
So just what is new?
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ROFLMAO, easiest thing I've ever done regarding my computer and ww2ol was getting it off my HD. Everything worked as advertised!:cool: No tech help needed. ;)
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god those damn flat bushes real bug me! or the stupid tree snagging your tankas you try to go under it!
Man that game still needs major work!
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I've found the latest version (1.90) very playable. I've been a strong critic of WW2OL since it's BETA but it's changed a hell of a lot. The keymapper is a huge improvement over what it used to be. The 64 player view limit has caught me out sometimes but not all that often, most instances of this may stem from poor SA as the icon system IMHO is one of the best ever used in a MMOG, combine this with the lack of a Linda Blair view you have to be a lot more vigilant so you don't get bounced.
The radio system still leaves a lot to be desired, I have gotten used to it but it's not as intuitive as others more tried and tested solutions, seems they went for something different and were not quite sure what that 'different' was going to be.
The graphical 'chunks' are a huge improvement from the old way of displaying damage but still not far enough but this is under review and the way it is now is not really a show stopper for me.
I'm not a RL pilot so it's hard to comment on the FM's but they do feel a lot more believeable than before. The luftwobbles are already moaning they can't turn fight without their Messerschmitt Tri-Plane from version 1.8x :) Now they have to use boom and zoom tactics to survive although I feel the experienced 109 pilot will still be able to mix it up but right now most of them are too busy moaning about Allied bias :D I like the way in WW2OL you take off across a bumpy airfield and without some care you'll end up stuck in a bush where as in WB or AH you can just go full throttle and not have to worry to much about flaps etc, the planes especially the bombers do really 'feel' heavy.
The gunnery is more challenging, how realistic this is I don't know but it feels more realistic compared to guncams from history archives for planes of that era.
The mission system really needs fleshing out it feels like more of a placeholder than anything and you do see a lot of lone wolves in the arena just using a mission to launch without bothering to check it's goal or to fly with others or even fly to the designated target. That being said as as happened in AH it does offer the facility for players to link up properly with a common radio channel and the organisations behind the two sides have put up some good missions. The attrition system at first can be frustrating but it soon teaches you the value of landing your aircraft and I've not seen the kind of gamey suicide tactics used in other sims like AH or WB.
Bombing is where WW2OL really keeps my interest, it's a shame there were so many show stoppers before v1.9o for me as right from the start CRS have opted for realistic bombsights that require time and skill to use to good effect and requires good co-ordination between the bombardier and his pilot. I wish all online sims would use realistic bombsights.
The graphics won't win any awards but this sim is a few years old now but does still cut the mustard for me. A terrain fileld with landmarks that can be used in conjunction with a printed map means GPS is not needed and the lack of inflight radar is very refreshing yet it's still easy to find a fight. I like flying low on the way back home from a mission following roads skipping over lines of trees and watching hedgerows whizz by. The ack is'nt uber here and it is possible to fly across a city and take only a few pings and not loose vital parts from an uber accurate otto. The cockpits are nicely done apart from the unreadable instruments at 800x600 res, at 1024x768 it's much improved and you can make out the information you need from the dials without always having to drop to instrument view. I like the restrictive view system, IMO it's more realistic than some sims I've played.
It's got it's bugs there is no denying that, some may find them show stoppers such as the 64 player limit but as I said this has effected me only a few times but I do wish there was perhaps an option to switch the bias of this 64 limiot depending on what you were doing so if you flew planes you could tell the system to show 64 planes first and not ground units as well and vice versa, perhaps even have it a toggle option as you select you mission so if you're up high in a bomber you can bias towards planes, if you're going to jabo then perhaps leave it the way it is and if you're on the ground bias towards GV's etc. The damage model needs serious attention but it is being worked on and CRS are now delivering on the promises they made, it may be too late for some but if you're a flightsim fan you're doing yourself a dis-service by not taking up the offer of a free trial and finding out about this sim for yourself.
I'm sure some smart mouth with an agenda will want to quote and tear this post apart, save yourself some time I'm not going to be responding. I saw the thread and popped in my two cents, don't agree? don't like it? tough sh*t
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Not tearing anything here revin, but the original post has nothing to do with playability of the game, but with customer support issues as pertains to the providers of the game.
Hell, can't even check that stuff out if ya can't get the controllers to work.:rolleyes:
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I think all the major players in the flight sim world should take a page from the Aces High customer support page. By far, HiTech Creations has the best technical and customer support.
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The keymappers not that bad, once you get the hang of it. I think its because it caters to vehicles, infantry, and aircraft its so complex. I have a TM FLCS stick, TQS throttle, and CH USB Pro Pedals setup fine on it.
The single shot kills? Well, thats kind of like the 'cheaters' in AH :) - in real life how common was it to hear the shot that got you?
Last night I was pissing around and nailed I guy in a Church tower with a fairly long shot. What happens next? The handsomehunk respawns and goes right back there and I nailed him again.
The flight side is still 'sloppy', its improving. But there are things such as no structural damage modeled on aircraft (only control surfaces, pilot, fuel, engine and associated engine fluids).
The ground war is really what its all about, and I find the game at its best riding with my rifle on the back of a panzer into a big battle. Then you realise the air campaign is secondary so it doesn't matter the FM/DM in the air isn't as sweet as AH.
It probably took me a month before I got comfortable with the gameplay, control setup etc. Its definitely not a 5 minute job to setup.
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The keymapper is a huge improvement over what it used to be...
It does look better and it's appears to be easier to use but it still has (for me) the same bugs as the original. But for most people I imagine it looks and operates eaier than the old version.
The 64 player view limit has caught me out sometimes but not all that often, most instances of this may stem from poor SA as the icon system IMHO is one of the best ever used in a MMOG, combine this with the lack of a Linda Blair view you have to be a lot more vigilant so you don't get bounced.
The cons vanishing has always been a show stopper for me - be it when I'm ina vehicle or in the air. It's the vehicles, EI or the plane right in front of me, that I'm watching/tracking, that simply go poof. It happens every time I play, every spwna session and anywhere on the map. It's not the enemy that snuck up on me I'm complaining about ;)
The graphical 'chunks' are a huge improvement.. not really a show stopper for me.
Not a true show stopper. It is an immersion sinker for me however. Same with being unable to bail out.
I'm not a RL pilot so it's hard to comment on the FM's but they do feel a lot more believeable than before.
Ditto!
I like the way in WW2OL you take off across a bumpy airfield and without some care you'll end up stuck in a bush where as in WB or AH you can just go full throttle and not have to worry to much about flaps etc,
Semi-ditto. It feels nice and real until.. the undercarriage is accidentally retracted and you still zoom along on and IN the ground, engine running without a hick-up and you have laugh as you lower the gear again to continue the takeoff unscathed ;)
I wish all online sims would use realistic bombsights...
BIG ditto. I was glad HTC changed the simple "point and click" method AH once had. Even then what he added is still a long way from anything realisticand what I would prefer. WWIIO has icons, terrain and bombing down better than al the others.
I'm sure some smart mouth with an agenda will want to quote and tear this post apart...
Nah :) Nothing to rip apart IMO. Your opinion is valid (and always been respected by me whethr expressed here on when IRead it on AGW) and more imoprant (to me) your not trying to shove developer mantra or the "PRl" down anyones throat unlike Hardace & Zerohead. All that keeps me from playing WWIIO are the disappearing cons and the lack of CH 8-way hat support. Much of the rest is tolerable till it gets changed (radio and the GUI for instance).
Westy
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The keymappers not that bad, once you get the hang of it
True, they work quite well when the game recognizes your particular controllers. The problem lies in when it doesn't. You're hosed unless someone on their bbs has the answer.
Not having access to that bbs, plus no help from CRS is what prompted this post. Nothing to do with game features or playability.
I could go on about how with bated breath I followed the development of the game for two years. I participated in the beta as much as my lowly P2 at that time would let me. How I preordered the game for 50 bucks prior to release. How utterly deflated I was when it did come out. The frustration of trying to reactivate my account when 1.80 was released, and getting the game to run on my P4, 512ram with higher than 5-15fps. The hours spend adjusting the scaling on the MS PP so the slightest twist on the rudder wouldn't throw the plane out of control. Those same hours spent working on elevator control so it wouldn't spike suddenly killing my pilot in a nano second from gee overload. How after all that work, I was still dying to 109s out flat turning my hawk 75, only to finally saddle up on a enemy plane with a good shooting solution, to have him vanish from in front of me. Nah, won't go into all those other frustrations.
I think all the major players in the flight sim world should take a page from the Aces High customer support page. By far, HiTech Creations has the best technical and customer support.
Ahmen to that!
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One comment on flight models. This not only pertains to WW2OL but every other flight sim I have tried.
No one seems to model ground effect at all. In real life when I land my ultralight I come in steep and fast and then flair about 10' off the ground. The last 10' the planes really wants to stay off the ground. The air under the wing gets compressed as it is being pushed down and the ground stops its flow. The net effect is you really notice a difference when you come to round out. In WW2OL et all you just keep decending at the same rate and slam into the ground if you do over correct when you flair.
I would love to see ground effect modeled just for the fun of having a more realistic landing.
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IL2 has the effect, Habu.
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Originally posted by Habu
No one seems to model ground effect at all.
http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=76759
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"The problem lies in when it doesn't. You're hosed unless someone on their bbs has the answer. "
Too true. This week I finally set up my CH analog hotas onto my new pc at home and while AH, WB's and T: all recognze the stick, throttle and pedals. Tonight I flew AH and then went to WWIIO to see if the airwar was as good as Spitboy made it sound does like in his AGW posts. But WWIIO does not see the stuff at all. Not a single of the 4 axis is recognized. It sees no button presses from the gear except Joy1 and 2 on the stick. But no movement. I was going to go beyond being a solider for the next 2 days remaining on the freeby. Try aircraft and vehicles again but having seen thier cust support inaction for the past couple of years and board queries get red herring answers (if any). Toss'n in the towel, again. Too much I dislike about the state it was and still is in for me to over come. I lack patience for fiddling with it and I ran out of wishing on it's potential long ago. Still, I'm a sucker for a free trial :)
But to make my "flight night" worse I can't even try Target. Flanders, Korea or Rabaul. Every time I try to join a server, except the training server, I get an error message about missing acm files. A different one each time I try to join a scenario. So I gave up trying that our too. Maybe when it's further along in open beta. (set alarm clock for 10 am Sat, May 2006). I'm especially disappointed in it's performance given what graphics one gets at this stage and my AMD 2400+ and GF2 can only wheeze a mere 7fps while flying & testing alone in the bland, empty training arena.
Hurry up AH-II. PLEASE! I can't take the MA any more. Off to the CT....
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Originally posted by AKWeav
True, they work quite well when the game recognizes your particular controllers. The problem lies in when it doesn't. You're hosed unless someone on their bbs has the answer.
The trick is in the way you answer the question... for example:
"I have a CH Flightstick Pro and WW2OL doesn't see it, can someone please help me?" - usually gets nothing.
whereas:
"This POS game is worthless, its crap, CRS are a bunch of losers who can't program support for my CH Flightstick Pro, I QUIT" - usually has the solution posted in under 5 minutes.
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i have been playing wwwiionline free trial last few days and i have been impressed. my first free trial i played it once and i thought it sucked, now i quite enjoy it and i may even take up an account there because i like the progress they are making.
My 2 complaints are:
1) damage model sux, the 109 has smart cannon shells where one ping will always hit the pilot. .303's are useless and it takes far too long at close range to kill anything.
2) the pilots there suck. my first ever sortie i get 3 kills, it is 3 vs me and i shoot them all down. I average about 3 kills a sortie there, can you imagine a newb doing that in Aces High? a little acm goes a long way there.
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AKweav,
I don't understand two things:
1) why did you have to actually take up the button numbers
I really don't understand this one
2) how can you possibly spend 20 minutes doing simple keymapping, unless you're changing the keymaps upside down or making invidual keymaps for several vehicles.
Always when I have set the keymaps, it's been about two minutes of work - about as fast as with most games.
Never had a need to know "which buttons" I'm pressing, since it's always been enough to press the button and all I've had to remember, has been what button does what.
I mean.. what have you been doing!? :confused:
It's really making me wonder....
Oh.. and I got the X45 as well...
(let me guess, you thought you have to use the keyboard to input the joystick button #'s in the keymapper, instead of simply pressing the buttons for each keymapper setting? :p )
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The keymapper for ww2ol will not give any indication of which button on your controllers you're pushing
? I'm not sure I understand. If I want button 1 (trigger) to fire primary weapon, all I do is double-click the space in the joystick column that corresponds to 'fire primary weapon', and press the trigger. Then "joystick 1 button 1" appears in that box. It's also weird that the game would detect an input in the keymapper, but not detect it once you spawn in. Not sure what the heck's going on there, but apparently it doesn't matter much any more :)
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) why did you have to actually take up the button numbers
In the AH keymapper, press a button on your joystick and it will highlight a number in the keymapper screen. The AH keymapper is straight forward, and user friendly. AH even has an ingame calibration tool.
Not so in the WW2OL keymapper. To map a button in WW2OL, you have to first delete the default keyboard key, then use the mouse cursor to click a button or keyboard key indicated on the screen. Simply pressing the button on the joystick will do nothing.
The MS PP had each button's number cast into the js next to the buton. The Saitek does not, nore does the manual call these buttons out. Other than the hat, you need to know what functions you are assigning to each button. If you have a Saitek X-45, you know there are several, as well as three seperate sliders.
how can you possibly spend 20 minutes doing simple keymapping, unless you're changing the keymaps upside down or making invidual keymaps for several vehicles.
Setting up AH, the game automaticly recognizes and assigns views to your joysticks 8 way hat switch. Not WW2OL. These must be assigned, along with up and down views, primary guns, secondary guns, deploy weapons, etc, etc. You even have to assign a slider to the throttle.
WW2OL's keymapper is more cumbersome then AH's, but it does work, and it's easy to figure out.
Keymapper difficulties were not the heart of this post. The game would not recognize my controllers, and I had no way to resolve the problem. There is no way to contact them regarding tech help. That must be accquired through the community via the bbs. An item which was closed to me by virtue of being a "trial" subcriber.
The last time I tried the game, it wouldn't reconize the subscription key on the CD I pre-orderd 3 months prior to release. It took three days of communication with Hardcase on this very bbs to get that ironed out. Then there were some performance issues to iron out, and the help for them could only be obtained through the WW2OL bbs. That took a week to find a good fix for.
Just the last of many straws. Unfortunate really, as the game has so much potential, I'm sure that as time goes by most of these will be ironed out. The frustration I've encountered each time I've tried it precludes me ever giving it another go.
When I pay money to play a game online, I want to have fun, not get frustrated. I don't mind working through some issues, but an inability to get direct feedback from the provider, or having to jump 20 hurdles prior to doing so is just too much effort, and I refuse to accelerate my heartrate over that particular product again.
Maybe some one with WW2OL bbs priviledges can post a link to this thread so the Rats might see the perspective some on the outside world have.
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Not so in the WW2OL keymapper. To map a button in WW2OL, you have to first delete the default keyboard key, then use the mouse cursor to click a button or keyboard key indicated on the screen. Simply pressing the button on the joystick will do nothing.
I've never ever had to delete the default keyboard/stick keys/buttons when assigning joystick command for the same command.
Also it's been enough for me to select the command slot I want to change and then press button on the stick - correctsponding button number appears in the keymapper position I had chose to change.
Only thing I've had to press in the joystick button etc. areas in the games keymapper, has been the one which sets which direction the command reads axis input.
aka which direction on the axis is maximum/minimum setting.
Never had problems with working out X45 or CH's CS F16 in WWIIOL myself, whilst had windows 98 and XP.
the WWIIOL setup does recognize at least my joystick inputs in the keymapper when I want to set a button for command.
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Why CRS would close off their BBS is beyond me. According to my dad, there were too many complaints by non-subscribers and ex-subscribers, so they closed it off to them. If so many complained, should that tell CRS something?
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Originally posted by Weavling
Why CRS would close off their BBS is beyond me. According to my dad, there were too many complaints by non-subscribers and ex-subscribers, so they closed it off to them. If so many complained, should that tell CRS something?
That people whines about one issue with 20 separate threads and remains inobjective all time?
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the WWIIOL setup does recognize at least my joystick inputs in the keymapper when I want to set a button for command.
Lucky you. But what would you do if it didn't, and you were a trial member and didn't have bbs priviliges to ask for help? Would you sign up and pay one months subcription just to get some kind of assistance to try out the game?
That people whines about one issue with 20 separate threads and remains inobjective all time?
One of Demming's principles of World Class Competetiveness is that customer complaints are "gems to be mined". In other words, finding out what your customers/prospective customers expect is paramount to good business practices.
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AKweav,
I'd try to solve the problem WHY I couldn't do so.
With such popular stick setup as X45, I would conclude it should work with WWIIOL and the problem is somewhere between the game and OS.
Then it'd be simple to do checklist to go through.
I don't usually mind to wait for the REPLIES from any technical supports.
Only times I've had fast response from some technical support, it's been from KeyTronic EU representive.
If it is like a week or two free trial and you're just a trial member, you can usually wait for most of the free trial time pass before you _might_ get the issue solved.
and thats pretty much regardless of the game.
You asked what I'd do.. so don't blame me for the mr. do it all by self attitude :D
Thats what I'd do.
One of Demming's principles of World Class Competetiveness is that customer complaints are "gems to be mined". In other words, finding out what your customers/prospective customers expect is paramount to good business practices.
roughly put, 95% of the volume is useless whining, not something constructive you can base your game on.
Some volume is for no reason and the other volume is just whines on top of whines where nobody says anything constructive - just keeps yelling something silly.
....and isn't most of the LW complaints over here at HTC boards handled as plain luftwhine and no changes are to be made? :D
It's the same all over.
In WWIIOL forums are worse - it's the twilight zone between hardcore and quanker player communities.
Have you ever checked into counter strike or day of defeat forums?
If you have, then you might understand why it isn't as possible to listen to every customer issue on the forums.
Anyway...
the devs do look at the WWIIOL HQ forums, so they *do* listen to what customers expect.
but like said above...
I'm sure this demming (lemming? :>) guy had a different kind of business in his mind..
You dont develop games like you develop cars for example, what comes to customer prospects.
btw. a little remark... I do prefer common sense.
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With such popular stick setup as X45, I would conclude it should work with WWIIOL and the problem is somewhere between the game and OS.
Absolutly, it should work, and it does with all of the other flight sim games I have loaded on my PC. I have read posts on their bbs (ww2ol) of others having the same set up as mine, and theirs working fine.
I had the same problem the last time I tried ww2ol. At that time I was using a different PC, XP PRO OS, MS PP j/s, and the CH Pro pedals. The only fix anyone could come up with was to unplug the pedals. That worked, for the time I played the game.
Now with the new PC, XP Home OS, X-45 j/s and throttle, and the same CH Pro pedals. Sure I can unplug the pedals again, but the rudder butterfly on the X-45 is for beans. More like a on or off situation.
Why hasn't mine worked under two different scenarios? No clue. But then again I have no clue either as to why I have no problems with any of the other programs which use these controllers. An uneducated guess might lead some to suspect something to do with the program with which they won't work.
I don't usually mind to wait for the REPLIES from any technical supports.
I don't either. But I do expect some sort of reply the next day. An acknowledgement, or something to start a dialog toward resolving the problem. I have received nothing to date.
Only times I've had fast response from some technical support, it's been from KeyTronic EU representive.
I've had same day responses from HTC. It's been three days now and nothing from ww2ol.
You asked what I'd do.. so don't blame me for the mr. do it all by self attitude
Not quite sure what you mean by "for the mr"? But as far as attitude goes, I think I've maintained a good one so far. You've seen no explitives, no ranting or raving. I even chuckled when I discovered I couldn't post on their bbs for help.
Fishu, if you have an account with ww2ol, please post a link to this post in the "Hanger" section of their bbs. Reading some of the replies might be interesting. Also it might help CRS to be more proactive in helping others.
I have more to say, but a thunder storm is brewing right now so I'll post this part for now.
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The mister thing was about me and my 'fix it all by self' talk.
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The mister thing was about me and my 'fix it all by self' talk.
Ah. It's impressive that you have that knowledge. I'm afraid I don't at this time. Perhaps you have a suggestion of something I need to do to have wwwol recognize my controllers, when all of the other programs I run have no such problems?
Now to finish the post which was so rudely interupted by the thunder storm :p
roughly put, 95% of the volume is useless whining,
You mean like this? http://www5.playnet.com/bv/wwiiolhq/dg_message.jsp?group_id=8863&parent_id=3076980&BV_SessionID=@@@@1415355562.1060538685@@@@&BV_EngineID=eadcichfmhfdbjjcgmcggichhl.0
or this? http://www5.playnet.com/bv/wwiiolhq/dg_message.jsp?group_id=8863&parent_id=3088897&BV_SessionID=@@@@1415355562.1060538685@@@@&BV_EngineID=eadcichfmhfdbjjcgmcggichhl.0
Sure there are some of these: http://www5.playnet.com/bv/wwiiolhq/dg_message.jsp?group_id=8863&parent_id=3088097&BV_SessionID=@@@@1415355562.1060538685@@@@&BV_EngineID=eadcichfmhfdbjjcgmcggichhl.0
We have them here too, but our bbs is open to all who play nice;) When they don't, the thread simply gets locked. There are a few locked ones there also.:eek:
I'm sure this demming (lemming? :> ) guy had a different kind of business in his mind..
The core of any business concept is to deliver a product that meets/exceeds customer expectations. This has nothing to do with production methods. Ergo, weather you're producing cars, airplanes, software, or ice cream cones, the principal is the same. Classic examples of failures to follow these would be the Edsel, or AMC Matador. Sure some folks bought them at first, but how long did they last?
Btw Fishu, do you have an account with ww2ol? Are you willing to post a link to this thread in the Hanger?
btw. a little remark... I do prefer common sense.
Ditto! ;)
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I "do" have an account but I haven't had the money to pay for it lately..
What comes to your problems, I don't really know what to say since I don't have any experience with the kind of systems you're using.
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Never had problems with working out X45 or CH's CS F16 in WWIIOL myself, whilst had windows 98 and XP.
Oh.. and I got the X45 as well...
The mister thing was about me and my 'fix it all by self' talk.
What comes to your problems, I don't really know what to say since I don't have any experience with the kind of systems you're using.
Gee, thanks for all your useful replies. :rolleyes:
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Weave I've used WW2OL with all sorts of combinations of X45, Ch FS Pro Gameport, CH Throttle GamePort, CH Pedals USB and gameport, TM FLCS/TQS (stickworks) and TM Elite Pedals. All under XP and all worked fine.
The problem I've found is the way you program the axis. In AH for example you select the control input and assign the axis from a list. By default WW2OL tries to be 'smart', and detects which axis is being moved.
My current setup has the TM FLCS, TQS with the elite pedals off to one side (for some reason it will not detect without the pedals plugged in), and CH Pro Pedals USB under the desk. The elite pedals spike. So whenever I click an axis they get 'pasted' in automatically.
So what I do is find the axis I want, click on joystick from the top menu. Then manually select the stick and axis QUICKLY so the game doesn't autodetect the elite pedals spiking away in the background.
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The problem is the game doesn't see any controllers as long as the pedals are plugged in. Unplug the pedals, the j/s is there. Plug em back in, all gone.:(
This happens just with ww2ol. It has manifested itself through two different machines, and two operating systems (XP Pro, XP Home). Maybe someone is trying tell me something.:rolleyes:
So what I do is find the axis I want, click on joystick from the top menu. Then manually select the stick and axis QUICKLY so the game doesn't autodetect the elite pedals spiking away in the background.
Not sure if I understand this. Clicking on the joystick tab at the top of the screen changes the profile from a keyboard, to an axis configuration. There are joystick selections from 1 through 4, but no information as to which would be the X-45, or the CH Pro rudders. Am I missing something? :eek:
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10 hour shifts with 3 days off every week does have it’s merits. Coupled with having to shell out tons of funds in bills this week though, sitting in front of the computer for 2 days instead of going out for the rest of the weekend to save any remaining fun funds may or may not have been a bonus this week. I took it as a time to try lotsa new games. Free time at home if you will.
First was DOD. I told ack-ack what I thought about it. BF1942 it ain’t. Good free download though. A 1 hour distraction. Off to the TV and doing chores.
Then Madden 2003. Maybe Funky can explain it, I know the career mode with stats is supposed to be good, but I lost interest very quickly. I did learn to dig the Microsoft gamepad I got at a garage sale for a buck $1 though. And scoring a long run against the Bears WAS cool. I just missed the whole picture I guess.
Most important, I then I dug through the game pile and got out the “WWIIOL Reader Choice” box. I thankfully downloaded the entire new patch unlike last X-mas when I got the turd game for the second time. (I bought the initial release but I’ll not discuss that.)
The Reader Choice Edition CD second time around made me download patch after patch after patch via auto-update. This time I got the current patches, and installing it was a snap. I re-registered and went to offline to play.
It’s been said before, but getting a Saitek X45 and USB Pro CH Pedals to work is damn near impossible. Certainly a savvy computer gamer would figure it out, I kinda did, but my god, never did get it to work right.
I finally took off in a Hurricane C, and with full rudder deflection was able to fly through billboard trees. What is with that btw? I liked the speed sensation though, then I crashed because I couldn’t set it up nor hold the rudder anymore.
I also tried the tanks, the GUI is so intuitive isn’t it, lol. I at least started the tank.
I then went back to their webpage and tried to join the training group to find answers. I couldn’t get online, I guess no membership till I get an account, so no training. I did register; I’m still waiting for an email response. Well, I was, but now I won’t for the 3rd time deal with it.
The bottom line is regardless if this game is the best thing going, who is in charge of the interface and what is that position called?
Fire them and fast.
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Lol, I keep checking on the status of my original ticket with their "tech support". Friggin thing hasn't even been assigned to anyone yet.
I think maybe they'er too busy dealing with their current customer base and their endless complaints about the tri-wing 109F.:rolleyes:
Check it out here: http://www5.playnet.com/bv/wwiiolhq/dg_message.jsp?group_id=8863&parent_id=3096315&BV_SessionID=@@@@1134554926.1060693335@@@@&BV_EngineID=dadcicieilelbjjcgmcggichhl.0
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I've never seen a game that I have and still want to throw money at to actually try and enjoy, have so many obstacles to prevent that from happening.
Like they are saving people from cheating them.
Unbelievable. The irony is too much.
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Creamo you need a mentor to get you going. I had one and within an hour I went from total newbie to killing machine. Well not quite but at least I knew what was going on.
If you want I can help you out.
email me and I can walk you through the tanks and other stuff pretty quick. Send me an email at chairstore@on.aibn.com and I will set up a time when we can work it out. Do you have Team Speak?
The game is really fun but as you said frustrating when you first get in it.
I keep multiple subs active for my flight sim game, ww2ol etc. I play them all. But WW2OL is the best game for simulating a war.
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Ill get Teamspeak, and yup, Ill email you on Friday.
TY.
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I had a flight last night in a hurri IIc. I got over target in Achel and started scanning for tanks to bomb. That's when I saw a call for help on the radio buffer. Some guys were attacking Achel from the north and they had 2 panzers and a 232 that had them pinned down about a mile out of town. I got lucky and actually hit both panzers in one pass, one with each bomb. Then I made a flaming hulk out of the 232 that had been machine gunning our troops. Our inf was able to advance :) Then for the rest of my ammo load I hit opels full of german inf being transported from the next town over :D
Point being, I actually had a small positive effect on the battle field below me. It's amazing how fast the tide of battle can change when you get some CAS in the area. I've seen major attacks stopped or helped out just by 2 or 3 planes showing up.
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Creamo
That is my work email so just send an email anytime and I will give you my home email. I don't want to post it anywhere as currently I get no spam at all.
Regarding flying through trees. You were flying through bushes. I can vouch that if you hit a tree you will get a totally different result.
Also I use a MS FFB joystick for WW2OL. I didn't have any trouble at all setting it up. For what they cost you might want to get a cheapie joystick to use for driving tanks etc. You can fly with it as well although it has a twist rudder.
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It’s been said before, but getting a Saitek X45 and USB Pro CH Pedals to work is damn near impossible.
Also I use a MS FFB joystick for WW2OL. I didn't have any trouble at all setting it up. For what they cost you
So maybe I should throw the Saitek, and the CH pedals in the trash, and go buy a cheap Gravis and I would be in like Flynn? :p
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Basically.
Yes. :D
At least until you try the game and like it enough to spend the time to get the pedels to work.
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Basically.
Yes.
Dunno what it is, but something is terribly wrong with that concept. :p
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I use a saitek x-45. I use the throttle and leave the stick sitting behind the desk. I then have an old gameport ch combatstick to use as my stick, with ch pro pedals attached to the combatstick. All works fine for me.
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Originally posted by Udie
Point being, I actually had a small positive effect on the battle field below me. It's amazing how fast the tide of battle can change when you get some CAS in the area. I've seen major attacks stopped or helped out just by 2 or 3 planes showing up.
This where the game excels, is the combined ops side. If tardcase and zeroknowledge actually realised that they'll never sell AH players on the FM and damage model and focussed on this stuff they'd do a much better job.
I love playing infantry, rifleman. Usually I ride the lead tank in when 3rd Panzergruppe are making an attack, dismount and scout ahead hunting out ATGs and spotting enemy tanks for our 88's. Its very satisfying being the eyes and ears at the front of an assault, or taking out an ATG knowing you've saved a few Panzers.
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That is my specialty as well-I scout, both in offensive and defensive situations. If you are a lone wulf, this is what you can do to really help. Just be sure that the people you are giving positions to understand the directions as given.
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heres my take on trying the ww2ol demo offline. I tried gettign online but had trouble getting a free trial account activated and didnt feel like bothering with the online part for the moment.
as far as keymapper unfriendliness i had some of that but nothing that wasnt fixable with basic logic and problem solving skills (its not friendly but usable and I would call ww2ol keymapper DOS and AH keymapper WinXP).
but the in game stuff to me is quite kick bellybutton as far as detail and intuitive use goes...
tanks:
the tanks function about like AH tanks (driver, gunner, commander) but can only be steered while driving. but these tanks have all the features i wish AH tanks had (button,unbotton hatches, actual crew member modelling, real gunsight zoom capability modeling etc etc)
planes:
(I'm a pilot, Ive flown t6 texan too so ive flown a warbird sort of :) ) AH flight modelling feels more accurate in the low speed stall range and ah is far from perfect too. but the planes in ww2ol though marvelous in normal flight envelope with superior sense of traveling through air (ah feels like its on rails) suffers in the E retention and stall/spin departure department. the one below stall speed maneuver that nehaves more realistic in ww2ol is the hammerhead (in AH wierd things happen when doing a hammerhead) landscape in WW2ol is much better than AH as you dont need GPS and can navigate by landmarks wich any pilot finds a great feature for increasing immersion and realism. view system is standard nonmovable 3d cockpit with no direct 6 view wich i like the no direct linda blair view but AH head movement save view is the true realism way to do a3d view system simulating pilot head movement in cockpit.
didnt try the guns or infantry yet.
not sure if i want to bother with the hassle of dealing with CRS with all the hoops I had to go through just to find a demo ( I already tried buying the game in stores and it was in none)
so they may get one less customer here just for the difficulty they have given the customer (me) in obtaining and using their product in even the simplest online free 1 week trial. is enough hassle learning a new game and dying over and over the added hassle of dealing with hurdle after hurdle in trying to even play this game makes it almost not worth the bother.
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I agree with ya there cit. Someone forgot the K.I.S.S. principle over there. I absolutely dispise the browser game launcher, whoever thought of that should be shot.
To me WWIIOL is like how I play golf. 90% of the time I am so frustrated I wanna go on a rampage. Then there is the 10%, the perfect drive, the perfect putt, that keeps you coming back.
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dealing with hurdle after hurdle in trying to even play this game makes it almost not worth the bother.
Exactly my point:D
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You know I simply downloaded the complete version. Installed it. Plugged in my USB FFB joystick and I was away to the races.
I know some people have problems but I had none.
I have a pretty fast system with a great graphics card so that may have helped.
I don't know why you guys seem to have so many problems. My neighbor who also plays could not get it to work at first but the problem was just a simple driver upgrade for his graphics card.
There are tons of people in the game right now so I don't think the problems you are having are widespread.
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There are loads of problems Habu, a lot of guys in the squad I'm in are having them. And these are guys who have been playing for a long time.
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Installed it. Plugged in my USB FFB joystick and I was away to the races.
So when you're ready to graduate to a set of usb rudder peddals, please let us know if the game still see's your j/s when you plug em in.
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Just a technical note.
I run USB X45 combined with gameport CH Pro Pedals under XP.
The gameport always ends up device #1. WW2O didn't have any trouble seeing all the axes on all my controllers (neither do AH, WB3, or GPL when I leave the gameport stuff in and plug in Logi MOMO USB wheel).
I did have a bit of confusion with the keymapper when I first tried to set up WW2O mapping yaw; I kicked right rudder and it 'saw' "Joystick 1 Rz axis+" which actually meant that the center of the rudders was full left in game and center was half-way pressing right rudder. Oops. Once I saw that, remapping by kicking the rudder back and forth resulted in "Joystick 1 Rz axis" (with no + sign) which worked.
There oughta be a display as in AH and WB3 where you can see your axes work before you fly.
On the negative side, since getting a CD key real life has severely interfered with me and I haven't put 30 seconds of online flight time into WW2O.
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WW2OL seems to have a real problem with USB pedals. Why I have no clue. I'm willing to bet though, if my rudder pedals were analog, I too would be in like Flynn.
Btw, just checked my ticket number in WW2OL Support, they have assigned it to someone with the initials NA.:confused: I'm sure Mr. or Ms. NA will get right on it.:p
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Originally posted by AKWeav
So when you're ready to graduate to a set of usb rudder peddals, please let us know if the game still see's your j/s when you plug em in.
LOL! That'll leave a mark. :)
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I've got an x45 USB and a set of CH Pro Pedals USB (THANKS HTC!!! :D) I've never had a problem with WW2OL recognising them. I have, however, had problems in the pas with windows not seeing my x45 (or the x36 i used to have).
The WW2OL keymapper may be a dog to use, but it really is a very powerful tool. I don't use my SGE software with WW2 OL, there really is no need. You can assign just about any ingame function to any axis (or 1/2 axis) or button on your HOTAS. It is very confusing to the beginner though....
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Ya know, what controllers WW2OL recognizes, and which it doesn't, who has what set up and it works just fine, is not what prompted me to start this ever growing monster.
What started it is a customer (me) with a tech problem, that the game provider (WW2OL) does not seem to have the time, or the will to address. I'm sure there is some little tweak, that I, in my ignorance don't know about which would have solved the issue.
I couldn't ask for help from the community, because as a trial customer I don't get to use their bbs.
It's been over 5 days and they have yet to assign someone to work my request for tech support. That tells me one of two things. Either they don't care, or they are overwelmed by hords of other people with tech problems.
Either way, not a good scenario. :rolleyes:
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sorry to hear that weave, I don't understand it though. Many people talk of the good service they get (tech support) but just as many complain about how much it sucks. I dunno... I do know that over on AGW killer, hatch and doc doom have helped people out there.
It's a shame, it really is a kick bellybutton game now. Anything I could help you with tonight?
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Sounds like you need a bit of hands on help configuring the keymapper Weave, I've got CH Pro USB pedals and they are fine.
The keymapper works in two ways which is what is confusing.
The first, detects the axis when you move it. ie, clock on roll and move your stick left/right and it picks it up.
The second is manual mode, which is what you want. First you need to figure out which stick is what, which axis is what.
The BEST way to do this is with AH. Go into AH and note what axis correspond to what in AHs joystick setup (X, Y, Z, rX, etc).
Now, say like me your pedals are stick 1, and j/s is stick 2.
Go to the WW2OL keymapper, go to aircraft, scroll down til you find roll. Click up the top where it says joystick. This will give you a selection of sticks and axis. I click on the roll-axis box down the bottom, then click stick 2, then click the large vertical X under axis. This maps my stick 2 X axis to roll.
The trick is to figure out which stick is which, and to check the axis mappings under AH. If you have a spikey axis (like I do with my TM Elite Pedals) then that may cause problems when your are mapping stuff.
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Thanks Udie, but the trial period is probably over by now, besides which the game is gone off my HD anyway.
That game has so much potential, yet everytime I break down and try it, I'm turned off by some glitch or another. As much fun as it could be, it's a pain to go through a week and a half of stuff not working everytime I give it a shot.
As stated earlier, I followed the development of the game a year and a half before the closed beta, in which I tried to participate, but my P2 at the time wouldn't handle the load.
I pre-ordered the CD prior to release (big mistake) and was somewhat disappointed when I couldn't even be infantry because of performance issues even though my machine was above minimum specs.
Came back for the 1.80 release with a P4, 512 ram, 64 meg video card, and the Rats wouldn't recognize my CD key. That and some performance tweaks took a week and a half to get ironed out. After subcribing for three months, I got tired of having the con I had a guns solution on winking out on me (still going on btw), I quit again. Btw my CH Pro pedals wouldn't work then either. Had to unplug them to play with a MS PP.
Was gonna give it a shot with a P-4 2.8ghz, 521 ram and a 128 meg video card. Anyone with a Saitek X-45 will tell you, the rudder butterfly is hosed. I don't think I should have to buy a twisty stick just to play one game.
I'm done with this thing now. I might break down and give WW2OL another shot, maybe around the time they release 2.5
Like I said in the title of this post, s.o.s. customer service wise.
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Let me know when they fire doomie. I will know they are headed toward honesty and reality then.
lazs
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While I don't take any actual enjoyment seeing anyone layed off or let go from anywhere my stance is much like that of a sports fan when talk turns to what players, coaches and team owners suck and should get the boot.
IMO WWIIO improved ten fold when they let Snail go. Now if they could get rid of the rest of the Triad of Deception. Hatch and DocDoom and reign thier rabid fan-boi minions in I'd have no qualms about subscribing and working through the many problems I enounter with that game.
But that's kind of like waiting for WildBill to get roped then tarred and feathered before he's kicked out the door over there.
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westy... I don't follow sports but I think I know what you mean... the people running things make it what it is and set the parameters for how things are done. If they are fat, drunk, lieing, blowhards for instance.. the gameplay will be dishonest and the mood will be petulant and defensive.
Who wants to play a dishonest, petulant and defensive game?
lazs
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Lazs, if my time around the MMOG flight sim community has taught me anything, it is that nobody still in the business has a clean record.
What heinous crimes are/were @/, Hatch, and Doom accused of?
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Proving to Laz that thee is no Linda Blair view-in spite of what Pyro programs.
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bcnu... when in WB doomie proved that his notion of history was "romantic" and VERY biased toward LW... he claimed that a 190 should turn with a spit 5 at any speed for instance. He refered to data that didn't exist or data that he "had to dig up" and never did... didn't even name it so others could look it up... his answers to all data questions were bettle like wall-0-words that were all romance and no substance. a blowhard. Does the FM and tone of WWII online seem to reflect such character? I would guess that if he is there then it does.
lazs
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I don't think it does Laz :)
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"Triad of Deception" is pretty accurate.
I'm playing the game, I'm enjoying it (for the most part). But theres not a day in the last two weeks I haven't thought about cancelling my subscription again.
Everytime you read the readme file attached to a new release you find more and more than indicates what was not modelled in previous versions.
If you ask the question what is modelled its like getting blood from a stone. The fanboys will kick in and try and scream you down. Last example I had was zeroace trying to tell everyone prop damage was modelled, until I had to point out that I used the spinner as a front nosewheel to taxi around on without any detriment to the prop.
The current debate of the 109E and F flight modelling rages. Someone asked if the model was so wrong why where CRS putting out info that it was so right (and their legions of fanboys). The answer was the best diplomatic BS I've seen for ages, but basically they blamed it on their 'testing' software.
It seems like all the damage and flight modelling had the best intentions, they just haven't been able to pull it off and complete it.
If you go over there, play, take everything with a grain of salt - then you'll enjoy things much more.
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?Just fluff'n play the game-the soap opera behind it has little to do with your enjoyment of the program, unless you let it.
Laz, when was Docdoom ever affiliated with WB? Or did you just lose too many arguments to him on the BBS? Not that I dispute your feelings about him, just their relevance.
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Well, I was gonna butt out of this monster, but something earth shattering happened today, and since it's on the first page again, I thought I'd bring you up to speed.
I actually received an e-mail from WW2OL tech support today, asking for some clarification regarding my request for help getting the game to see both of my controllers (stick & pedals).:eek:
My request for tech assistance was logged through their web site, on the 9th of August. You do the math to figure their response time.;)
They are asking if I'm using any outside programs to map my controllers, and if I have the latest version of DX. I'm using only Windows XP game controller program to install the hardware. My version of Direct X is 9.0.
I think the trial period is over by now, but I'll let you know what develops.:p
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liz/gad... he was not affiliated with WB... Very good thing because he was wrong in everything he ever posted. So far as I know he never won an arguement with anyone on the BB... so.. one could enjoy the game even if the creators suck but.... when you know their bias and it is a really really really bad one you would get frustrated whenever you see it come out. Most of the game developers didn't and don't spend a lot of time talking about their views for good reason. If you have proven to everyone that you are biased and consider honesty a "suggestion for other people who are not artists" then that will allways be in the back of the mind of the people playing the game that knew you.
lazs
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I have met him in person, several times. My impression differs from yours in that I really don't give a (cornered) Rats bellybutton how he is in person. I play the game on it's merits, or not. I have a wife, and plenty of friends, so I look for a game that I like, not a relationship.
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I have met him in person, several times. My impression differs from yours in that I really don't give a (cornered) Rats bellybutton how he is in person. I play the game on it's merits, or not. I have a wife, and plenty of friends, so I look for a game that I like, not a relationship.
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I am really really going to miss the 109F. I had a good 2 on 1 fight against 2 spits last night. I took them both out in a combination B nZ and turnfight which is probably not realistic in the sense that the 109F in real life might not have been able to hold up to the spit 1 in a turn fight but I still had to use hi and lo yo-yos some other fancy moves to keep both of them off my tail and eventually kill them both.
Was my plane Uber? No it was just a decent turner like the spit and is no more Uber two spits fighting each other. If the other plane can turn with you and there are two of you, obviously both should not be trying to get on my 6 at the same time.
The game is fun to play. The CRS staff are have to deal with a flame a thon from day one and most of the early flames were deserved but at what point do you just want to say to the whiners STFU and play the Freeking Game.
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no gad/liz... what I meant was that if you know the character and bias of the designer and you also like realistic FM's you will notice that much more the bias. but then... you allways flew LW anyway didn't you?
lazs
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No, I am pretty much a bomber guy-B25, B17, bettie, Val and TBF-Although I do fly the P39, P40 and the Zero on occasion.
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I have never made such a generalized or ludicrous claim as "an Fw190 will out turn a SpitV" and if that's your problem, get some counseling.
Now, using zoom and roll rate, vertical maneouvring and any E disparity between the two engaged aircraft, as you well know it would be possible to "out turn" a SpitV with an Fw190 if you wanted to loosely define OUTMANOEUVRE as "out turning" but I would never make such a definition.
Now, it is quite obvious you hate the very fact that I still have a pulse and draw breath on this planet but I hardly feel it nessesary to apologise for that, as for the rest, well, it's easy to calim whatever you like but it hardly means anything real, other than your obvious dislike of my existence or presence anywhere that is visible to you.
Carry the torch as long as you have strength to do so, I don't know why you care to but I'm not you, so what do I know about that ?
Not much and it isn't important anyway.
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How about continuing this on the WWIIO boards?
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I've heard rumors, horrible rumors, that those people limit 109s over there. Is there any truth to that?
and did they even have spitfires in france at that time, I thought they just sent Hurricanes over.
And where are the Fairey Battles?
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he sure talks purty tho... you should hear him when he thinks he has an audience of fans.
lazs
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Wow a post from the doctor.
I admire the fact that he is willing to come and clear the air. A high Yo-Yo will make a poor turner with a good roll rate a deadly opponent against a good turning plane like a spit 5. Seems like a silly thing to be arguing (or carrying a grudge about).
Flight sims are great things. We all love them or why else would we be here. DocDoom has been part of the creation of at least 2 of the most famous ones around. Anything created by humans is going to be open to criticism. I am sure Michael Angelo caught a lot of criticism when he was painting. I am sure some people hated what Beethoven was doing in his day. Aces High is a great sim as well. Play the ones that appeal to you and if one does not then just don't worry about it.
I wish they were all prosperous and and growing. I cannot think of any other past time that has held my attention for so long over so many years.
Originally posted by DocDoom
I have never made such a generalized or ludicrous claim as "an Fw190 will out turn a SpitV" and if that's your problem, get some counseling.
Now, using zoom and roll rate, vertical maneouvring and any E disparity between the two engaged aircraft, as you well know it would be possible to "out turn" a SpitV with an Fw190 if you wanted to loosely define OUTMANOEUVRE as "out turning" but I would never make such a definition.
Now, it is quite obvious you hate the very fact that I still have a pulse and draw breath on this planet but I hardly feel it nessesary to apologise for that, as for the rest, well, it's easy to calim whatever you like but it hardly means anything real, other than your obvious dislike of my existence or presence anywhere that is visible to you.
Carry the torch as long as you have strength to do so, I don't know why you care to but I'm not you, so what do I know about that ?
Not much and it isn't important anyway.
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I am sure Michael Angelo caught a lot of criticism when he was painting. I am sure some people hated what Beethoven was doing in his day.
Tell me you are joking with that analogy.
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"I admire the fact that he is willing to come and clear the air. "
Maybe it would be called "admirable" (and even then admirable is a STRETCH!) for him to "clear the air" (still smells like flatulance) on his own turf instead of running out from behind that "safe" wall they've built around themselves to fire off a shot?
But oh my Habu. lol. Your analogy is so way over the top.
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Well yes and no.
Many fantastic Roman sculptures were broken up for fill by Italian peasants when the empire fell as they were so common they were like Ikea furniture is today. Nice to look at but not really worth the hassle of taking it apart and moving when you want to relocate it.
Genius is very often not appreciated when it is being created. It is only later that it is recognized.
The creator of Pong was a genius. Really who every thought of making a game that you could play on a TV screen against another player? Pong was the first and look at what it spawned.
I am sure if you had bought a first edition of Superman in its day you would have probably read it and thrown it out. I would have too. It was not appreciated for what it was and how it fit in to the world of what came later until many years after.
Aces High, WW2OL, WB and AW are all ground breaking in their own way. It is only going to be 25 years from now that we will appreciate which ones were genius and which ones were dead ends.
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Superman comics are works of genius comparable to the Sistine Chapel? This gets better and better. Are you pulling my leg?
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Westy I am no fan boy.
When the game went gold I made a number of posts in the game's newsgroup telling fan boys what I thought. Not flameing just how what they did was going to seriously hurt the game and possibly kill it. I told them the right way to do it was the way Aces High did. Come out with simple versions for free and let people play for free then release update after update constantly improving the game before finally chargeing for it. To me that was the proper way to do it and I told the NG's as much.
I also bought a early edition of the game but after takeing a look tossed it aside and refused to pay for a sub until version 1.5 came out.
I fly mainly and when I tried it I found it addictive enough to come back and give it a chance. Each version is better than the last.
That is not being a fan boy that is the truth from my perspective. I am suprised they survived a year. I am amazed they continue to pump out bigger and better versions.
Most diehard fan boys are gone from the game anyway. They all get pissed off when they have a problem and realize that the game creators do not hold them in any higher regard than any other customer. Kind of like a movie star fan who meets his idol and it pissed off when she does not even sign his autograph book.
One of the most loyal fan boys of all was recenty banned from the game (he is in my squad Windhund) over a stupid series of posts. He was given a warning and told Hatch to piss off and out he was tossed.
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I wonder if "Doc" read this entire post, or simply came by to respond to the attacks on him?
At any rate, an update on the state CRS's tech support. I submitted the request on the 9th of August. They finally responded on the 15th of August. Below is the copied tex from their online support pages:
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CS10 added: Aug 15 05:51PM
Are you using any external utilities or programs to map the sticks? Also, the latest version of DirectX?
Weav added: Aug 15 06:30PM
No external programs to map sticks, just windows XP game controllers program. DX version 9.0 I might add that unplugging the CH Pro pedals enables the game to see the Saitek X-45 j/s.
Weav added: Aug 19 11:16PM
If it's going to take you this long, never mind. The free trial is long gone, and I'm tired of waiting to even try this new edition offline. Thanks for nothing.
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Take note Doc, this "box of snakes" (as you yourself refered to ww2ol) is not doing much in the way grabbing new long term customers. Should a customer have to wait this long to even hear from ww2ol, and longer for responses? Could this lack of timely response to customer concerns be turning off more potential revenue than the mulitudes of bugs found in the "box"?
My thanks to HTC for the medium to vent, since CRS closes their boards to the general public, and past customers.
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Dowding they are different but yes each is genius in its own way. If you judge a work of art by how difficult it was to create then the Space Shuttle has to be the most impressive creation of all time.
However I would argue penicillin probably affected the world more profoundly and it was just a bit of mould growing in a petri dish.
Genius is all over. Appreciate things for what they are and see the genius in them. A comic book can be genius just as much as a painting if it is ground breaking, starts a trend and becomes part of a nations culture.
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Originally posted by Habu
Dowding they are different but yes each is genius in its own way. If you judge a work of art by how difficult it was to create then the Space Shuttle has to be the most impressive creation of all time.
However I would argue penicillin probably affected the world more profoundly and it was just a bit of mould growing in a petri dish.
Genius is all over. Appreciate things for what they are and see the genius in them. A comic book can be genius just as much as a painting if it is ground breaking, starts a trend and becomes part of a nations culture.
Oh man, what would the world do without Penicillin and WWIIOL?
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(http://r1329776.hostultra.com/images/nachosig.jpg)
Misty tales and poems lost
All the bliss and beauty will be gone
Will my weary soul find release for a while
At the moment of death I will smile
It's the triumph of shame and disease
In the end Iliad
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Just remember who attacked who and who just listened until he felt it was time to at least present his side.
As someone who flew AH with nothing bad to say to anyone here, I say pffft ! if that isn't good enough for you.
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doomie... I am not talking about high yo yos or turns at certain speeds or even roll rates. I am talking about the "documents" somewhere in your house that you couldn't find, that showed testing of a 190A4 and a spit 5 that proved that the 190 could out turn and outclimb the spit at any speed. When asked to produce it or just tell us the source and we would get it for you...
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It has become apparent it is no longer possible for this thread to remain civil.