Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => Aircraft and Vehicles => Topic started by: FUNKED1 on October 26, 2003, 02:47:26 PM
-
Did the nazis have VT fuses for the 37 mm gun?
-
U mean proximity fuzes?
-
of course they did. Its the ostwind they barely had.
-
people say the ostwind was "rare" like it means something.
The 37mm Flak 43 on the ostwind is nothing special. The germans had a 37mm flak gun through out the war. The 37mm Flak 18 was was replaced by the 37mm Flak 36. The Flak 36 was the "standard version". The 37mm Flak 43 appeared only in limited number in the second half of the war. However, the round did not change with the models.
Whats was more "rare" is the chasis not the gun. All sides during world 2 had similiar anti aircraft guns. They were mounted on on all sorts of vehicle types.
Ofcourse in rl these guns were nowhere near as effective or as concentrated like you see in ah.
pic below:
Ostwind - 3.7cm Flak auf Fahrgestell Panzer IV
Möbelwagen - 3,7cm Flak auf Fahrgestell Panzer IV
Wirbelwind - 2cm Flakvierling auf Fahrgestell Panzer IV
(http://www.wargamer.com/Hosted/Panzer/flak04.jpg)
-
Didn't the Mobelwagen had problems with aiming? I've heard it's own armor was in it's way
-
It could lower the superstructure sides to form a platform, both giving the crew room and the gun ability to traverse from -6 to 90 degree.
I guess the "problem" was if the Möbelwagen was suprised with the superstructure in a vertical position.
-
production
Ostwind: 40 from mar. '44
Wirbelwind: 140 from Dec. '43
-
Hmm, could be, I saw a documentary on Discovery on this one, displaying why Hitler didn't like it or something
-
Originally posted by LLv34_Snefens
It could lower the superstructure sides to form a platform, both giving the crew room and the gun ability to traverse from -6 to 90 degree.
I guess the "problem" was if the Möbelwagen was suprised with the superstructure in a vertical position.
The Möbelwagen had hanger bars on the superstructure panels that allowed them to lean the armor out at about a 15° angle to allow them to turn the gun while still having some protection against small-arms fire. But that took time to set up. Except for the total lack of armor protection (aside from the gun shield) the SdKfz 7/1 and 7/2 were better designs, since they could both be fired without preparation.
-
production
Ostwind: 40 from mar. '44
Wirbelwind: 140 from Dec. '43
and that matters how?
The Wirbelwind would be even more deadly then the Ostwind in game. When folks whine about the Ostwind they are whining about the gun. It wouldnt matter if is on a pIV chasis or on the ground or on the back of a truck.
The Flak 37mm is still 37mm no matter what its mounted on.
In AH the ostie had hi-bred rounds. Each had at capability. Now the ostie is just HE.
-
I haven't played enough lately to know if it's still true, but my main complaint with the Porkwind was not the gun, but the fact that it could fire its entire ammo load in one continuous burst without pauses for reloading, and that it didn't have to lower the armor to fire or reload, and that the armor seemed to inexplicably protect the crew from above. Even rifle caliber MGs should be able to neutralize the gun from above, but back in the day it was as tough as a Pz IV.
-
Originally posted by Batz
and that matters how?
Depends on how how many one sees in AH. They should be VERY un-common. With only averaging 8/month for the Wirblewind and 3/ month for the Ostwind spead around all scenarios.:)
-
The Germans had the 37mm mounted on different things. All the ost wind is a 37mm flak 43 on a pIV. In any game scenario you want to think of a 37mm whether it’s on a pII or flatbed truck its still 37mm.
Common bomb loadout for ami fighters in ah is overload. At the very least they carry 500lbs and rockets. They kill ostwinds with ease.
The only thing that could be questioned is what funked mention. I believe the flak 43 on the ostwind was fed with 12 round clips. That and maybe turret speed.
But subbing an ostwind for any mobile flak gun in an event offers no real advantage. All tanks out range them and they only carry HE. Even though it’s armored in AH you aren’t sending infantry to knock it out. So what it comes down to is a bunch of nothing.
If the okinawa event where they were subbed for the fixed Japanese 37mm at guns and in Niemen that had little to no effect on the outcome even if they were over represented.
-
So it's not so deadly against AFV's any more? When it first came out, I called it the Bradley for its ability to dominate Panzers at medium range.
-
It will still kill them but not like before. I cant remember the patch when it changed but it was in the read me. If you have patched up ah1 then you might scan those readmes and see for sure.
-
Found it
Aces High Version 1.11
snip
Adjusted large bore cannon lethality against non-armored targets.
The 37mm of the Ostwind is now strictly HE with no AP component.
-
Cool. As usual, the fix list with each version reduces my number of valid whines. :)
-
Back to the original question, was there VT (proximity fuse) ammo fielded for the type of gun in the Ostwind?
-
Ahh NM I think only the US and UK had VT fuses during WW2.
-
I dunno funked
Heres some info
http://www.achtungpanzer.com/flak4.htm
The round was 37 mm L/98 and I know it could be used against air or ground targets. I assume that it was standard HE round that detonated on contact. On the 88s they were set to detonate at a set altitude. I dont know that the germans used a proximity fuse.
Maybe Tony Williams does.
-
the germans never had a proximity fuze, they were too busy working on "wonder weapons" to develope one.
-
Originally posted by FUNKED1
I haven't played enough lately to know if it's still true, but my main complaint with the Porkwind was not the gun, but the fact that it could fire its entire ammo load in one continuous burst without pauses for reloading, and that it didn't have to lower the armor to fire or reload, and that the armor seemed to inexplicably protect the crew from above. Even rifle caliber MGs should be able to neutralize the gun from above, but back in the day it was as tough as a Pz IV.
The Ostwind, unlike the Wirbelwind (which had a 20mm Flakvierling 38 firing box magazines) had a flat plate ammo feed. Rounds were slapped onto the tray, from which they were fed into the breech mechanism. Because the tray was open, you could keep slapping down more rounds as the gun fired them; as long as your loader could keep up with the cyclic rate of the weapon, you could keep firing as long as your ammo loadout held up.
The US Navy had a similar mechanism for several of its ship-mounted AA guns; with one of them, fresh rounds were dropped in five-round clips (in the literal sense of the term -- five rounds clipped together for ease of handling) into a feed chute; as soon as enough rounds had been fired to make room, another five-round clip could be dropped in, again allowing the gunner to maintain their ROF.
-
Thanks, it's coming back to me now. They had a hopper you could put rounds into. The questions I have then are: Could they operate the gun with the armor "buttoned up" like in AH. If they could, how much ammo could they store in a place which was accessible while on the move without exiting the turret or dropping the armor? Could they really fire all 1000 rounds on the move in one continuous burst without ceasing fire briefly or stopping the vehicle or lowering the armor?
-
No they couldn't, they would have to "restock" on ammo
As far as prox fuses on the Ostie or 37mm, no they didn't use them they were impact shells.
And as Iv'e stated before, the Wirbelwind is still my fav:aok and I wish HT would put it into the game {Ya hear me HTC!!!!!!!!!!!!}
http://pictures.panzerworld.net/PzkpfwIV-Wirbelwind/Wirbelwind01.jpg
Just a note, the gun Shiva was refering to I believe was the Bofers 40mm single & twin mount AA gun. It is top loaded by the loaders in 4 round clips {this rounds could be loaded with & without prox fuses}