i would rarly turn a tempest with anything, unless its like a 190 or something horid in the turns. When i pick in my tempest i can usually get the angle i need by the time i get to the target and shoot, i only get slow with a Temp if i can win the turn fight, usually the 190 family, other than a 152. Bosco, you ever want to wing in a Tempest, if im havin a good day ill go up with you.