Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: Durandal on September 22, 2000, 02:16:00 PM
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Hi pilots. You know, AH is a great on-line WWII combat simulation. It features many WWII war machines. Fighters, attackers, light bombers, heavy bombers, a tranceporter, and vehicles. And probably more and more machines will be added in future to create much greater battle field.
But these machines will belong to the types I wrote above. Fighters, bombers,etc. I think, the most interesting point of WWII war machine creation is that development of many experimental machines for special purposes. Especialy Germans.
Most of them were not sucseed in battle,or not completed until the end of war, in real history. But AH is the 'simulation'. I think these machines will spread the wide of tacticses, strategies, and create more exiting battle field. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
So, first of all, I request 'Bachem Ba349 Natter,the rocket propeled target-defence interceptor'. Physical datas are below.
Engine (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/redface.gif)ne 4,410lbs thrust Walter HWK 109-509C-1 rocket; four 1,102lbs or two 2,205lbs thrust solid-propelant rockets for vertical launch booster.
Dimensions:span 11fts9ins; length 19fts9ins; height 7fts4ins.
Weights:empty 1,840lbs; loaded 4,920lbs with boosters.
Performance:Max speed at sea level, 497mph; at high alt,621mph;rate of climb 36400fts/min; range after climb 30miles.
Armament:: 73mm Fohn spin-stabilized AA rockets*24, or 55mm R4M spin stabilized AA rockets*33, or (proposed) two 30mm Mk108 cannons each with 30rounds.
What do you say about this funcy plane? Once enemy bombers aheading reported,Natter took off verticaly from launch pad built nearby the target, then climbed top of its max hight, dropped boosters, then dived into the swarm of enemy bombers at over 600mph! Natter could attack enemy bombers about 2-3 passes. Attacking finished, Natter went back to the ground by gliding, landed with skids.
I think it wiil work in the AH world, as a close interceptor of large air fields, the HQ, or some inportant targets. And, its purpose and range are very very limited(only 30miles!!), so I think it will not break any game balances. Not like Me262,sometimes called as a cheating plane. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I also request 'Messerschmitt Me163 Komet' for same reasons.
Please add coments to this idea.Thanx.
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)atas are from "Fighting Aircrafts of WWII" written by Bill Gunston.
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Hi Durandel,
All I have to say is, "Get in line"... (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
P61 P61 P61 P61 P61 P61 P61 P61 P61 P61 P61
6 years and still waiting!! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)
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Ripsnort(-rip1-)
=CO= VMF-323 ~Death Rattlers~
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[This message has been edited by Ripsnort (edited 09-22-2000).]
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And who would want to fly target bombers for your enjoyment?
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I really hope none of the planes mentioned above get added before we get some early war planes in AH. I am keeping my Warbirds account open to fly early war stuff such as 109E's and Spit1a's. It makes me wonder the direction AH is heading when we seem to get more mid-late war stuff added and a community that seems hell-bent on requesting uber dweeb rides and especially uber dweeb rides that had small production numbers seemingly just for the 'would'nt it be different and cool' instead of thinkign the impact such late war dweeb rides would have on the arena. Perhaps I'm sufferign from AH burnout but over the lat month I seem to have spent more time in WB, especially since v1.04 and planes with seemingly endless 'E' and zero drag (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/frown.gif)
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Reply to Miko2d:
[And who would want to fly target bombers for your enjoyment?]
I think it's not a problem. Because, Natter flies VERY fast, it has only 120rounds of 30mm or low-velocity ballistic rockets. So aiming can be very tricky. And you have only 2-3chances to attack bombers in 1 sorty.
In real history, Me163 Komet was in service for few months. It was not shot down because of its extreme high speed, but also it couldn't shot so many bombers.
So, I think it won't be a perfect bomber killer. Still you can bomb targets if you are good bomber pilot. Just avoid it.
Thanx for reply. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Yep, and sometime their pilots literally melted in the cockpit due to the highly corrosive fuel. Yuck!
Daniel, aka CyranoAH
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Originally posted by CyranoAH:
Yep, and sometime their pilots literally melted in the cockpit due to the highly corrosive fuel. Yuck!
Daniel, aka CyranoAH
T-Stoff and C-Stoff, nasty stuff indeed!
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In AH the 163 would be far more effective then in WW2 for the following reasons.
Siteing. The germans faced challanges as to where to site the interceptors. With the point targets in AH the 163 would likely always be able to effectivly engage.
Small groups of bombers.
How many 120 bomber boxes do we see in AH? Against a single bomber or very few the 163 would be very deadly.
Reliability. The 163 was armed with 2 mk108 30mm cannons. This gun is much more reliable in the game then in real life. Also the plane itself was touchy and unstable to fuel and arm. Not here.
While the plane fits in well in our arena(might say it was made for it) it would make the difficult job that bombers allready have much more difficult...
Maybe for special events?
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That's right. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Me163 Komet's propellant was VERY dangerous and unstable. Consisted of 2 liquids, and once you mix them, it will be ignited by itself. Sometimes these liquids ate fuel-tank seals, and leaked into the cockpit. Then...[Violence Scene (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/wink.gif)]
I mean, it's a simulation. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
Thanx for reply.
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And what fun would it be for bombers? You shoot one of those things down. Next one comes back in less then minute. Just think of this, B17 climb for 20min and then when you get spotted you'll get shoot down by those things. 20 minutes trip for nothing. Mo more boming runs in AH cbecouse it wouldn't be fun. Wouldn't that be great?
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Perk Plane, Pyro!
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Oh, by the way, anything labeled "new plane request" should really go in the Planes and Vehicles forum...
(http://Ripsnort60.tripod.com/natter3.jpg)
the "Natter"
[This message has been edited by Ripsnort (edited 09-22-2000).]
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Originally posted by Ripsnort:
Perk Plane, Pyro!
Exactly , Ripsnort. Noone with a bit of good sense would spend his perk points on a Me163 only to attack a 18K B17...
But I know dozens (including me) that would do just that to kill 35K stratodweebs...
Perk it, but BRING IT! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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One plane request per customer Rip!! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
P-61 or F6F??
(http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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To Russian and Pongo
Yes, you are right. If HTC adds these planes as perform their catalogue spec, it will break game balances. I do agree with it.
But, if they make some tricks to that, I think it will make AH more interesting.
For example, Natter needs the launch pad. you can break it with tanks,Fighter-Bombers or DEADLY ostwind. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) Before bombers incoming.
This is a tactics, isn't it?
If you call these planes 'perk plane', how about the Me262? It's a FULLY FUNCTIONAL fighter. It can be used for multi purpose.
But I strongly agree with Russian's thinking. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) I've took 30mins to climb to 27k alt to bomb 'The A1 Base'. Then I've reached to A1, I've been shot down by 88mm Flak before I threw bombs. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif) My 30mins for nothing.
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Originally posted by Durandal:
you have only 2-3chances to attack bombers in 1 sorty.
.. Komet ... couldn't shot so many bombers.
The #1 reason that Komet was not effective was that very few pilots survived more then a few sorties - radically new design, corrosive fuels, explosions, uncontrolled engine thrust, unpowered high-speed landing - no chance to abort and circle and no chance to land off the runway at such speed.
How good is any AH pilot with 10 sorties total?
Now imagine unlimited supply of Me163 climbing to the bomber altitude in 2-3 minutes, so even if shot down, the same pilot can attack a bomber formation 2-3 times with new planes within 6-7 minutes.
Me163 piloted by people who had hundreds of training sorties in them.
Plus the abcence of fear of death in AH will be magnified with Me163 because the bomber will not have much time to shoot him down even during suicidal (for regular plane) 6 attack?
And it takes a bomber half an hour to get to target? Long boring flight in order to be shot down while 163 guy can have 10 action-filled sorties in the same half an hour?
I would not fly bombers under those conditions.
Not that I would mind flying Me163 or a Natter off-line or in H2H! That would be great. I just do not think HTC should spend their time on this because they have many other things to do.
Durandal, have you looked at MS Combat Flight Sim and upcoming CFS2? You can create custom planes - flight models, weapons and/or graphics relatively easily for them. It is possible that Me163 is already done and can be found on the net, or some other plane could be modified.
I would much rather see early planes - I15, I16, early Zeros, F4F3, Hurricanes, ets.
miko
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Revvin, yer absolutely correct.
Gottawin ueberplane dweebs are the bane of all these sims. What they fail to realize is the earlier planes, even though they don't have that -est superlative quality, offer much more to investigate with regard to the battles they fought than any of this "never flew" crap. Half the appeal of these sims is the "this is what it was like in the war" factor. Who *cares* what a Bearcat was like???? (Yeah, I know some of ya do, I was being rhetorical)
Model what was representative first, and then worry about the what-ifs.
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Though I don't have my WB account open I dearly miss the early war aircraft. I for one would much perfer to see an "early war" set of aircraft before we use any expermental aircraft. 1939 - 1942... probably my favorite time of the war (as far as aircraft go).
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To Miko2d
Thank you for your reply. Your thinking is quite right.
But I want to say that...there are many on-line sims were created before AH. AirWarriar,FlyingCircus,WarBirds, and so on. These sims features many airplanes,[AW supports vehicles] but they have a same problem; new version,new planes, but nothing changes. Fighters are fighters, Bombers are bombers. There are many tacticses in machine vs machine battle, but the strategy is only one.
I think,these strange special purpose machines would be a little spice of these sims.
And, seems like so many people wants the early war planes for AH, but you know the problem of mixing early planes and later planes in one arena? WB already faced this problem. And IGN tries many solutions for that, Rolling Plane Set or Histrical Arena System, but there are no perfect answer is found yet. The HTC has an answer? Perk system would be a solution for that?
Thanx.
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Originally posted by RAM:
Exactly , Ripsnort. Noone with a bit of good sense would spend his perk points on a Me163 only to attack a 18K B17...
But I know dozens (including me) that would do just that to kill 35K stratodweebs...
Perk it, but BRING IT! (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
I would.
Originally posted by RAM:
Exactly , Ripsnort. Noone with a bit of good sense... would spend his perk points on a Me163 only to attack a 18K B17...
uh...nevermind (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/smile.gif)
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Rip you want to move that butt ugly plane to the O Club its too ugly for the planes and vehicles forum. You have to be wasted to like that butt ugly machine. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Tommy (INDIAN) Toon
Indians Home page were links to help pages can be found.
Indian's Homepage (http://www.geocities.com/~tltoon)
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Perk this perk that give me this give me that, I'll be a killer if I get that certain AC I just know it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 waaaaaaaaaaaaa............. (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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Heh.
I don't want this plane.
Now remove this thread, and make me forget it (http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/biggrin.gif)
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StSanta
JG54 "Grünherz"
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Early planes need to be introduced, this IS suppossed to be a WWII flight simulation is it not? simulating an era that did not centre around 1945 and a load of prototype planes, or should we re-write history and just forget about such minor insignificant battles such as the Battle of Britain, I mean after all it would be boring would'nt it what with no jet engines and prototype missiles, lets rip out those boring early war pages of history and perhaps move some pages back through the history books so you can all have your B52's and F15's in AH! hell lets forget WWII ever happened and make our own war up with plenty of make believe uber dweeb rides...oh but wait its already here...Crimson Skies from Microsoft!