Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Sandman on September 04, 2003, 12:45:38 PM
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http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2003/09/03/BU249534.DTL&type=tech
So... music downloads are down 22% since the RIAA started their newest tactic of targeting individual users.
It appears that this didn't have the effect they intended on because the decline in CD sales actually accelerated.
Anyone else hear that sucking sound?
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"This is not a victimless crime; people are really suffering from the impact of peer-to-peer downloading," Sherman said.
LOL, i bet..RIAA must be crying a river for those poor artists, its them they care about.
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In response to the dwindling sales, the suggested retail price of CD's is suspected to cut around $6 from the current $18 SRP.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-0209050010sep05.story?coll=chi-business-hed
MiG
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Poor RIAA....
Tell me again how file swappers like I was are the criminals?
Two years ago, a Federal Trade Commission inquiry prodded the recording industry to abandon a practice that authorities said was a not-so-subtle attempt at price fixing. In essence, the record labels were punishing the discounters by denying advertising subsidies to merchants who strayed below certain price levels.
That practice also led Eliot Spitzer, New York state attorney general, to file a lawsuit in August 2000 against the major labels and largest retail chains. Twenty-nine other states (California, a hub of the music industry, not among them) have joined the lawsuit, which has cited consumer damages of $480 million because of alleged price fixing. A spokeswoman in Spitzer's office said that a settlement will probably be announced this month.
When the CD arrived in the mid-1980s, many industry voices said that the new format would be cheaper to produce than LPs and tape cassettes (and, indeed, it costs about 40 cents to make a CD, and the packaging adds 25 cents to that) and that the savings would be passed on to retailers and consumers once the new format was phased in.
That, of course, never happened, and the industry had a historic windfall as fans replaced their vinyl collections.
That profit party was crashed, however, by a consumer revolt called digital download.
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Originally posted by Sandman_SBM
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2003/09/03/BU249534.DTL&type=tech
So... music downloads are down 22% since the RIAA started their newest tactic of targeting individual users.
It appears that this didn't have the effect they intended on because the decline in CD sales actually accelerated.
Anyone else hear that sucking sound?
BS the IRC networks are growing daily. Music leeching is outta control. Monitor http://www.packetnews.com and you'll see . I think they are refering to the n00b programs like WinMx, and Kazza.
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IRC?
Whats that?
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Chat networks?
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Originally posted by CMC Airboss
In response to the dwindling sales, the suggested retail price of CD's is suspected to cut around $6 from the current $18 SRP.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-0209050010sep05.story?coll=chi-business-hed
MiG
That is a price I might pay for a good record.
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Ain't slowed me down any :)
The article on Foxnews was interesting...here's the quote I liked best....
But industry critics say the record companies have, for more than a decade, ignored the effects of soaring CD prices on sales. They also contend the artistic quality of music has deteriorated.
"This is something that the industry has failed to address ... You could make downloading music go away tomorrow and the industry would still face challenges," said Sean Baenen, managing director of Odyssey, a consumer marketing research firm in San Francisco.
"All the data suggests that quality and price are major factors to the equation."
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Originally posted by muckmaw
IRC?
Whats that?
Internet Relay Chat.
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saw this today:
PeerGuardian (http://www.techtv.com/screensavers/story/0,24330,3511270,00.html)
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Originally posted by muckmaw
Tell me again how file swappers like I was are the criminals?
Because you're copying intellectual property without a license.
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And they're engaging in price fixing...
I'm freakin' Robin Hood of the Internet!
Remember 2 wrongs don't make a right, but 3 lefts do...
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Yeah, I don't download music on Kazaa. I also refuse to buy CDs until the RIAA stops being a bunch of bullying pudknockers. Which probably means I won't be buying a CD for a looong time.
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wait a minute...sounds to me like the riaa has a monopoly on the music industry...thats not allowed is it???
(excuse my ignorance...)
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Originally posted by muckmaw
Remember 2 wrongs don't make a right, but 3 lefts do...
Only in right angle euclidian geometry. A geek response to a geek joke. Sheesh, I am bad.
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Originally posted by muckmaw
IRC?
Whats that?
Ur kidding, right?
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somehow I doubt the grand majority of pirated music would be ever bought even if the internet pirating would be nailed down to zero.
I wonder who really could afford to buy all the songs they've pirated and if talking of an average user and not someone with thousands of songs downloaded. (they surely couldnt :>)
According to the Wall street journal, if CD sells for 20 bucks, the average artist contract gets 1.60 bucks.
To me it sounds like the publishers are killing the business with exagerated prices :>
(at least I do have much more use for the 20 bucks, than a handful of songs.. besides anyone could get good music for free and legally)
I'd say it would sell more if the prices would be cut down...
even more if it would be made available over the net, where it's much easier to buy the songs with a moments thought.... than walking to a store the next day, which in between you have alot of time to reconsider if its a good idea afterall.
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Originally posted by vorticon
wait a minute...sounds to me like the riaa has a monopoly on the music industry...thats not allowed is it???
(excuse my ignorance...)
No, the RIAA is a special interest group made up of a hundred or so record labels. There are still independent labels, and no one forces a record company to join.
They're basically lobbyists for the record industry, funded by the record industry. The RIAA doesn't actually sell CD's.
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I still buy LOADS of CD's.... in fact I brought 20 new CDs this week alone AND 10 DVD+Rs...
:D
I'm freakin' Robin Hood of the Internet!
MAWs in Tights?
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Ban the Internet!!
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Originally posted by Maniac
Ban the Internet!!
It definately brings more harm than good.
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Originally posted by rpm371
Ur kidding, right?
Nope...
You got a leaflet for beginners?
MAW IN TIGHTS!!!
ROFLOL!!
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Perk RIAA!
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Originally posted by mora
It definately brings more harm than good.
Really? I don't care either way, I just gotta know what the reasoning behind this line of thought is.
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Originally posted by mora
It definately brings more harm than good.
Information is evil!
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Originally posted by Mathman
Really? I don't care either way, I just gotta know what the reasoning behind this line of thought is.
:sarcasm:
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You know what I miss? 45s. I wish the music industry would put out singles again. And not 10 bucks for 14 remixes of the same song. I'm talking 2 bucks for a song and a "B" side. Two tracks on a disk, one of which is "B" quality.
I miss that. A lot.
-Sik
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Wait a minute.... you're too young to remember 45's!!!!
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Originally posted by muckmaw
Nope...
You got a leaflet for beginners?
MAW IN TIGHTS!!!
ROFLOL!!
Follow me young downloader to Nirvana....
(Vulcan opens door revealing limitless porn):
http://www.newsbin.com
http://www.newscene.com
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Yeah, I don't download music on Kazaa. I also refuse to buy CDs until the RIAA stops being a bunch of bullying pudknockers. Which probably means I won't be buying a CD for a looong time.
Me too! Except I will wait untill RIAA stops the harassment AND lowers the prices to $6 / cd.
Screw 'em I'm taking a stand right here, right now.
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I bet next thing you know they are going after the evil people that record songs off the radio. Oh the horror! :eek:
Daniel
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Originally posted by Sandman
So... music downloads are down 22% since the RIAA started their newest tactic of targeting individual users.
It appears that this didn't have the effect they intended on because the decline in CD sales actually accelerated.
Anyone else hear that sucking sound?
Music downloads from legitimate non-pirate online music sites was up 1000% in 2004 compared to 2003. People are simply moving from buying prepackaged CDs to buying downloads.
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I bet next thing you know they are going after the evil people that record songs off the radio. Oh the horror!
Actually in many countries you pay royalty from all blank recordable media for just that reason.
So yes, they already do that.
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Hey, c'mon. It costs money to promote people like Ashlee Simpson. Real money.
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Originally posted by LePaul
Ain't slowed me down any :)
The article on Foxnews was interesting...here's the quote I liked best....
But industry critics say the record companies have, for more than a decade, ignored the effects of soaring CD prices on sales. They also contend the artistic quality of music has deteriorated.
"This is something that the industry has failed to address ... You could make downloading music go away tomorrow and the industry would still face challenges," said Sean Baenen, managing director of Odyssey, a consumer marketing research firm in San Francisco.
"All the data suggests that quality and price are major factors to the equation."
Yanno its funny.
I was just going to post that if the industry put out stuff that was worth buying people might actually buy it.
Even my kid and his friends admit that the good bands out now are few and far between.
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Hell, that's what "Audio CD-Rs" are in the US -- blank CD-Rs, indistinguishable from Data ones, only with a surchage for recording music.
Um, the context of the "down 22%" number needs closer examination. It's not "down 22% overall". It's "Down 22% in the seven weeks following the announcement". Illegal download traffic follows a pattern, where it drops off for a month or so after each such announcement or big bust. If they desensitize the public by busting all the time, downloads won't drop off at all.
The recording industry is in a bad way with regards to making music.
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Bring me some clean-cut English boys scratching away in unison in a strange and innovative way.
Bring me ringing African guitars - 6 hours at a time.
Bring me the boiling-point revolutionary rhythms of the islands.
Give me a site where I can download it so the guys get paid. I'll buy it.
But *don't* ask me for 30 of the local pesos for this year's "Survivor Runners-Up meet Human Nature". It's enough to drive a man to a jazz club.
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Originally posted by Dinger
Hell, that's what "Audio CD-Rs" are in the US -- blank CD-Rs, indistinguishable from Data ones, only with a surchage for recording music.
Um, the context of the "down 22%" number needs closer examination. It's not "down 22% overall". It's "Down 22% in the seven weeks following the announcement". Illegal download traffic follows a pattern, where it drops off for a month or so after each such announcement or big bust. If they desensitize the public by busting all the time, downloads won't drop off at all.
The recording industry is in a bad way with regards to making music.
Very interesting point!
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Originally posted by Scherf
Hey, c'mon. It costs money to promote people like Ashlee Simpson. Real money.
LOL, you, too, have noticed that air play of "Pieces of Me" has tripled since her SNL debacle!
Seriously, look to XM and Sirius for great music at $10-$12 month. Sure, radio is a different experience, but it is also one with its own surprises and fulfillments.
Tom
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Originally posted by midnight Target
Wait a minute.... you're too young to remember 45's!!!!
How about 78s and 33 1/3s? :D
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Originally posted by CMC Airboss
In response to the dwindling sales, the suggested retail price of CD's is suspected to cut around $6 from the current $18 SRP.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-0209050010sep05.story?coll=chi-business-hed
MiG
They have been teasing the public for over 10 years with this one statement.
Karaya
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Originally posted by gofaster
Because you're copying intellectual property without a license.
When you purchase a CD, you are BY LAW allowed to make ONE BACKUP COPY. You make TWO, well, good luck.
Karaya
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Originally posted by Masherbrum
When you purchase a CD, you are BY LAW allowed to make ONE BACKUP COPY. You make TWO, well, good luck.
You can make as many copies as you wish, as long as they are for your own personal use only.
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Hmmm... what law?
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Read it. It's out there. As a purchaser you ARE allowed just one backup. Of course, keeping them at "one" is tough.
Karaya
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Originally posted by Masherbrum
Read it. It's out there.
Ah... so I gather you've never actually seen this law.
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Originally posted by Masherbrum
Read it. It's out there. As a purchaser you ARE allowed just one backup. Of course, keeping them at "one" is tough.
Karaya
Not True. you can make as many backups of cds as you want as long as they are not protected... DVD's are a different case.
http://money.cnn.com/2004/02/24/commentary/ontechnology/dvd_burning/
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well consdiering they put their music on broken technology
(how many people have bought the same disc two times or more due to damage to the compact disc.. especially the old ones that get disc rot for breathing on them in the wrong manner.)
when alternatives like mini disc (cant be scratched lasts the life of the music..) are squashed pretty much entirely in the USA...
the whole system is a scam.. screw the artists.. screw the customer.. no wonder they are facing backlash...
look how many executives are in that industry.. about 2/1 to every other industry on the planet (with exception to porn)
So you have a top heavy industry that screws both its vendors (artists) and its customers (you) and wonder why they are sinking to the bottom..
dumbarses comes to mind
The tribe has spoken, extinguish your torch RIAA......
DoctorYo
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It's enough to drive a man to a jazz club.
And just what the shreck is wrong with a jazz club?
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hehe, holy punted thread batman :)
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The music industry was really really really stupid here. Instead of embracing new technology and fighting piracy by offering a a better alternative they started suing their customer base. Yes downloading and sharing copyrighted music is ilegal BUT even with napster they had a great oppertunity to offer a better more reliable service and they didn't.
When napster left there was a short void and they could have filled it but they are too money grubbing to care that their customers no longer wanted to pay $20 for a 10 cent piece of plastic.
They movie industry is having the same problems and soon cable/tv networks will too with the advent of bit-torrent and Tivo. people don't want to watch commercials and they don't want to watch a program when the network says they should.
Hopfully they will wisen up and realize that suing potential customers is not the way to entice more and embrace new technologies.
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I've got one of those dvd players that has a hard drive and can record and burn dvds. So what exactly are they going to do about those? Make every movie on cable pay per view? I can record all the high definition channels in dvd quality with the dolby 5.1 included.
Seems like technology will win no matter what in the long run. They will make things that supposedly can't be copied then someone will counter that with some new program or hardware.
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There are so many things wrong with the music industry...
- they promote $$$ of art/entertainment. Not all artists get equal shots at fame
- out of whack profits the industry make (not necessarily the artists) are reflected in their lifestyles
- they failed to pass on the savings of CDs and DVDs to consumers
- they ignored the fledgling online music industry, turning their backs on what consumers were asking for
- they are trying to restrict and control music to unrealistic levels (like wanting you to buy a song each time you play it on a different media, ie 1 license for Mp3, 1 license for a CD, 1 for a DVD)
- even though they were dragged kicking and screaming into online music sales it still is not the ideal system
IF they had done the right things all the way through this mess would have been minimalised. Legal or not legal, the general public see it as a "victimless" crime against a monster industry that only cares about the bottomline, not what people want, and not about promoting all music.
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Well said Vulcan.
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People that think it's okay to download music for free amaze me. It's stealing.
What right does anyone have to steal the work of artists, music companies, or whatever?
It's no different than pirating software.
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Originally posted by NUKE
People that think it's okay to download music for free amaze me. It's stealing.
What right does anyone have to steal the work of artists, music companies, or whatever?
It's no different than pirating software.
Well said Nuke. What's laughable are all the excuses for their "free" music downloads. Anything more than free and they'll find a reason for their not paying for it.