Aces High Bulletin Board
General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: BlckMgk on October 27, 2003, 04:31:15 PM
-
What if, a group of folks here in U.S. trained and supplied themselves (guns, ammunition, equipment, food etc..) with their OWN money, went to Iraq, and started to kill Terrorist in Iraq.
What consequences, other than being killed by the terrorist in battle etc.. is there? Can they be charged with murder etc..?
-BM
-
Yes
-
yes.....?? to Which part.. please elaborate..
EDIT: btw thats the quickest reply I've ever seen. with in the same minute! You own Gadfly..
-
You could not GET to Iraq, number one. You would be breaking a multitude of laws if you did, and you would be considered a Terrorist yourself if you actually made it in-country with weapons.
-
The Stae Dept would hang you by your short and curlys.
-
I remember when desert storm was going on, a bunch of guys wanted to bring their own sidearms. They were informed that if they shoot an enemy soldier in combat with their own weapon it is murder, if they shoot the same enemy in the same situation with their issued weapon they are doing their job.
-
Interesting.... So I guess I'm going to need to do this illegally eh?
This is puzzling to me for some reason.
-
You would be an illegal combatant and therefor a war criminal.
War is by its nature chaotic, so the administration of war needs to be as structured as possible. There is no room for 'rough riders' in todays world.
-
Not to mention the fact that you would have no way to identify a terrorist from a falafel vendor. You would not know the language, culture, people or operational area. You would not have any intelligence resources to draw from. You would stick out like a sore thumb. If the hard core foreign-trained mujhahideen styled terrorists stopped laughing long enough, you probably wouldn't be worth the effort to target. But if they decided you were, then your chance of survival at the hands of these experts would be slim to none. Good hollywood b-film script though.
Here's what you would be up against: http://www.kavkaz.org.uk/eng/video/
(Thanks for the link a week ago or so ago. I can't remember who posted the video, but this does give some insight into what our troops are facing daily.)
Charon
-
I would imagine that a group of heavily armed civilians would have a good chance of getting wasted by US forces. Reading "The March Up", it seems that mostly what they were fighting.
-
Originally posted by Charon
Not to mention the fact that you would have no way to identify a terrorist from a falafel vendor. You would not know the language, culture, people or operational area. You would not have any intelligence resources to draw from. You would stick out like a sore thumb. If the hard core foreign-trained mujhahideen styled terrorists stopped laughing long enough, you probably wouldn't be woth the effort to target. But if they decided you were, then your chance of survival at the hands of these experts would be slim to none. Good hollywood b-film script though.
Here's what you would be up against: http://www.kavkaz.org.uk/eng/video/
(Thanks for the link a week ago or so ago. I can't remember who posted the video, but this does give some insight into what our troops are facing daily.)
Charon
Yeah I did consider the fact about intelligence, etc. You'd really have to be someone with connections, just to get into Iraq would be pretty hard, as they mentioned above. As far as surviving... thats something one would have to cope with if they did plan on going mercenary style.
-Thanks
-
Originally posted by FUNKED1
I would imagine that a group of heavily armed civilians would have a good chance of getting wasted by US forces. Reading "The March Up", it seems that mostly what they were fighting.
Edit by me.
I would imagine that a group of civilians would have a good chance of getting wasted by US forces. Reading "The March Up", it seems that mostly what they were fighting.
-
Ahh alright I get it now funked, That we'll be mistaken by the U.S. as terrorist ourselves eh? I guess thats possible, But I'd try and befriend the local established army unit. Let them know of our what we're doing, but he'd probably not allow for the outlawness to happen though, and arrest me on the spot. Maybe I could find a cowboy out there, who'd appreciate the support, but It could also be dangerous for his men to if we were operating in the same areas etc...
-
Or you could just take a ride down to the nearest recruiting office. I'm sure you could find an Army or Marine recruiter that would be more than happy to place you and your friends in the combat zone, as little as three months from now. Not quite the hollywood fantasy, but if you really want to get in on the action it's only a signature or two away.
Charon
-
Something tells me the local Army units would not be enthusiastic at the prosepect of either having to attempt to save your bellybutton or scrape up the remains off the street.
Join the Army is your best option.
-
Originally posted by BlckMgk
Ahh alright I get it now funked, That we'll be mistaken by the U.S. as terrorist ourselves eh? I guess thats possible, But I'd try and befriend the local established army unit. Let them know of our what we're doing, but he'd probably not allow for the outlawness to happen though, and arrest me on the spot. Maybe I could find a cowboy out there, who'd appreciate the support, but It could also be dangerous for his men to if we were operating in the same areas etc...
I am just repeating what I read in "The March Up". Anybody who had a weapon and wasn't wearing a US uniform was a target. And they didn't walk up and say howdy and ask for ID. If it was a group of armed men out of uniform, they'd do things like call in 105 mm fire or open up with an M242 at 1500 yards. They'd find out you were an American when they pulled your wallet out of the pile of bbq'ed meat.
-
Who was that drug dealer terrorist in South America that the government couldn't catch? Well anyways a civilian militia started matching his terroristic acts and caused him to stop killing people. And when said terrorist was on the phone complaining to a radio station about how the civilian militia was killing his family, police were able to track him down and execute him.
Ok I remember the name now- Pablo Escabar. I believe it was in Columbia.
-
Hahaha... the whole "What If" situation is meant to see what war time laws are there established, to prevent such an undertaking. But the idea of being independent from the U.S. army or any other armed force is the main one.
Of course I could join the Army, but hell, I could also jump off a building if I wanted to die. One would probably be more regarded as more noble, or heroic, but you're dead nonetheless, this is not to say that those men right now on the front, or fighting are going to die, but they do have a much more significant chance of. I can say for certain though that they are very brave men/women for doing so. I have friends and family who are currently In Iraq, for whom I pray for.
Then again this is a "what if" scenario, and I choose to be here behind this keyboard hypothesizing, and my friends choose to be there to fight for the fact I am able to be here and throw my words, ideas around in such a free manner.
-Thanks for all those who replied.
-
David, for more on that, check out Killing Pablo by Mark Bowden, same guy who wrote Blackhawk Down.
-
Originally posted by FUNKED1
I am just repeating what I read in "The March Up". Anybody who had a weapon and wasn't wearing a US uniform was a target. And they didn't walk up and say howdy and ask for ID. If it was a group of armed men out of uniform, they'd do things like call in 105 mm fire or open up with an M242 at 1500 yards. They'd find out you were an American when they pulled your wallet out of the pile of bbq'ed meat.
Hmm this might be a problem. I'd probably be more afraid of the U.S. Army than the terrorist cells, I'd figure the terrorist would only come out for a "planned" attack. The U.S. is kind of always out in the open, with its big stick ready to hit anything that looks threatening
-
I am pretty sure it's legal to arrive into Iraq (through Turkey-Kurdistan, Syria, etc.), buy a rifle there and join a local militia. A foreign member of a militia would not be any more of an illegal combatant than other members of that militia.
There are restrictions on US citizens serving as high-level officers and members of government in foreign countries.
Don't listen to them, BlckMgk - learn the language and go there. Don't forget to write a book. "Homage to Catalonia" is a great book by George Orwell about his participation in Spanish Civil War. Make sure to read it before you go.
miko
-
Thats actually a pretty thought provoking question BlckMgk, and I agree..how would we identify them as a terrorist? Indeed what is a terrorist?
check this out
http://www.therationalradical.com/dsep/terrorist-definition.htm
Only one thought process here granted, but kinda makes sense.
If we Raise up a civilian "army" and go hunting those who fit into our definition of a terrorist, what have we become?
No real cut and dried answer is there?
Just a thought.
cheers,
RTR
-
Originally posted by BlckMgk
Yeah I did consider the fact about intelligence, etc. You'd really have to be someone with connections, just to get into Iraq would be pretty hard, as they mentioned above. As far as surviving... thats something one would have to cope with if they did plan on going mercenary style.
-Thanks
:rofl Is this guy for real?
Been reading a bit to much Tom Clancy there sonny:rofl :rofl
-
Of course he's for real...isn't everything here for real?
-
Killing Pablo is a great book.