Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aces High General Discussion => Topic started by: beet1e on September 15, 2003, 02:41:57 PM
-
(http://www.alanadsl.legend.yorks.com/5c47.jpg)
HQ had just been hit. The lights went out. Oh no, HTC is going to be fielding HQ hardness whines. :(
Instead, a few of us got together in goons to do a HQ resupply mission. One person brought troops - lol - and another had originally selected vehicle supplies, but we got at least 4 supply drops on HQ, and had the lights back on in about 10 minutes. Which is probably the length of time it takes to write an HQ hardness whine to HTC. :p
Next time your HQ gets hit, instead of whining to HTC, spare 10 minutes to do a resupply run with 4 friends!
LOL the comments in the text buffer! :lol
-
FYI: HQ supply does only work if it's fully down.
-
I was there, Beetle.
DmdMax's and Shane's comments were in response to you helpfully telling a newbie that "Alt-F4" fired torpedo's; both are flying knight as this picture was taken; and DmdMax was helping the newbie out, over your protestations that he should "RTFM".
CCVI has already pointed out the mechanics of HQ re-supply; ans it's obvious shortcoming.
-
Yep if its 100% down it can be player resupplied.
If its just partially down like the Friendly Counter and Enemy Counters are the only thing damaged then it can only be AI resupplied.
This is the growing trend as of late. Take the HQ down 50% or 75% that way it will require approx 2 hours to rebuild.
-
Originally posted by Seeker
I was there, Beetle.
DmdMax's and Shane's comments were in response to you helpfully telling a newbie that "Alt-F4" fired torpedo's; both are flying knight as this picture was taken; and DmdMax was helping the newbie out, over your protestations that he should "RTFM".
Why doesn't this fabrication of evidence surprize me.
-
I've resupplies it when it was only part way down plenty of times.
Hey, we good new smileys?
-
Originally posted by Rutilant
I've resupplies it when it was only part way down plenty of times.
Hey, we good new smileys?
Cool ... but I'll bet it still didn't do anything. Check your perk points when your done ... if its 0.00 then nothing more can be done. At that point, you have to wait for the train re-supply.
-
ccvi is 100% Correct.
If you are able to do some good by player resupply, Then it was already Fully down, and it had already started to rebuild on its own, showing it part down.
Fully Down = Player Resupply and AI Healing fix it.
Part Down = AI Healing only.
At least that the understanding I got when it was explained to me by the Man himself at CON.
-
Originally posted by SlapShot
Cool ... but I'll bet it still didn't do anything. Check your perk points when your done ... if its 0.00 then nothing more can be done. At that point, you have to wait for the train re-supply.
Nooope.. had it up and running full steam in around 10 minutes, enemy and friendly dot dar i believe.
-
Yeah, that's correct, but I'm left wondering why it's correct. Shouldn't you be penalized for not doing your job well enough? Meaning if your bomber squadron failed to destroy the base entirely, shouldn't resupply make more sense?
It's got to be easier to repair a building than rebuild it from scratch, I would think.
Meh. Small potatoes, really, compared to what they're currently working on.
-
Originally posted by SlapShot
Why doesn't this fabrication of evidence surprize me.
uhhhhh..... seeker described the situation behind mine and max's comments in the text buffer of that screenie. my following comment was, "what with his getting only 2 kills per hour."
:D
i don't see how beetle fabricated anything, it looks like a valid screenie to me i see nothing false about it. he may or may not have chosen to pick those particular comments to include in the screenie, thereby giving some kind of impression of whatever...
your comment is kind of puzzling.... care to clarify? unless you're saying beetle tried to put a spin on it by including max's and mine's comments out of context?
-
Mos,
yeah, Its seems kinda backwards... But thats how it works.
-
"unless you're saying beetle tried to put a spin on it by including max's and mine's comments out of context?"
BINGO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Sorry that wasn't apparent Shane.
-
Originally posted by Rutilant
Nooope.. had it up and running full steam in around 10 minutes, enemy and friendly dot dar i believe.
Then that means that HQ was intially, completely destroyed, not partially.
-
The HQ thing is well documented in 5 million threads on the subject. It was done this way on purpose they say.
In genral AH resupply has been trending to be less effective in all areas, much to the delight of the pork and auger crowd. (Wasn't it 1.10 where the goon effectiveness was cut by 50%?)
It takes a bunch of goons to fix what one game player can do on a suicide pork mission, and why not? It works very well.
-
Originally posted by SlapShot
Then that means that HQ was intially, completely destroyed, not partially.
Nope again. I was online, it was 100% before it was bombed, 2 dars down after. There the entire time, not to mention the HQ killer was giving a play-by-play, apparently trying to get people to congratulate him. :rolleyes:
-
Rut - that was my recollection too. I was one of the last ones to get there, and I think HQ was resupplied by then. I landed on the grass just outside town, but it said I ditched. Checked perk awards - no perks awarded for that sortie. I guess the other goons had made their mark.
Seeker! Yes I did say RTFM to that noob. I don't mind helping people who try to help themselves, but this noob had clearly not done any homework at all. He asked "How do I throttle up in a PT boat?". Someone said "same way as in a plane", so then the noob said "How do I do that?" These basic training sessions don't belong on Ch1!
But at no time did I tell this noob to Alt+F4. That was someone else. I have never done that.
-
Rut,
You should Email Dale and let him know he doesnt know how it works ;)
Of course its possilbe I totaly misunderstood him as well..
-
Originally posted by Zanth
The HQ thing is well documented in 5 million threads on the subject. It was done this way on purpose they say.
I asked Skuzzy in the arena once and his words were" Yes it has to be 100% destroyed before player resupply will effect it. If players can resupply it when its only partially down then THAT is a bug and we will fix it, but you can get perks for rebuilding buildings at HQ. what is happening is goon after goons is dropping supplies, all the while trains are resuppling. so guys think its there goons rebuilding dar. Perk awards stop after all buildings are up. And when you get no perks trying to rebuild dar it just means a good bomber came in and only bombed white HQ building, so no other buildings for your supplies to rebuild."
-
Originally posted by SlapShot
Why doesn't this fabrication of evidence surprize me.
Because we are all familiar with "Beet1e's Reality" or should I say, lack of.
ack-ack
-
Can anyone please guess why it is the way it is? Gameplay wise?
To me it surely looks like "it's not a bug (read: no resources to change it), it's a feature!"
-
Ask not what your map can do for you; ask what you can do for your map!
-
Originally posted by ccvi
Can anyone please guess why it is the way it is? Gameplay wise?
To me it surely looks like "it's not a bug (read: no resources to change it), it's a feature!"
This is my belief as well as I recall the history of it. (AH help doesn't describe it this way either)
-
I just go by what I've seen. We resupped HQ last night. I don't think it had been completely wiped out. I don't know if an AI train had arrived just after the attack.
Seems silly not to allow player resupply until the entire city is down. A smart buffer would just kill the radar building, and posibly a few others, but not destroy more than about 90% of the HQ.
-
Beetle I know you are a fellow rook and all, but me and a squad mate flew over to run an HQ resupply, we dropped, but we also noticed HQ was not 100% down, we augered. Dar was not up in 10 mins like to reported, it was down to just dar bars for about an hour or so. The Fight over HQ to down the bombers lasted 10 mins, I was in a 163 durring that part too. So I think you might have streched this one just a bit.
-
Originally posted by Kegger26
Beetle I know you are a fellow rook and all, but me and a squad mate flew over to run an HQ resupply, we dropped, but we also noticed HQ was not 100% down, we augered. Dar was not up in 10 mins like to reported, it was down to just dar bars for about an hour or so. The Fight over HQ to down the bombers lasted 10 mins, I was in a 163 durring that part too. So I think you might have streched this one just a bit.
OUCH !!!! ... ROTFLMAO !!!
-
Originally posted by Kegger26
Beetle I know you are a fellow rook and all, but me and a squad mate flew over to run an HQ resupply, we dropped, but we also noticed HQ was not 100% down, we augered. Dar was not up in 10 mins like to reported, it was down to just dar bars for about an hour or so. The Fight over HQ to down the bombers lasted 10 mins, I was in a 163 durring that part too. So I think you might have streched this one just a bit.
I was also there in a 163. The buff had augered by the time I got there, or else was killed by an unseen friendly. As of that moment, the lights were off. 10 minutes later, they were back on again. None of the goons shown in my screenshot - myself included - would have bothered upping goons for resupply, unless the dar was down. But the HQ was not fully down when I arrived in a goon - see pic. :)
Slap - you were saying? :lol
-
Originally posted by beet1e
I was also there in a 163. The buff had augered by the time I got there, or else was killed by an unseen friendly. As of that moment, the lights were off. 10 minutes later, they were back on again. None of the goons shown in my screenshot - myself included - would have bothered upping goons for resupply, unless the dar was down. But the HQ was not fully down when I arrived in a goon - see pic. :)
Slap - you were saying? :lol
I don't need to say anything ... you are doing just fine all by yourself.
:rofl
-
Originally posted by Seeker
DmdMax's and Shane's comments were in response to you helpfully telling a newbie that "Alt-F4" fired torpedo's
That sucks!
Everybody knows that you hit to fire torps.
:rofl I kill me.
-
hum maybe resuppling partial hq work. maybe just maybe the train resupply buildings around hq first. then they resupply the hq it's self. so resupplying it would make it go back up faster.
-
The HQ is supplied by the trains, not the town.
ack-ack
-
Originally posted by Ack-Ack
The HQ is supplied by the trains, not the town.
ack-ack
:rolleyes: what im getting at.hq supplied by trains.but the trains resupply the town first not the hq. ever though of that?
-
If you go off line and look in the set up and then the object settings you will see the hardess and down time for all objects.
HQ's and Cities and other strat are unique in that they effect the game before they are 100% killed but in all other espects they are repaired like any other object..........FH, VH, ammo bunkersetc
It seems that AI repairs damage to an object as it accumulates it at a given rate decided by the strat. (Just as that if you drop 50lbs on a ammo bunker then return 2 hours later with another 50lbs your previous 50lbs will have been "repaired by AI)
Once an object is fully dead its down time setting kicks in.
If this was set to 20 minutes for a ammo bunker and there was no player supply then 100% strat will repair it in 20 mins and pop it up.
Similarly a HQ will take 360 mins to fully repair if the cities are at 100%. Again uniquely with HQ's cities and other strat they effect the game before they are 100% repaired.
Players can reduce the down time further by locally re supplying.
hence if an object has sufferred damage but not destroyed only AI repairs it
hence if an object has been destroyed and under AI repair then players may supply and shorten the down time further.
Rutilant would have supplied a HQ that was under repair (as far as the system is concerned)
The confusion in my mind with HQ's and their like is when the following happens...................
HQ @100%
enemy damage
HQ @ 50% (AI repair but no player repair)
more enemy damage
HQ @ 0%
Freindly repair
HQ 50%
AI repair
HQ75%
enemy damage
HQ25%
Now we see this HQ is still down...........it has never been fully repaired yet it has suffured more damage................... I believe that players can continue to repair until it hits 100% repaired.
hence we can have situations where more damage has occurred and we can repair............. we can have situations where the HQ is partially destroyed when from a system view point it is partially repaired, and we can repair.
Its seems to be a consequence of using an object damage/ repair model on a complex strat group.
From our view point the ammo bunker is fully functional until destroyed( we do not see its damage being repaired) and we can repair it when its destroyed.
WE see (and feel) the HQ suffer as it recieves damage (but cannot repair until the "down time counter" comes in)
-
You can see if your supplies did any good by checking your perk points after you land your supplies. If your getting perks, you did some good, if you didn't get perks, you didn't do any good.
At least someone said this at the Con when we were talking about this with HT, but then I was drinking BulletHead's home brew so I could be mistaken ;)
Gunner
-
Only problem with that is if the if the HQ is partially destroyed along with the town, your supplies go to the town. Which is why you receive perks for running supplies. But if the town is 100% and the HQ is partially destroyed, you won't receive any perks for running supplies.
ack-ack
-
Originally posted by B17Skull12
:rolleyes: what im getting at.hq supplied by trains.but the trains resupply the town first not the hq. ever though of that?
This is for those that are confused on how the HQ resupply/repair works. This is straight from Skuzzy himself.
There are three things that effect HQ resupply/repair.
1. C-47's can carry repair supplies to the HQ. This only works if the HQ is 100% down.
2. Trains coming from the City to the HQ decrease the HQ downtime. Destroying the trains keep the HQ from repairing faster.
3. The City repairs the HQ, not the town. If the city is down 100%, then the train supply stops until the city is less than 100% down. Once the city is less than 100% down, the trains start running again.
This should clear things up for even the most confused player. But if you still don't get it, let me put it to you simply.
Resupplying the town at the HQ is a waste of time, it does nothing in regards to the HQ.
ack-ack
-
Originally posted by Ack-Ack
Resupplying the town at the HQ is a waste of time, it does nothing in regards to the HQ.
So why is it that on previous occasions when I have dropped supplies on the HQ - I'm talking about that location denoted by a star - I have been awarded 1pp? What am I being paid for? When you talk of the City, do you mean the other buildings at the HQ location (but not the big radar factory) or do you mean the locations denoted by a © ?
-
The real problem is when your city is in enemy territory (not supplyable ?) and your HQ stuck at 20%
What do do in this case ?
[list=1]
- switch side and bomb HQ ?
- pray for a bombing of the HQ ?
[/list=1]
Or as usual I don't understand how strat work :)
-
Originally posted by beet1e
So why is it that on previous occasions when I have dropped supplies on the HQ - I'm talking about that location denoted by a star - I have been awarded 1pp? What am I being paid for? When you talk of the City, do you mean the other buildings at the HQ location (but not the big radar factory) or do you mean the locations denoted by a © ?
There are alot of other little buildings at HQ which have nothing to do with radar. With radar not 100% down eventually, and obviously knights have had many times to test this, you will get zero perks foro your resupply runs and yet radar will still be down until the trains fix it.
The two points to remember are:
(1) With radar 100% down 8 goons will always fix it regardless of city status.
(2) Partially damaged HQ will repair only with trains, the speed of which depends on city status.
-
Originally posted by beet1e
So why is it that on previous occasions when I have dropped supplies on the HQ - I'm talking about that location denoted by a star - I have been awarded 1pp? What am I being paid for? When you talk of the City, do you mean the other buildings at the HQ location (but not the big radar factory) or do you mean the locations denoted by a © ?
The town around the HQ had no bearing at all on the HQ. The perks you got for supplying a damaged HQ less than 100% is from the town, not the HQ.
ack-ack
-
Originally posted by Zanth
(1) With radar 100% down 8 goons will always fix it regardless of city status.
That's what I thought - that goons would fix the radar. In my picture, you can see 4 goons besides mine, and there are two dots to the left - possibly inbound goons from another field. I had arrived late - some of those guys might have made more than one trip already.
Some time ago, before I started this thread, HQ radar was down as indicated on the strat status screen. It was on one of the maps where there is a vehicle field with a spawn point right near HQ - probably intended to provide the enemy opportunity to attack, rather than a resupply point to be used by friendlies. I spawned an M3 with supplies, and drove it into the HQ town. Tipped the supplies out, exited, and found that no PP had been awarded. Other guys doing the same thing made the same observation. So then we gooned in supplies, and that worked - PP awarded. I think it was 1pp, but I can't remember for sure. I'm pretty sure we got the radar working again, which would tally with Zanth's point.
Sorry to be labouring the point, but how can radar be "partially" up or down? I thought it was a single white building. Either it was up or it was down. So if it was down, it was 100% down, and therefore goon resupply would always work. I only ever do goon resupply of HQ if the radar is down. The strat status screen says something like "Enemy radar: disabled/enabled" depending on status. Not "Enemy radar 60% destroyed".
-
The strat menu shows enemy dot dar, friendly dot dar, enemy dar bar, friendly dar bar each up or down.
-
Originally posted by beet1e
That's what I thought - that goons would fix the radar. In my picture, you can see 4 goons besides mine, and there are two dots to the left - possibly inbound goons from another field. I had arrived late - some of those guys might have made more than one trip already.
Some time ago, before I started this thread, HQ radar was down as indicated on the strat status screen. It was on one of the maps where there is a vehicle field with a spawn point right near HQ - probably intended to provide the enemy opportunity to attack, rather than a resupply point to be used by friendlies. I spawned an M3 with supplies, and drove it into the HQ town. Tipped the supplies out, exited, and found that no PP had been awarded. Other guys doing the same thing made the same observation. So then we gooned in supplies, and that worked - PP awarded. I think it was 1pp, but I can't remember for sure. I'm pretty sure we got the radar working again, which would tally with Zanth's point.
Sorry to be labouring the point, but how can radar be "partially" up or down? I thought it was a single white building. Either it was up or it was down. So if it was down, it was 100% down, and therefore goon resupply would always work. I only ever do goon resupply of HQ if the radar is down. The strat status screen says something like "Enemy radar: disabled/enabled" depending on status. Not "Enemy radar 60% destroyed".
Think you need to re-read his comments.
The perk points you are getting by resupplying a HQ that is not 100% destroyed are from your supplys rebuilding the smaller HQ buildings. Those buildings have no effect on DAR status.
A HQs can be partially down. On the clip board you see the HQ status.
Friendly counters
Enemy counters
Friendly radar
Enemy radar
If ALL 4 of those items say "disabled" then the HQ is 100% down and can be player resupplied to bring the countries radar back up.
If any one of them says "enabled" then the HQ is only partially down and can only be repaired by trains from the city.
So if 3 out of the 4 items for radar are destroyed the HQ (radar) has been 75% destroyed.
Last night our HQ got hit and we sent 11 goons to attempt a resupply (As a test). I recieved a little over 6 perks, the others anywhere from 6 to 1 last 3 goons recieved nothing.
Radar stayed down for approx 1 hour and 40 min.
Next HQ raid destroyed it and we resupplied and had it back at 100% in 10-15 minutes.
-
Lets recap, cuz I'm confused.
These buildings are resupplied how ??
Inaminate ingame objects just make this game for me.
-
Originally posted by nopoop
These buildings are resupplied how ??
All this stuff posted is just to confuse Beet1e. It's a "payback" thing for all the times he's flip-flopped in here like a tail-walking largemouth bass trying to throw the hook.
The inanimate objects in the game are resupplied by a top secret mystical rite that involves, incantations, sacred smoke, virgin ewes from a very special sheep farm in Grapevine and, sad to say, blood sacrifice.
But if I told you anymore the black helicopters would come for m
-
I was just about to say, I can see why the furballers stick to the simple stuff. You pre-empted me!
-
Originally posted by beet1e
I was just about to say, I can see why the furballers stick to the simple stuff. You pre-empted me!
On the other hand, at least they know how the game works...
ack-ack
-
Originally posted by Ack-Ack
On the other hand, at least they know how the game works...
ack-ack
:rofl