Aces High Bulletin Board
Help and Support Forums => Help and Training => Topic started by: PAMARRIN on September 23, 2003, 03:03:09 PM
-
:confused:
OK Here is a new one guys, what is Furballing?
-
http://www.netaces.org/ahmain/siteframe.html#title
An excellent site to get started.
h
-
a furball is when a lot of airplane( more then 2) begin tu turn around, circling in the same area, each one try to keep the enemy's tail to shot down him.
always during their circles the pilots loose progressive altitude arriving next to the ground.... so usually furballs are low
for example next to an airfield...
so when someone "furballing" mean 3 different thing
1) a style of figthing called Turn and Burn (T&B), the opposit to the Boom & zoom tattics, but that is improper calling it furballing it's a slang :)
2) or it could be says like an offense, or joking, infact "u are a Furballer" sometimes sound like " u are so newbie that u still circlin, running after every tail u can see"
3) or it is a compliment "u are a furballer" sound in this case like "u are so strong and sly to survive to one furious fray" :cool:
-
i think T & B is "turn and burn", but 'furballers' hate people who fly missions, drop bombs, capture bases, drive GV's, try to win a reset, fly high(over 5000 ft), fly with wingman,etc
so if you want to 'fuball' you have to fly a LALA7 or spity under 5k and turn in tight little circles and call any body that does not let you shoot them down a "runner"
-
Originally posted by john9001
i think T & B is "turn and burn", but 'furballers' hate people who fly missions, drop bombs, capture bases, drive GV's, try to win a reset, fly high(over 5000 ft), fly with wingman,etc
so if you want to 'fuball' you have to fly a LALA7 or spity under 5k and turn in tight little circles and call any body that does not let you shoot them down a "runner"
You guys don't know much about "furballin" but that's ok, we don't care. :p
To answer the question: Furballin is turn fighting in a crowd using every edge you can to get on someone's 6, get the shot and get out quickly. The biggest challenge is honing your SA 'situational awareness' to the point that you can survive it and land a few kills. It takes alot of skill: riding the stall, conserving e (when possible), gunnery and most of all SA. Hope this helps and do join in. Your flying skills will increase much faster than they would cherry picking from on high. ;)
-
Originally posted by PAMARRIN
what is Furballing?
Target fixation, useless SA, 800 yards spray'n pray, HO'ing and being Hoed over'n over, light and easy rides (mostly point and click ones), turn till puke, little or no usage of vertical plane, living in permanent blackout, etc. The easiest way to get a very high K/H and a very poor K/D ratios, and easiest way to be quickly back to tower without needing to land your plane.
-
Excellent, Mandoble
You pointed out in the finest way the so called furballing "technics";)
I agree 100%;)
-
...and as usual, Mandoble is 100% wrong. I'm a furballer and my k/h k/d stats are the opposite of what he ascerts.
Out of 75 sorties this tour, I've not landed 20. 16 deaths, 5 capture/ditches.
Yep, ole Mandoble knows the furballers.
-
i think that everyone can enjoy flying in his peculiar way!!
so if u like or dislike furballing depends of the way u prefer have fun in AH ;)
...
i mean u like furballing u do not agree with MANDOBLE & Stegor (alias Nibbio) ...:rolleyes:
if u like furballing of course u get the rigth to BNM & Apache :rolleyes:
that is freedom heheheheh
personally i agrree at 100% with MANDOBLE & Stegor (alias Nibbio) philosophy so if one tell me that i'm a furballer i'm not so happy again..
....after all Furballing ....it is an insult or it is I compliment?
mmmmm i think all depens if u like or not it:D
just last thing.....
Apache say
"...and as usual, Mandoble is 100% wrong. I'm a furballer and my k/h k/d stats are the opposite of what he ascerts. "
BNM say
"You guys don't know much about "furballin" but that's ok, we don't care."
i do not undestand why people who like furballing have ever to be a bit agressive when u say that u dislake it ....
may be becouse all newbie have been in a furball at the beginning ???
or may be becouse u can't find any tattics in LW, RAF or USAF jap or russian pilot's manual that teach this powerfull way of figth mmmm... i do not know ....:D
-
Bigjava, you have a point. But first, let me point out that I've been flying online combat sims since '94, so a newbie I'm not.
With that said, Mandobles way of fighting is actually the way one would fight if we were "really" in combat. I have several Navy & Airforce fighter pilots in my family and friends. To a one, each would say that if you found yourself in a dogfight (furball), you messed up. The point was to hit an enemy from an unseen vantage point, get in and get out before it was done to you.
My only gripe about anti-furballer comments is that they are wrong in thier descriptions. No SA, spray and pray, don't land, low k/d? Hardly. Stats are there for all to see and proves my point.
-
Apache right...... everyone else speak with forked tongue..... HOW!
-
Originally posted by Apache
Bigjava, you have a point. But first, let me point out that I've been flying online combat sims since '94, so a newbie I'm not.
With that said, Mandobles way of fighting is actually the way one would fight if we were "really" in combat. I have several Navy & Airforce fighter pilots in my family and friends. To a one, each would say that if you found yourself in a dogfight (furball), you messed up. The point was to hit an enemy from an unseen vantage point, get in and get out before it was done to you.
My only gripe about anti-furballer comments is that they are wrong in thier descriptions. No SA, spray and pray, don't land, low k/d? Hardly. Stats are there for all to see and proves my point.
lol u said rigth about what MANDOBLE tell
i mean no every pilots involved in a furball are newbie but i think there is a missundestanding about "furballing", "Furball" and T&B tattics ....
i made an example to try to show what i think, becouse may be wrong:
10 pilots are making a furball ok ...
well it's like a chimical reaction :
is a swarm of bees that turns, but not all bees turns in same way....
2 off them (Nibbio and MANDOBLE) stay above the furball try to catch someone using B&Z, they are at the edge of the furball but so next that they are involved....:rolleyes:
2 of them (Apache& BMN) stay in and out of the furball trying to shot down the enemies using T&B tattics using SA ecc.. ecc..
4 of them are doing what MANDOBLE have said so they are furballing... without SA ecc..ecc.. but this is my own opinion i know....
1 is flyng a BNM2 (the Kate) in the furball witout undestand that he is not coll he is a stupid Dewbris
and the last 1 ,i suspect that is me, have crashed after compress the 109 ;)
so may be what u call furballing i call use T&B
what i cal furballing u call " fling like a cleaved"
but
....without the 4 pilots that are furballing ( fling like a stupid) we, sometime, will have no so fun
;):D
and at last let me say again...
apache furballing ? mmmmm? with a 6.5 K/D i think NO! but if u like that people call u "furballing" that is ok for me :cool: bro
-
Originally posted by bigjava
i do not undestand why people who like furballing have ever to be a bit agressive when u say that u dislake it ....
may be becouse all newbie have been in a furball at the beginning ???
or may be becouse u can't find any tattics in LW, RAF or USAF jap or russian pilot's manual that teach this powerfull way of figth mmmm... i do not know ....:D
BNM is correct...first you have to know what a Furball is. A furball isn't a tactic, maneuver or a style of fighting. A furball simply is a mass of planes dogfighting each other.
ack-ack
-
Ahhhh, Mandoble strikes again. How can one person be so consistently wrong about so many things? Astonishing.
-- Todd/Leviathn
-
I rarely get involved in a furball, and when I do, it is usually with 190A5, P51B or La5 on purpose (with decent results), and some other rides when an attack mission ends accidentally in a furball, but almost never with Dora.
Most of the times my victims (in Dora) are well aware of my presence (even totally target fixated on me) and no, it is never a hit a run tactic (that would lead to land too few kills or no kills at all), and mostly 1 vs many situations.
I'm not against furballing, nor against furballs, neither against furballers. I'm against those that think nothing but furball are worth to be considered "fighting", and they, at the same time, consider themselves "heros" and "aces". IMO, furballing may be fun for a game like this, but has little or nothing in common with aerial combat, and does not represent anything related to WW2 aerial fights.
If you like to recreate WW2 combat situation, you will try to survive while effectively killing enemies (not just to only keep alive). Then, what would be an acceptable K/D? 5? 6? 10? 20? In that situation (playing like this), a single death (I mean pilot death) is not acceptable, and I'm personally well below that mark.
-
Maddog speak truth. HOW.
-
Originally posted by MANDOBLE
If you like to recreate WW2 combat situation, you will try to survive while effectively killing enemies (not just to only keep alive). Then, what would be an acceptable K/D? 5? 6? 10? 20? In that situation (playing like this), a single death (I mean pilot death) is not acceptable, and I'm personally well below that mark.
I actually really agree with that...
-
Originally posted by MANDOBLE
, furballing may be fun for a game like this, but has little or nothing in common with aerial combat, and does not represent anything related to WW2 aerial fights.
Wow, Leviathn is right. Absolutely astonishing.
ack-ack
-
Originally posted by Ack-Ack
Wow, Leviathn is right. Absolutely astonishing.
ack-ack
Didnt expect anything else from someone like u, keep going. LOL.
-
It's as simple as this. Not talkin about missions or bombing stuff, I'm talkin about air to air combat.
Two ways of going about it and for the most part they are mutually exclusive.
Mandobles way, the "real" way which goes with the proverb. "If you find yourself in a fair fight, you planned wrong" Sometimes referred to as cherry pickin.
And the "furballer" way which is totally the opposite. A fight where you tend to get "alittle" too far in. Where you DON'T hold all the cards and see what you can do.
Both are valid. It's all in what you personally enjoy.
But I just find that the majority of "real" fighters haven't a clue on "what" furballin is.
Tho I know a picker when I see one.
-
Originally posted by Ack-Ack
....first you have to know what a Furball is. A furball isn't a tactic, maneuver or a style of fighting. A furball simply is a mass of planes dogfighting each other.
ack-ack
aka ....do u have read the 3° post of this tread?
the one Where i have write that
furball is when a lot of airplane( more then 2) begin tu turn around, circling in the same area, each one try to keep the enemy's tail to shot down him.
always during their circles the pilots loose progressive altitude arriving next to the ground.... so usually furballs are low
for example next to an airfield...
so when someone "furballing" mean 3 different thing
1) a style of figthing called Turn and Burn (T&B), the opposit to the Boom & zoom tattics, but that is improper calling it furballing it's a slang
2) or it could be says like an offense, or joking, infact "u are a Furballer" sometimes sound like " u are so newbie that u still circlin, running after every tail u can see"
3) or it is a compliment "u are a furballer" sound in this case like "u are so strong and sly to survive to one furious fray"
i have learned what a furball is ....
but i like to improve my english so plz tell me if is rigth that
Furball=a mass of planes dogfighting each other
furballer= a pilot who like dogfigth in a mass of plane
Furballing = have a dogfigthing in a mass of plane in 2° way like u prefer have fun.....
1) figthing just to figth, having no purpose to land
2) figthing the enemy but keeping in mind to survive
that's ok ?
:confused: :rolleyes:
-
Fluid dynamics of a "good" furball
Ingrediants are dependent on arena density. That's why this crack smoker can't get a "good" fix in the Large map.
There self propagating but are dependent on chance. Arena density increases the "chance".
Along the lines of a tornado. The ingrediants have to be there, but the tornado might not appear. The way it's fed is similar.
Perfect example is the Isle map last week and the fur between A1 and A4.
A catogory 5 furball
All the ingrediants were present and it took place. Saw many a furball addict there that night
For some reason water increases the chances
Numbers have to be even, sliding back and forth but staying for the most part even.
What you end up with is a fluid front that fluctuates back and forth between bases. Outgoing planes at medium altitudes meet along the fluid front. PT boats below, Pickers coming in from both sides high being sucked down into it. Base takers continually come into the enemies base with altitude and drop in to base defenses. A "circulation" is created.
Those at the "front" are in the fur. Exits rearword are covered by incoming fighters. Exits to the sides can be used to regain altitude, but the "pickers" inhabit the sides.....waiting...
Getting too "deep" into the fur usually results in ones hair being set afire..... Safety is relatively close, but...being too deep causes the "pucker", the "edge", the nose print on the moniter..
Coming out the safe side with your hair on fire is the fix......
Screaming inches off the deck with tracers crossing your canopy, 3 or 4 in the bag, your hunched over the moniter on a furball high....Jeez the WEPs used up, missing a flap, the gear are gone, with an oil leak....Trying to get out...with a 51 closing, licking his chops sending presents your way..you scissor evade and a friendly makes him break off...
On final, the base takers are attacking, you come in hot, gently setting it oh so softly on it belly sliding down the runway scrambling for the clipboard to GET OUT BEFORE YOU DIE !!!
You made it
You take a breath..
Take off..
And do it again.
While some enjoy flying in a realistic manner minimizing the threat of getting killed, others thrive on setting their hair on fire..
It all depends on what is "fun" for you.
-
un unbiased description is a furball is
a big group of planes all fighting each other...
-
Originally posted by BNM
You guys don't know much about "furballin" but that's ok, we don't care. :p
To answer the question: Furballin is turn fighting in a crowd using every edge you can to get on someone's 6, get the shot and get out quickly. The biggest challenge is honing your SA 'situational awareness' to the point that you can survive it and land a few kills. It takes alot of skill: riding the stall, conserving e (when possible), gunnery and most of all SA. Hope this helps and do join in. Your flying skills will increase much faster than they would cherry picking from on high. ;)
YES very well put and right on the money!!!!! How do I know? Because Ive just come from 2 years of furballin'..in a WWI plane, my choice was the Camel and the SpadVII, it is one heck of a ride and a whole lotta fun. You do end up in the middle of sometimes 12 - 20 players, all at "nil" alt so you have no air if you make a mistake:rofl and you BETTER have good SA, and you better know your plane like you know your hand, and if ya cant knife and stall fight then dont even bother tryin to tell me your a fighter pilot.
It doesnt take much ability to be at 20K , see a con, and zoom down on him..try the furball and learn how to fly.
-
It doesnt take much ability to be at 20K , see a con, and zoom down on him..try the furball and learn how to fly.
So much assumptive.....:rolleyes:
You can't compare WWI and WWII planes and technichs.
Ifyou wanna twiddle with a plane ...ahh.. that's Ok, but if you wanna fly "simulating real WWII planes and pilots" thats all another story...
then dont even bother tryin to tell me your a fighter pilot.
Funny if you think someone can claim such things moving some pixels on a monitor:D
-
Originally posted by stegor
So much assumptive.....:rolleyes:
You can't compare WWI and WWII planes and technichs.
Ifyou wanna twiddle with a plane ...ahh.. that's Ok, but if you wanna fly "simulating real WWII planes and pilots" thats all another story...
Funny if you think someone can claim such things moving some pixels on a monitor:D
:D Of course, you are correct, and I didnt mean to be comparative I got carried away in my "defence" of the furball. The very nature of the plane, WW2 that is, would make the furball very tricky due to the speed if nothing else. Actually in WWI the vast majority of aerial combat took place above 5K and the "furball" as I described it was a rareity. I defended it, and still do, because of the enjoyment I get from participation in it. It seems to be an outgrowth of the "sim" rather then a real world scenario.
-
great post gents
couple things i would mention to those just learning to furball is:
(1) fuel load. try taking off with just a quarter of a tank. makes a big difference in how your plane handles. the p-51D and a6m are the two planes that have pretty good fuel consumption and also two completely different styles of flying.
(2) try turning off your combat trim. this is something i just discovered and it helps alot. only i dont turn it off untill i am just about to engage another aircraft. i cant wait till i learn how to use the trim tabs.
just my two cents. any other tips out there?
later
David (Daddy Rabbit) Jester
Tactical Officer
99TH ASTAG
-
Out of 75 sorties this tour, I've not landed 20. 16 deaths, 5 capture/ditches.
Must have an Intel processor... :lol
shrpshtr
-
Originally posted by stegor
You can't compare WWI and WWII planes and technichs.
Sure you can. In the case of a furball they are quite similar, only difference is the WWI planes are slower and turn tighter. Also it might take a few more hits to get the kill.
If you wanna twiddle with a plane ...ahh.. that's Ok, but if you wanna fly "simulating real WWII planes and pilots" thats all another story...
Yes in the MA that's the story we like to call BORING. :D
-
Originally posted by BNM
Originally posted by stegor
You can't compare WWI and WWII planes and technichs.
Sure you can. In the case of a furball they are quite similar, only difference is the WWI planes are slower and turn tighter. Also it might take a few more hits to get the kill.
If you wanna twiddle with a plane ...ahh.. that's Ok, but if you wanna fly "simulating real WWII planes and pilots" thats all another story...
Yes in the MA that's the story we like to call BORING. :D [/B]
BORING indeed, nothing drives me bonkers quicker then flying around at 30K waiting for a chance to "pounce"/Give me a furball anyday!!!!!!!!!:D
-
:rofl :rofl :rofl
Pamarrin, without intending to you've succeeded in posting the best troll I've seen since Mathman posted on Submarines! wtg!
Welcome to Aces High!
:rofl :rofl :rofl