General Forums => The O' Club => Topic started by: Maniac on July 25, 2020, 09:08:59 AM
Title: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on July 25, 2020, 09:08:59 AM
First flight in DCS multiplayer WWII server, after 3 days in total in the game.
The results was devastating :-)
I want to take this moment to shoutout everyone from RSAF/ISAF (Royal Swedish Airforce & Independent Swedish Airforce) being 16 -17 years old when i started to play Warbirds i hunted down most of the Swedish players by searching for posts by Swedes on Newsgroups and Forums in order to get us flying togheter, it kinda snowballed from there. And even ended up in RL meetings etc.
Also the 900th Bloody Jaguars and the 249th RAF (and the 901st), i remember setting my alarm in the middle of the night/morning to fly with the 900th at like 05:00 in the morning Swedish time.
I wont name names even if tough i want to, its too many to name, and too many to risk being left out.
I just want to thank the AH and the former Warbirds community, somehow strangely this has helped define who i am, started with Warbirds at the age of 16-17 and now im 43 years old.
I want to thank the Devs of both Warbirds and AH for these awesome memories i have because of this game.
Cheers to all i had experiances with thru this :cheers: and to the ones that are no longer here.
Truly Awesome.
Regards.
Maniac
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: RichardDarkwood on July 25, 2020, 10:17:36 AM
DCS is where it's at
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: CptTrips on July 25, 2020, 11:02:24 AM
LOL. That was rude!
DCS has VR support right? But doesn't have an offline career campaign?
TeamFusion is about to release their IL2: Desert Wings exansion first week of Aug.
I prefer VR, but it will be another six months before they add it to Destert Wings and Dover Blitz. I just bought a TrackIR Pro to tide me over. TrackIR is OK. It's no where near as immersive as VR. It will have to do for a while until the patch with VR arrives.
I'm in the mood for some good long offline career campaigns to lose myself in, so I'm looking forward to those. I hope DW has the same Full-Mission-Builder that Dover Blitz has. It's quite impressive. I might make my own campaign in each for hoots.
:salute
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on July 25, 2020, 11:14:29 AM
Yep, both VR support and Track IR and the alternatives to that.
You can fly the free P51 in order to see if you like it, just download DCS from steam client. But if you do you might be hooked :)
There is offline missions you can practise with, some modules offers campains aswell.
By campaign, do you just mean a set of related missions?
I'm really hankering for more of a narrative career I can give my character a name, pick a photo, where my player increases in rank, from noob to squadron leader, gets medals, upgrades planes, gets invited to other squadrons and transfers etc. I miss games like that.
:salute
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on July 25, 2020, 11:47:13 AM
By campaign, do you just mean a set of related missions?
I'm really hankering for more of a narrative career I can give my character a name, pick a photo, where my player increases in rank, from noob to squadron leader, gets medals, upgrades planes, gets invited to other squadrons and transfers etc. I miss games like that.
:salute
Yep its more of a set of missions for sure. The days of red baron etc is gone, you can make great experiances and content with the ppl you play and fly with tough. for offline campaing stuff i dont know what to recommend really.
Maybe Falcon 4 with BMS mod
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: CptTrips on July 25, 2020, 11:54:36 AM
Yep its more of a set of missions for sure. The days of red baron etc is gone, you can make great experiances and content with the ppl you play and fly with tough. for offline campaing stuff i dont know what to recommend really.
Maybe Falcon 4 with BMS mod
Yeah, sadly it's a uncommon format now days/
:salute
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Nefarious on July 25, 2020, 12:02:28 PM
I'm really hankering for more of a narrative career I can give my character a name, pick a photo, where my player increases in rank, from noob to squadron leader, gets medals, upgrades planes, gets invited to other squadrons and transfers etc. I miss games like that.
:salute
IL2 Great Battles has 4 career campaigns, soon to be 5, with everything you mentioned, including Iron Man Mode. Plus dozens of scripted campaigns for download.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on July 25, 2020, 12:31:58 PM
.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: CptTrips on July 25, 2020, 12:45:10 PM
IL2 Great Battles has 4 career campaigns, soon to be 5, with everything you mentioned, including Iron Man Mode. Plus dozens of scripted campaigns for download.
I recently picked up Stalingrad, Kuban, Bodenplatte on sale. I've started exploring those. At least they have VR and the grphics are nice. I'm kinda meh on Russian stuff. I REALLY wanted to do some BOB careers and have been waiting a year for the promised VR upgrade. Grrr. Like I said, trackir is ok, but VR would be insanely awesome!
Now, if I could just hit something in IL2. LoL The gunnery seems so much harder for me, I don't know what it is.
:salute
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on July 25, 2020, 01:00:07 PM
http://stormofwar.net
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on July 25, 2020, 01:39:09 PM
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Eagler on July 26, 2020, 06:47:38 AM
Visibility is the issue with DCS
The main complaint is you can,t see bogies
Wasn't a big deal with jets and radar bur ww2 planes I can fly around for an hour and never seen another plane
The map stinks
VR blows in it
Great for "realism" maybe and very pretty but boring as hell to play IMO
<S>
Eagler
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Nefarious on July 26, 2020, 12:32:40 PM
Wasn't a big deal with jets and radar bur ww2 planes I can fly around for an hour and never seen another plane
The map stinks
VR blows in it
Great for "realism" maybe and very pretty but boring as hell to play IMO
<S>
Eagler
It's the same in IL2, Very hard to see enemy. People who strive for ultra-realism in their multiplayer servers see lots of friendly fire incidents.
VR doesn't suck in IL2, but it's still difficult to identify contacts in VR.
I own DCS and several mods, just need to sit down and play for several hours. (which I don't have) lol.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Bruv119 on July 26, 2020, 05:18:58 PM
during the free month numbers were great (full servers UK time) but they have since dropped off quite a bit now. DCS isn't AH or IL2 it is a higher level of realism and experten. I feel so elitist saying that but the satisfaction comes from more than just shooting down the enemy repeatedly it's the overall environment.
Storm of war have a loyal following from their IL2 days, big phil has worked very hard to make his server as historically correct as possible.
I had the most fun in LFDM when it was busy. Would like to see the Channel map get used by somebody but again it's another paywall that people should break through with a giant sledgehammer.
Did you crash on take off or get vulched? Big Phil allows vulching, LFDM it is against their code of conduct and will result in timeouts/IP bans.
You can get the 109 cold startup down to about 15 seconds if you need to re-up. :aok
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Bruv119 on July 26, 2020, 05:30:24 PM
Wasn't a big deal with jets and radar bur ww2 planes I can fly around for an hour and never seen another plane
The map stinks
VR blows in it
Great for "realism" maybe and very pretty but boring as hell to play IMO
<S>
Eagler
not quite, the spotting or viewing issue you describe is two things. Your field of view that has to be checked and set for EACH module. Some are defaulted to 140 which gives a fish eye effect, anything between 110-120 is required.
The server host can customise the opacity of dots or "icons" as we would call them here. Everything from the distance, colour and size can be modified (the raw defaults of the game are garbage). The LFDM WW2 server has worked on this recently and Maxime has got it just about perfect for spotting. If anything he has made it a bit too easy from what it was as I find myself struggling to establish whether a contact is close or further away.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Eagler on July 27, 2020, 12:19:52 PM
Hi Bruv
I will adjust the FOV and see if it helps my blind arse
What is the LFDM ww2 server?
I follow Phil and have been on the Storm of War server as I was hoping the F10 radar there would help but doesn't
<S>
Eagler
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on July 28, 2020, 01:32:02 AM
I will adjust the FOV and see if it helps my blind arse
What is the LFDM ww2 server?
I follow Phil and have been on the Storm of War server as I was hoping the F10 radar there would help but doesn't
<S>
Eagler
Communication seems to be key in order to find fights, did you install SRS that most servers are using?
Once you got SRS installed it should connect automatically to the correct SRS server depending on the server you join in DCS. When i was on the last time there seemed to be an ATC directing people.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Brooke on July 28, 2020, 01:41:02 AM
Awesome! But I was hoping for a bit more realism along the lines of:
-- Selecting which preparation of eggs to consume for breakfast prior to first flight of day. -- Manipulating straps, buckles, and laces of flying gear. -- Washing and waxing of aircraft. -- Tire inflation. -- Mustache trimming.
All of these are vital aspects to being a "sierra hotel" ACM experten -- as much or even moreso than flying a pattern around the airfield, mincing about while listening to ATC chatter on the radio, and maybe taking a virtual selfie or two.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: RichardDarkwood on July 28, 2020, 03:48:42 PM
I joined the SOW Discord yesterday, that helped of getting an more community feel to the Server. And as an community and voice communication platform i do find Discord to be an superb tool really.
But as far as SRS goes, i do see alot of people using it, yesterday when i did my sortie in SoW there was 14ppl online in the server, and 10 in total was in SRS, think we were like 5 Axis players and i saw 3 of them in the same SRS channel as me. So saying nobody is using it is not really true i think.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on July 29, 2020, 03:33:57 PM
:cheers:
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: RichardDarkwood on July 29, 2020, 07:05:04 PM
I joined the SOW Discord yesterday, that helped of getting an more community feel to the Server. And as an community and voice communication platform i do find Discord to be an superb tool really.
But as far as SRS goes, i do see alot of people using it, yesterday when i did my sortie in SoW there was 14ppl online in the server, and 10 in total was in SRS, think we were like 5 Axis players and i saw 3 of them in the same SRS channel as me. So saying nobody is using it is not really true i think.
Come check out AGR server in discord and DCS. Lots of people who will go out of their way to get you set up. Some are armchair pilots and most are real life pilots. Two are current Harrier pilots that host missions weekly. 150 active squad members.
I bought the Huey and three of them took the time to help me set it up. One guy named Sidekick gave me a thrustmaster T16000 for the cost of shipping.
for DCS type in 16AGR in the search bar
for Discord https://discord.gg/qM5unm
Website
http://www.16agr.com/
ALL are welcome to stop by
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on July 30, 2020, 02:11:31 PM
Come check out AGR server in discord and DCS. Lots of people who will go out of their way to get you set up. Some are armchair pilots and most are real life pilots. Two are current Harrier pilots that host missions weekly. 150 active squad members.
I bought the Huey and three of them took the time to help me set it up. One guy named Sidekick gave me a thrustmaster T16000 for the cost of shipping.
for DCS type in 16AGR in the search bar
for Discord https://discord.gg/qM5unm
Website
http://www.16agr.com/
ALL are welcome to stop by
Thanks, i sent them an application to join up.
Im not having any problems finding fights now on the SoW server by using the radio radar, but geez yes it is very hard to see and keep track of the enemy airplanes once you made contact. It might get easier once my TrackIR arrives. I feel i loose track completly if i dont keep eyes on the target at all times.
I will keep at it anwhile longer tough, the guys in the SoW discord says it gets easier with some time.
But i might put WWII on hold in DCS untill there is an Server that relaxes the hardcore icon settings if things dont improve. But i hope for an popular DCS WWII server with more relaxed icon settings for sure.
Im thinking of going modern airplanes aswell, perhaps the FA-18. Atleast then i get an modern day HUD with computers tracking the cons xD.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: RichardDarkwood on July 30, 2020, 04:17:50 PM
Im not having any problems finding fights now on the SoW server by using the radio radar, but geez yes it is very hard to see and keep track of the enemy airplanes once you made contact. It might get easier once my TrackIR arrives. I feel i loose track completly if i dont keep eyes on the target at all times.
I will keep at it anwhile longer tough, the guys in the SoW discord says it gets easier with some time.
But i might put WWII on hold in DCS untill there is an Server that relaxes the hardcore icon settings if things dont improve. But i hope for an popular DCS WWII server with more relaxed icon settings for sure.
Im thinking of going modern airplanes aswell, perhaps the FA-18. Atleast then i get an modern day HUD with computers tracking the cons xD.
16AGR servers can be customized to fit everyone's needs. 16AGR Roth has two DCS servers running at his house as well as a TeamSpeak server. We got you. Check out the Huey. You can equip rocket pods mini guns and door gunners with mini guns. They usually run a Vietnam pilot recovery mission.
The current server is set up for CV ops on the new Syria map.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: streakeagle on July 30, 2020, 04:41:13 PM
What DCS has the Aces High doesn't is more historically accurate setups with two sides and the associated aircraft. I have been playing DCS World offline for years. It is my preferred sim that I fly almost every night. I never had luck finding a DCS multiplayer server I like. But right now, I have several to choose from: 2 different Korean War setups, one with AI and one with only players. Vietnam War, showcasing the free A-4E-C Skyhawk mod operating off of carriers with AI. Cold War with all the fighters in the game that came before the US "teen" series and their all-aspect wonder missiles like the AIM-9L and AIM-120.
Spotting is definitely the biggest problem, but a recent patch makes contacts visible at realistic distances. Of course with anti-aliasing effects enabled to compensate for VR's low resolution, they look like little smudges and you can't identify them until they are really close. But all the years I played offline was without labels, so I am used to the problem. A VR dogfight with 4 vs 4 or better at contrail height in MiG-15s and F-86s is a real blast. A good night on DCS is as good or better than the best nights I ever had on Aces High. I really enjoy historical matchups and objectives a lot more than chess piece 3-way arenas with all sides having the same exact aircraft available.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: RichardDarkwood on July 30, 2020, 04:46:03 PM
Friday night is usually Free For All night. 1 vs 1 guns only no missiles in the AGR server. A lot usually show up for that.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Shuffler on July 30, 2020, 05:03:52 PM
What DCS has the Aces High doesn't is more historically accurate setups with two sides and the associated aircraft. I have been playing DCS World offline for years. It is my preferred sim that I fly almost every night. I never had luck finding a DCS multiplayer server I like. But right now, I have several to choose from: 2 different Korean War setups, one with AI and one with only players. Vietnam War, showcasing the free A-4E-C Skyhawk mod operating off of carriers with AI. Cold War with all the fighters in the game that came before the US "teen" series and their all-aspect wonder missiles like the AIM-9L and AIM-120.
Spotting is definitely the biggest problem, but a recent patch makes contacts visible at realistic distances. Of course with anti-aliasing effects enabled to compensate for VR's low resolution, they look like little smudges and you can't identify them until they are really close. But all the years I played offline was without labels, so I am used to the problem. A VR dogfight with 4 vs 4 or better at contrail height in MiG-15s and F-86s is a real blast. A good night on DCS is as good or better than the best nights I ever had on Aces High. I really enjoy historical matchups and objectives a lot more than chess piece 3-way arenas with all sides having the same exact aircraft available.
Evidently you never were in AVA. We used to have very good setups in there. Just most people do not like the 2 sides.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Bruv119 on July 31, 2020, 06:58:16 AM
LFDM should be in the very same list you find SOW in. Look for a French flag. The spotting is easier in there. Numbers are down though, we were having 50/50 every night (GMT) for about 3 months but it appears to have dried up a bit, coming out of lockdown, summer, freebie trial ending, people trying out the P47/190A8 shine worn off etc.
I have tinkered with SRS and it is a really neat tool but I had a few conflicts with Discord, SRS and DCS in game voice, when they were testing that. I couldn't work out which of the 3 was tampering with volume levels in game so resorted to squad Discord only. It was fun to hear randomers all mucking in much like AH range vox especially an entire squadron of French all getting excited (repeat please). Brought it alive quite a bit if you didn't have squaddies to fly with.
The idea is all there, the missions in both servers pretty neat and kept updated by active hosts. Just needs more players if you love dogfighting.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Bruv119 on July 31, 2020, 07:01:11 AM
I will adjust the FOV and see if it helps my blind arse
What is the LFDM ww2 server?
I follow Phil and have been on the Storm of War server as I was hoping the F10 radar there would help but doesn't
<S>
Eagler
If you hit ctrl + pause/break key and hit it a couple of times it will bring up the FPS counter and the FOV setting, zooming in and out will then change the figure.
You can hard set it by editing the server.lua file in notepad in the views directory. A bit long winded and having a general overall game one like AH would be better but it's because each module was completed at different times and they are treated as unique within the game folders.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Eagler on July 31, 2020, 07:29:27 AM
I tried the zoom and it helped some but as soon as I take my eyes off the bogie it is gone.
It blends into the background and I usually only see its tracers going past me
Is there a ww2 online server that uses the dot icon setting?
<S>
Eagler
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on July 31, 2020, 08:08:26 AM
I tried the zoom and it helped some but as soon as I take my eyes off the bogie it is gone.
It blends into the background and I usually only see its tracers going past me
Is there a ww2 online server that uses the dot icon setting?
<S>
Eagler
This is the exact problem im having atm, LFDM server that Bruv is mentioning with the better icons and more players i have heard that one mentioned before, but i cant find it in the server list, ive been looking for it everytime i log on.
And im sure im searching for all servers.
Sounds exactly what im looking for.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Shuffler on July 31, 2020, 10:00:15 AM
That is what used to bring the scenarios alive... all the different accents. Folks chattering in their native tongue.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: CptTrips on July 31, 2020, 10:28:25 AM
This is the exact problem im having atm, LFDM server that Bruv is mentioning with the better icons and more players i have heard that one mentioned before, but i cant find it in the server list, ive been looking for it everytime i log on.
I wonder how hard it is to setup your own server. I've been intrigued by DCS, but feel like the cost is a little ridiculous.
IL2: Desert Wings comes out Aug 6. I'm going to take a deep dive into that for a while. I'd like to learn what is involved in setting up a server so I can have things the way I want it! ;) I'm getting to be ok with engine management, but I want icons. Especially once they add VR (which is the post release priority). VR tech is probably 5 years away from being good enough to tolerate no icons.
Hopefully DW will breath some new life into Blitz as well as it upgrades the same base game. Blitz and I hope DW have quite an advanced mission editor, but the AI definitely needs some improvements. ;)
I wonder if CombatBox will run a DW server...
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: ACE on July 31, 2020, 11:09:27 AM
I want to play DCS so bad but can’t pay for all the equipment lol. I mean I could I just don’t want to right now. I still need pedals track Ir stick and throttle. Can’t be using my Logitech xtreme 3D pro on a hat switch lol. That’s over 1,000$. I have the computer to run it flawlessly. But it’s gonna be awhile for me. Looks amazing though. Love reading about it.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on July 31, 2020, 11:50:33 AM
I want to play DCS so bad but can’t pay for all the equipment lol. I mean I could I just don’t want to right now. I still need pedals track Ir stick and throttle. Can’t be using my Logitech xtreme 3D pro on a hat switch lol. That’s over 1,000$. I have the computer to run it flawlessly. But it’s gonna be awhile for me. Looks amazing though. Love reading about it.
You should be able to get an hotas setup & pedals + Track IR solution for well under 1000$
You should be able to do it for half of that imo and then you get very nice gear.
Im not sure of the current prices but i think i got my Warthog Hotas setup for around 350$, Saitek Combat Rudders for around 150$, and the Track IR alternative DelainClip for like 60$.
The thing that will set you back with DCS is the separate modules tough, you pretty much have to pick the ACs you like and focus on them, like one Warbird & one Modern Jet if you are not made of money :)
Alot of ppl seem to do that tough, buy one AC/Module then get really good at it. But i guess the Modern day stuff gives more longetivity for that aproach.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Eagler on July 31, 2020, 01:35:15 PM
And wait for dcs to have a sale..never pay sticker price
You aren't missing much in game play IMO
I find AH3 much more enjoyable
But if you like pretty graphics, learning how to actually start a plane and fly around looking at the pretty graphics much more than actual fighting ..then dcs might be for you
Its the last part I find extremely boring
They need to have a dar and some sort of icon system to stimulate and accelerate actual A2A fights IMO
But the realism crowd has taken over there
The is why you cannot see anything behind your 9 to 3 line when using VR.
Check out the dcs videos on youtube..a buch of pretty planes flying around, very little action as compared to a typical AH sortie
<S>
Eagler
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: RichardDarkwood on July 31, 2020, 03:48:00 PM
Check out the dcs videos on youtube..a buch of pretty planes flying around, very little action as compared to a typical AH sortie
<S>
Eagler
There is levels of difficulty with video games. DCS being the hardest and Aces High being the lowest.
Aces offers quicker action with lots of interesting characters which has had me hooked since 2000.
DCS is hardcore in a way that is to much for most flight sim enthusiasts who try it out. You are in battles just like the old timers were. Same conditions, no icons, and you have to actually control the aircraft not guide it around using combat trim.
There is nothing like strafing trains in a Thunderbolt in the Channel map.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Shuffler on July 31, 2020, 04:07:52 PM
There is levels of difficulty with video games. DCS being the hardest and Aces High being the lowest.
Aces offers quicker action with lots of interesting characters which has had me hooked since 2000.
DCS is hardcore in a way that is to much for most flight sim enthusiasts who try it out. You are in battles just like the old timers were. Same conditions, no icons, and you have to actually control the aircraft not guide it around using combat trim.
There is nothing like strafing trains in a Thunderbolt in the Channel map.
Not like they did in WWII but a nice try. Online we have less depth perception. That is the reason for icons... like it or not.
If all I wanted to do was fly around, I would try DCS. I have heard about it and have seen it on youtube. Nothing compelling if you are looking for action. I believe most of the gripes here have been about the lack of action. I can't imagine going to a place with so much less.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: ACE on July 31, 2020, 06:14:29 PM
You should be able to get an hotas setup & pedals + Track IR solution for well under 1000$
You should be able to do it for half of that imo and then you get very nice gear.
Im not sure of the current prices but i think i got my Warthog Hotas setup for around 350$, Saitek Combat Rudders for around 150$, and the Track IR alternative DelainClip for like 60$.
The thing that will set you back with DCS is the separate modules tough, you pretty much have to pick the ACs you like and focus on them, like one Warbird & one Modern Jet if you are not made of money :)
Alot of ppl seem to do that tough, buy one AC/Module then get really good at it. But i guess the Modern day stuff gives more longetivity for that aproach.
The setup I want is not cheap lol. So I’m stuck waiting.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: RichardDarkwood on August 01, 2020, 07:59:14 AM
Not like they did in WWII but a nice try. Online we have less depth perception. That is the reason for icons... like it or not.
If all I wanted to do was fly around, I would try DCS. I have heard about it and have seen it on youtube. Nothing compelling if you are looking for action. I believe most of the gripes here have been about the lack of action. I can't imagine going to a place with so much less.
it is closer than aces can get to realism
As for just flying around in DCS, why don't you bring your arse in there and find out if it is just "Flyin Around" as you put it.
And lck of action you mean cherry pickin, vulchin, HO and run away correct?
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Shuffler on August 01, 2020, 08:45:42 AM
As for just flying around in DCS, why don't you bring your arse in there and find out if it is just "Flyin Around" as you put it.
And lck of action you mean cherry pickin, vulchin, HO and run away correct?
The visual candy, the actual startup, thrust maintenance.... more real. No icons online, which we do in AH from time to time, just takes away any thought of depth perception that we do not have ONLINE.
Your last paragraph shows you don't know me.... I'll let your lack of knowledge slide on that one.
Again.... from what I have read about it and the youtube videos that I have seen... nothing there of interest for someone looking for fights. Now that is my opinion and everyone has one. YMMV.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on August 01, 2020, 09:02:43 AM
I must agree to some levels, flyin DCS have opened up my eyes of how easy mode AH was, trim on level, trim on angle, combat trim, almost no risk of blowing your engine? Yes very realistic, like driving an car with an tesla autopilot. In the world of Pizza.
When it comes to the fights, yes you get in to the fights more easily in AH with the icons naming exactly what AC you are facing etc, the perfect distance and more.
DCS is not the ultimate of ultimates tough it have its flaws, but with the correct server and settings in it, it could far outperform AH when it comes to alot of aspects.
I indeed realised how easy mode AH was by starting up the free P51 in DCS. And it has nothing to do with flipping switches in pre flight. After flipping the 5 or so switches the first time, you do it in 10 seconds the second time, but it provides a bit of immersion for sure.
Then again, currently AH offers more in the dogfight department then DCS, and alas so does War Thunder.
AH ended up in this very strange middle ground of WWII online flight sims that is not mentioned anywhere anymore when it comes to this genre, and that is sad, AH did not make an definition so to speak, and is probably paying for it now.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: CptTrips on August 01, 2020, 09:28:20 AM
I'll agree that no icons is more realistic when VR displays produce the resolution and high-dynamic-range of a health 20 yo pilot's vision. Until then, no icons is less realistic because the display technology doesn't provide the kind of information to a player that a young pilot with excellent vision would have at any reasonable distance in real life. They didn't let Mr. Magoo fly fighter planes for a reason.
Icons allow the game to produce a more realistic net outcome, even if by artificial means.
Now there are different setting for range and info level that could be debated. I think the scenario settings it probably closer to realism than the Melee.
And someday, VR display technology will advance to near natural vision levels. Then I'll be OK with no icons.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Toad on August 01, 2020, 10:09:33 AM
Ah the old "realism" debate of icons/no icons. This old chestnut never really goes away.
I remember a thread from 2001 about it. I posted some information from my official USAF UPT T-38 Formation notes. Maybe Puma can chime in with some Formation Notes on viz from his career too.
"Approximately 1000 feet behind Lead tailpipes make black "figure 8" and tail numbers are easily visible but not readable."
What that means, for example, is that you can see the number 8; it's easily visible from 333 yards. But you can't tell if it's an 8 or a 3.
Here's the burner cans. They are about 2-21/2 feet in diameter I'd guess. Beyond 1000 feet they are just kinda a black oblong. Around 1000' you can see the narrowing between the burner can where they meet in the middle, thus the "figure 8".
So, can you see that kind of detail in AH or DCS at 333 yards? Because that's what a pilot would see in real life.
If you can't see that kind of detail in the games then that's....dare I say it....not realistic. :)
Those of you asking for "no icons" are not asking for realism per se. You are asking for a game difficulty level.
Which is fine. If you want a higher level of difficulty just call it for what it is. But it's not "realism".
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on August 01, 2020, 10:23:45 AM
The icons is not a big part of the debate imo, icons are not in debate here imo. there is other factors tough, allready mentioned.
Trim on level, trim on speed, trim on angle, combat trim, no real engine managment or any worries that your engine might blow etc.
Icons are secondary in the debate. Even tough they are extreme in AH, ok that they would give you an indication that you have an con, but the exact airplane type and range information? i dunno man, that is what you would have in an modern day fighter at most. I doubt an modern day fighter would provide the hud information that AH provides.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: CptTrips on August 01, 2020, 10:33:25 AM
The icons is not a big part of the debate imo, that is not what provides realism.
Then there should be no push-'back turning icons on. ;)
I'm alright with the other stuff.
:salute
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on August 01, 2020, 01:37:56 PM
JG 53 Dusty
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on August 01, 2020, 04:14:11 PM
We shall never surrender :airplane:
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: guncrasher on August 01, 2020, 07:05:41 PM
it's funny when i has argument about realism. pushing buttons and moving a stick, or pretty graphics isn't.
realism in a game is only limited by your imagination.
semp
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: save on August 01, 2020, 08:44:50 PM
A much cheaper alternative with most DCS engine management items and early WW2 (BOB), is Cliffs of Dover Blitz. Soon Africa terrian with new planes will be available.
I wait for next sale for DCS WW2 planes and I will fly both sims.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: CptTrips on August 01, 2020, 09:12:46 PM
A much cheaper alternative with most DCS engine management items and early WW2 (BOB), is Cliffs of Dover Blitz. Soon Africa terrian with new planes will be available.
I wait for next sale for DCS WW2 planes and I will fly both sims.
Another week. I’m looking forward to it. And also the new version will be adding Ai improvements back to Dover Blitz.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Bruv119 on August 02, 2020, 04:39:47 AM
I do hope Cliffs Tobruk gets a bit of a player base. It does seem to be the best at bringing historical/combat/spotting together but without VR support I can't see it gaining a foothold compared with IL2 GB or DCS. It caters for the middleground of playability and realism but if you get used to it, having some proper fights a little more rewarding and better looking than AH in it's current form but without the GV or capture the base gameplay. I think they are marketing at around £70 which is a bit steep IMO but that is a one off cost for all of their planes, the map (which is vast, have flown the length of it) and all further updates included.
All those wishlists for a Dewotine, Beaufighter, Wellington, Gladiator, Macchi or insert other random 1941-2 aircraft and it will have it. Those mid war fights were always more enjoyable from a furballing perspective. However the Germans will 90% grab the 109F4 and dominate, as what always happens in any computer game path of least resistance and all that. Having the Spitfire with cannons will also be a gamechanger with the previous version blitz being limited to 303's what with the time frame of BofB.
As for dogfights I've had more intensity in Normandy than ever before (size of map, travel time to fight, instant switch if things get unbalanced etc) but I highly doubt US players get the same experience as their crowd is largely Jets. I also can't deal with more than a couple of hours per sitting as with Track IR and headset usage you start getting tired with the amount of concentration going on. You start wishing for an autopilot "feature" :D
Hopefully I'll see Save and Bozon at somepoint and we can do some wingman flying. That always makes any Sim/Game more enjoyable.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Shuffler on August 02, 2020, 08:08:11 AM
I do hope Cliffs Tobruk gets a bit of a player base. It does seem to be the best at bringing historical/combat/spotting together but without VR support I can't see it gaining a foothold compared with IL2 GB or DCS. It caters for the middleground of playability and realism but if you get used to it, having some proper fights a little more rewarding and better looking than AH in it's current form but without the GV or capture the base gameplay. I think they are marketing at around £70 which is a bit steep IMO but that is a one off cost for all of their planes, the map (which is vast, have flown the length of it) and all further updates included.
All those wishlists for a Dewotine, Beaufighter, Wellington, Gladiator, Macchi or insert other random 1941-2 aircraft and it will have it. Those mid war fights were always more enjoyable from a furballing perspective. However the Germans will 90% grab the 109F4 and dominate, as what always happens in any computer game path of least resistance and all that. Having the Spitfire with cannons will also be a gamechanger with the previous version blitz being limited to 303's what with the time frame of BofB.
As for dogfights I've had more intensity in Normandy than ever before (size of map, travel time to fight, instant switch if things get unbalanced etc) but I highly doubt US players get the same experience as their crowd is largely Jets. I also can't deal with more than a couple of hours per sitting as with Track IR and headset usage you start getting tired with the amount of concentration going on. You start wishing for an autopilot "feature" :D
Hopefully I'll see Save and Bozon at somepoint and we can do some wingman flying. That always makes any Sim/Game more enjoyable.
Will they have multiple terrains? Seems to be some folks issue here. They want terrains that change often.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: RichardDarkwood on August 02, 2020, 08:25:05 AM
I do hope Cliffs Tobruk gets a bit of a player base. It does seem to be the best at bringing historical/combat/spotting together but without VR support I can't see it gaining a foothold compared with IL2 GB or DCS.
There does seem to be a fair amount of interest. I hope TeamFusion doesn't stuff it.
They realize VR support is needed and it is the next post release priority. However, they didn't want to hold up this release for it. Non-VR probably covers the 85% case. Disappointing but reasonable. I broke down and got a trackIR so I can play now, but will enjoy the VR more when it comes.
The prices seems a bit high to me, but I justify it because everything they do for Tobruk also benefits Dover Blitz (e.g. AI and performance improvements, new aircraft, etc.) Also their Full-Mission-Builder is quite impressive and hopefully supports Tobruk as well. I might try my hand at some custom mission/campaigns.
:salute
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on August 02, 2020, 01:45:53 PM
A much cheaper alternative with most DCS engine management items and early WW2 (BOB), is Cliffs of Dover Blitz. Soon Africa terrian with new planes will be available.
I wait for next sale for DCS WW2 planes and I will fly both sims.
I might get CoDB when the expansion hits depending on how many are playing the multiplayer, im not so interested in the single player campain really.
I tried the LFDM server tonite in DCS and it has the same visibility problem as SoW server has, i dont mind flyin with dots only but when the dots are so small that everybody is flyin in circles tryin to spot eachoter...
I googled DCS and visibility issues, and the more higher res monitor you have the worse you are set out to have the issue, its actually better to have an 1080p monitor then 1440p.
I sat and followed one dot/con just now, and it was amazingly small, just one tiny tiny dark pixel on my large monitor, if i had not knew he was there, there is no way i would have spotted him by just flying past, WWII is sadly not feasable in DCS right now for me because of this.
Still tempted to get in to the modern day Jet stuff in DCS tough, sure the spotting issue will still be there, but once you locked on target, the HUD will do its thing.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: CptTrips on August 02, 2020, 02:12:04 PM
I only played with DCS briefly, does it not support icons, or they are just not enable on the servers?
I'm pretty sure Tobruk and Blitz support icon is the server is configured that way. Blitz does have icons in offline if you want them.
I would like to look into what it would take to run a server so I can set it up with icons for us old blind folk. LoL
It does support icons, the single player tutorial missions that come with the BF109 i bought have icons enabled, so i would be supriced if you couldnt enable them on an multiplayer server.
(https://i.imgur.com/SHIuQBo.jpg)
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Eagler on August 04, 2020, 12:50:04 PM
Yes the dot setting is what I try to use offline
I cannot find a ww2 dcs online server setup to use icons
Eagler
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: MORAY37 on August 04, 2020, 06:27:51 PM
I'm splitting all my time between Aces and DCS right now. My brother-in-law is a Lawndar... I mean Viper pilot currently, and we have had some great conversations over a sortie and a beer when he's on leave. His take on it, is that all the switches are more or less accurate in the F-16CM model ....but the electronics aren't, obviously. Also the F-16 is modeled a bit sluggish.... and I'll take him for his word. He was pretty impressed with the realism of the startup and cockpit manipulation though.
I've basically barely moved into the "able to employ weapons with some accuracy" state... and am still setting up buttons. I can CCIP Mark 82's with pretty good accuracy on T-55 sized targets, as well as strafe. Still trying to get used to BVR 120's and HMCS AIM-9x shots though.
:salute
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on August 05, 2020, 04:27:21 AM
I'm splitting all my time between Aces and DCS right now. My brother-in-law is a Lawndar... I mean Viper pilot currently, and we have had some great conversations over a sortie and a beer when he's on leave. His take on it, is that all the switches are more or less accurate in the F-16CM model ....but the electronics aren't, obviously. Also the F-16 is modeled a bit sluggish.... and I'll take him for his word. He was pretty impressed with the realism of the startup and cockpit manipulation though.
I've basically barely moved into the "able to employ weapons with some accuracy" state... and am still setting up buttons. I can CCIP Mark 82's with pretty good accuracy on T-55 sized targets, as well as strafe. Still trying to get used to BVR 120's and HMCS AIM-9x shots though.
:salute
I bought the FA-18 the other day, my first jet in DCS, im really happy that i did tough, having tons of fun learning the thing.
At first all the buttons and switches is intimidating, but after 5-6 hours in it i have no problem with doing an cold start, enabling what should be enabled (from memory), take off, do some basic AA stuff, can handle the AA radar decently. Have shot down some AIs and can land again.
You really learn stuff fast if you just throw yourself at it, and because you have to turn the switches push the buttons etc you learn FAST and you remember it easily, would have been another matter if you had to remember what key to push on your keyboard.
Theres alot of great youtube guides, that can be intimidating when you are new at it, i recommend watching some basic guides, then get at it fly some, play around with the MFD displays etc, THEN go back to the guides when you have som basic knowlege, then you get what they are talking about in the guides more easily.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on August 05, 2020, 04:56:15 PM
This is the guy that runs the SoW server in DCS, going over the issue with dot visibility. The differance from 1080p vs 1440p.
It is much worse then i tought, no wonder i cant see any enemy aircraft in WWII in DCS, And it has not been fixed...
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: CptTrips on August 05, 2020, 05:32:59 PM
This is the guy that runs the SoW server in DCS, going over the issue with dot visibility. The differance from 1080p vs 1440p.
It is much worse then i tought, no wonder i cant see any enemy aircraft in WWII in DCS, And it has not been fixed...
Makes sense.
In one of the recent special events, our flight realized that me and another guy could see the initial contact dots way out further than the others. We had VR which is way less resolution than their monitors. A single pixel is big in our view.
The trade-off? At the point where they go "OK those are spits..." I'm like "uhhh, I'll take your word for it. They are now 6 smudgy pixels in my view.".
You know, there is a technological fix available to equalize that for everyone.... wait for it...... Icons. (Mic drop)
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Eagler on August 06, 2020, 06:54:47 AM
I tried my vr in dcs the last few days on SOW which runs on the latest beta
Still can't see anything
There is a bug where I can stand up in the cockpit and fly with my head and shoulders outside the cockpit.
You can see slightly better then and you have the wind and outside noises too :)
The maps are useless IMO
SOW tries with a text dar but if you have that you should have something useful like a visual dar
The latest news show german radar units being added sometime in the future.
Have to wait and see if that helps in locating fights.
Eagler
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Shuffler on August 06, 2020, 07:32:47 AM
Awsome... very realistic :D
One could setup a WWII Surfing Arena.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: RichardDarkwood on August 06, 2020, 04:16:07 PM
Lol, that landing was definitely sending the Rhino in for maintenance.
You know you can radio in to the tower, right? :) They'll clear the pattern.
The guy who designed those shocks should get an medal imo :), but sure, it was designed to make hard landings on aircraft carriers.
Ya i have to get better on the comms for sure, think i counted 3 AC´s otw to the runway there hehe, i should have said something on SRS for sure.
Quote
Too bad jets are not my thing.
Eagler
Ya i havent flied Jets since Falcon 3/4 days.
But it is great fun actually, really been enjoying the learning curve and fights, and i havent even started with the AG stuff yet, i really recommend it to anyone looking for an new combat flight sim experiance.
Im gonna keep on doing the multiplayer COOP PvE servers for an month or two i think, before i transition to the multiplayer PvP+PvE servers.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: save on August 08, 2020, 09:45:59 AM
Downloading newly released Cliffs of Dover Tobruk right now :aok
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: CptTrips on August 08, 2020, 10:31:08 AM
Downloading newly released Cliffs of Dover Tobruk right now :aok
Downloaded it yesterday.Having fun with it. I'm even learning all the engine management. lol I do leave icons on though. I can tell there have been AI improvements. Hope it doesn't take too long to get VR.
I've started an RAF campaign in BoB. I still can't hit diddly. :rofl I don't know why I find that game so much harder to hit. I can't put my finger on it.
Between Cliffs of Dover + Tobruk + the full BoX set, I think I have my offline campaigning itch scratched for a while. Except maybe I ought to get that Uboat game too. :D
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: save on August 08, 2020, 07:43:53 PM
My experience from BOB from the British side is : set mg convergence to different ranges in pair the most outer etc, and hose down small targets at close distance only, if both radiators are gone for the enemy plane, and they are over Britain, they will not make it back.
For the German side I prefer the Minengeschoss when available for the 20mm, they make a real impression.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: guncrasher on August 08, 2020, 08:55:49 PM
i have my convergence set on all p51 and p47 at 300. i can hit all the way out to 1000. have surprised many pilots.
all turners have it at 200.
semp
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: Maniac on August 11, 2020, 02:25:23 PM
I just got my Delainclip delivered today, its an TrackIR alternative to like 1/3rd the price.
Really happy with it, i know im an decade or so late to the party regarding headtracking, and VR is more immersive for sure, but this will have to do untill the truly next gen VR headsets arrive.
Really happy with this piece of hardware.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: bozon on August 17, 2020, 03:10:14 PM
My experience with DCS is that I really REALLY need to love the planes that I buy. Learning a new plane is a choir. The more modern it is, the less appealing it becomes for me. Too many damn modes and options for too many systems.
I bought 1 jet - the Mig21bis. This is as modern as I can stand them and the radar is super easy to use: 1. Switch it off. 2. Done.
My other plane is the P47D30. I love messing around with it even though it is not completed yet. Fighting with it is another story - I am completely blind. Half the planes around me I cannot see even when I look straight at them. Half of those that I do spot and shoot at turn out to be friendly... well maybe not so friendly now. Luckily half of those friendlies that I shoot at survive because convergence is currently fixed to 1000 yards and cannot be changes.
DCS is a wonderful sim, a mediocre offline game, and a meh online game. Their next WWII plane is the Mossie FB.VI. I have a new box of tissues ready next to my computer for when I ejaculate at its release.
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: CptTrips on August 18, 2020, 05:14:40 PM
I guess they are trying to steal some of MS's thunder. :D
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: eddiek on August 18, 2020, 10:05:28 PM
At the current discounts, you can the four game set for $79. Not a bad deal, even though my first experience with the IL-2 stuff was less than I expected. Looks like I may be making a purchase between now and the 24th.................
Title: Re: First flight in DCS
Post by: mikeWe9a on August 24, 2020, 04:58:20 PM
Hmm, that sale seems to have ended early. Showing at full price on Steam for me