Author Topic: DCS: MiG-15bis  (Read 1183 times)

Offline Serenity

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Re: DCS: MiG-15bis
« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2014, 12:29:28 AM »
Well, here's my experience (might be outdated):

The only way I could ever find anything that isn't already on my radar was AWACS. There should be a request for closest enemy or similar. I believe requesting a picture lists all enemy contacts starting with the closest. AWACS should give them to you in BRAA (Bearing, Range, Alitude, Attitude [pronounced brah]) format.

The su-27 radar display shows friendlies as two lines of the little rectangles and enemies as one. Also FYI, 2 little rectangles is a medium sized contact (fighter), and 4 is a large (bomber).

As for locking onto them, you should probably read the controls. Really don't understand why anyone would jump into a game like this without at least looking at the bindable controls and then wonder how to do something. There should be targeting cursor (or something like that) up, down, etc. and target lock and unlock under sensors. Read the rest of it too, they didn't slap things like airbrakes and external lights on these things just because they were bored.

If you have any other questions about controls I'll probably be able to answer them. I only mapped my CH HOTAS to each plane about a hundred times.

As for reading the controls, trust me, I have. The very first thing I do is go through the controls and training videos. I have pages and pages of checklists for every DCS aircraft, with both the english explanation, and the Russian characters to look for in the cockpit. I like the realism, and part of that for me is knowing every switch, every dial, and approaching every DCS flight like I approach my real life flights.

That being said, the resources available for the Su-27 are not on par with the Mi-8 and Ka-50. I don't know if you've tried the Su-27 campaign, but that's the extent of my Su-27 experience, so I'll use that as a reference. There is a mission where you have to intercept a pair of drones. The waypoints are the same rectangle as every other mission, and the entire time you're up, you're getting a constant stream of enemy contacts, but you're not authorized to engage those in the ROE, you're only hunting two predators. I ended up finding them on my F10 map, and thus finding them on my radar as well, but in BVR mode, while I had a targeting cursor, I had my radar on, I had the predator right on my nose (Icons were turned on), and I had the targeting gate over the predator, the lines that identify an enemy were not on the hud, and my lock target button did nothing. I kept closing, no dice, finally I got close enough to go boresight, got the lock with that, and shot. I also verified I had radar guided missiles selected and not heaters.

The next mission, I'm supposed to escort two flights of Su-25s on a strike run, but the waypoints are the exact same rectangle, which did not include a path to escort the Su-25s. I flew the rectangle, and only found the Su-25s with the F10 map again. I followed them, and without any warning (or radar contact) I see F-16 icons ahead. Again, can't lock them BVR, so I close, boresight and a kill, but now I've lost sight of the Su-25s, and I've got a bunch of icons on my radar, but I cannot fight an explanation of how to read the radar screen icons, so I don't know what I'm actually looking at.

I'm certain there are bits of information I'm missing, and I'm relying on the F10 map far too much. I've repeated the training missions ad nauseum, but I seem to still be missing some fundamentals, and while I'm constantly reading there forums, I seem to be starting WAY behind the power curve.

Offline Chalenge

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Re: DCS: MiG-15bis
« Reply #16 on: December 14, 2014, 01:04:45 AM »
Some of the guys that used to be devoted to F4 and now are on BMS have begun transitioning into DCS. Of those few have transitioned into posting on YouTube and none are making tutorials. Sorry to say I don't think any of them are flying for Russia online either way. I have been posting tutorials for my squad guys up until now and I was planning on changing that to public, but those plans are on hold at the moment.
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Offline Mar

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Re: DCS: MiG-15bis
« Reply #17 on: December 14, 2014, 01:31:08 AM »
As for reading the controls, trust me, I have. The very first thing I do is go through the controls and training videos. I have pages and pages of checklists for every DCS aircraft, with both the english explanation, and the Russian characters to look for in the cockpit.

Alright cool, apologies for barking at you about that.

Yes you are right the training is terrible. I gave up any idea of trying to learn SA, and I just generally gave up DCS for the time being because I don't like PvP, can't see anything without labels, making your own missions is boring, missiles don't work, the list goes on.

the lines that identify an enemy were not on the hud

Do you mean that the contacts were displayed as friendly? As for not being able to lock, depends on range and radar look-down. With those small targets it's best to come at them from below so the radar doesn't have to sort out ground returns. If that's what you're doing, then I'm going to chalk it up to yet another thing that Eagle Dynamics can't get right. Honestly, that mission doesn't have a thunderstorm between you and the targets, there's nothing keeping you from locking them.

For more evidence that missiles are FUBAR, check out the r27 24 shot-24 missed thread in the FC3 forum. I don't know if much changed, but based on the quick look earlier missiles are the same empty straws they were when I last played.
𝒻𝓇𝑜𝓂 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝓈𝒽𝒶𝒹𝑜𝓌𝓈 𝑜𝒻 𝓌𝒶𝓇'𝓈 𝓅𝒶𝓈𝓉 𝒶 𝒹𝑒𝓂𝑜𝓃 𝑜𝒻 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝒶𝒾𝓇 𝓇𝒾𝓈𝑒𝓈 𝒻𝓇𝑜𝓂 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝑔𝓇𝒶𝓋𝑒

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Offline Sombra

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Re: DCS: MiG-15bis
« Reply #18 on: December 14, 2014, 08:30:01 AM »
MiG-15bis vs F-86F, nice but the sabre F owns the MiG, IIRC. MiG-15bis vs F-86E would be more interesting. Don't you think?

Offline MrRiplEy[H]

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Re: DCS: MiG-15bis
« Reply #19 on: December 14, 2014, 09:52:46 AM »
For more evidence that missiles are FUBAR, check out the r27 24 shot-24 missed thread in the FC3 forum. I don't know if much changed, but based on the quick look earlier missiles are the same empty straws they were when I last played.

Better yet we can hope they're modeled just correctly. We don't need working weapons for our enemy.
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Offline Serenity

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Re: DCS: MiG-15bis
« Reply #20 on: December 14, 2014, 12:55:36 PM »
Alright cool, apologies for barking at you about that.

Yes you are right the training is terrible. I gave up any idea of trying to learn SA, and I just generally gave up DCS for the time being because I don't like PvP, can't see anything without labels, making your own missions is boring, missiles don't work, the list goes on.

Do you mean that the contacts were displayed as friendly? As for not being able to lock, depends on range and radar look-down. With those small targets it's best to come at them from below so the radar doesn't have to sort out ground returns. If that's what you're doing, then I'm going to chalk it up to yet another thing that Eagle Dynamics can't get right. Honestly, that mission doesn't have a thunderstorm between you and the targets, there's nothing keeping you from locking them.

For more evidence that missiles are FUBAR, check out the r27 24 shot-24 missed thread in the FC3 forum. I don't know if much changed, but based on the quick look earlier missiles are the same empty straws they were when I last played.

I hear you. I REALLY like the realism of DCS, and I love the Helo campaigns, but once I blow through those, there's nothing left. I'm trying to get involved with an online squad to see if that opens new options, but from what I've seen, multiplayer just isn't as easy to jump into and learn as AH.

For the contacts, I had icons on, so I pointed my nose right at them, but those dashed lines that you mentioned appearing on the hud that you put the targeting gate on never appeared. I got closer and closer, but the gate wouldn't lock onto the icon, and those dashed lines weren't there, so I had to go boresight eventually.

Offline Mar

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Re: DCS: MiG-15bis
« Reply #21 on: December 14, 2014, 01:31:42 PM »
Based on that, sounds like you might have had the thermal sensor (IRST) activated instead of radar. I would imagine the drones have a very tiny heat sig at range.

If you are using radar, other things to check are if I the radar is pointing too high or low (good luck with that, I never could figure that out with the Russian birds; best thing would be to check target's altitude then put yourself at same or a bit lower and leave the radar controls alone), range setting might have the target off the screen but IIRC if the setting was for example at min farther targets were just stuck at the very top of the display and vice versa.

Oh! And if you know if the target is flying away from you use medium pulse frequency, if towards you use high. That technically should make it show up faster than the default (interleaved).
𝒻𝓇𝑜𝓂 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝓈𝒽𝒶𝒹𝑜𝓌𝓈 𝑜𝒻 𝓌𝒶𝓇'𝓈 𝓅𝒶𝓈𝓉 𝒶 𝒹𝑒𝓂𝑜𝓃 𝑜𝒻 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝒶𝒾𝓇 𝓇𝒾𝓈𝑒𝓈 𝒻𝓇𝑜𝓂 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝑔𝓇𝒶𝓋𝑒

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Offline Serenity

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Re: DCS: MiG-15bis
« Reply #22 on: December 14, 2014, 08:37:13 PM »
Based on that, sounds like you might have had the thermal sensor (IRST) activated instead of radar. I would imagine the drones have a very tiny heat sig at range.

If you are using radar, other things to check are if I the radar is pointing too high or low (good luck with that, I never could figure that out with the Russian birds; best thing would be to check target's altitude then put yourself at same or a bit lower and leave the radar controls alone), range setting might have the target off the screen but IIRC if the setting was for example at min farther targets were just stuck at the very top of the display and vice versa.

Oh! And if you know if the target is flying away from you use medium pulse frequency, if towards you use high. That technically should make it show up faster than the default (interleaved).

Well, I just jumped into a multiplayer server, and had no more luck figuring out air-to-air, but I did have a friendly fly around so I could practice targeting him, and noticed something. Even with him squarely in the center of my HUD, those dashed lines were WAY at the bottom of it, and sometimes I would have to dive another 15-20 degrees below him to get the dashed lines to appear, even with the radar antenna centered.

Offline Mar

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Re: DCS: MiG-15bis
« Reply #23 on: December 14, 2014, 09:31:28 PM »
Yes, the closer the target the lower it is on the HUD. If the target is say 100km away and you have the radar display range to 64km the target should be at the very top. As for having to dive so far below to see him at that range...

Tell ya what, I'm going to fire up DCS and get a feel for it again so I can give you more info tomorrow.
𝒻𝓇𝑜𝓂 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝓈𝒽𝒶𝒹𝑜𝓌𝓈 𝑜𝒻 𝓌𝒶𝓇'𝓈 𝓅𝒶𝓈𝓉 𝒶 𝒹𝑒𝓂𝑜𝓃 𝑜𝒻 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝒶𝒾𝓇 𝓇𝒾𝓈𝑒𝓈 𝒻𝓇𝑜𝓂 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝑔𝓇𝒶𝓋𝑒

  "Onward to the land of kings—via the sky of aces!"
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Offline Serenity

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Re: DCS: MiG-15bis
« Reply #24 on: December 14, 2014, 10:54:00 PM »
Yes, the closer the target the lower it is on the HUD. If the target is say 100km away and you have the radar display range to 64km the target should be at the very top. As for having to dive so far below to see him at that range...

Tell ya what, I'm going to fire up DCS and get a feel for it again so I can give you more info tomorrow.

Awesome, I appreciate that!

Offline Mar

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Re: DCS: MiG-15bis
« Reply #25 on: December 15, 2014, 10:37:37 PM »
Yep, definitely come at these things from below. Just did the mission and even the AWACS was having a hard time keeping track of them (useless flying disk!). Shot a missile at the last one and his path happened to go perpendicular to mine, so he notched and my missile was trashed. Dove below his alt and had no problem avenging my missile.

It is a royal pain to get these things on radar without AWACS, even with the f10 map. Other than that the avionics seem to be working well, and so are the missiles to my surprise. The Su-27 flight model is a different story, but of course is still in beta.
𝒻𝓇𝑜𝓂 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝓈𝒽𝒶𝒹𝑜𝓌𝓈 𝑜𝒻 𝓌𝒶𝓇'𝓈 𝓅𝒶𝓈𝓉 𝒶 𝒹𝑒𝓂𝑜𝓃 𝑜𝒻 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝒶𝒾𝓇 𝓇𝒾𝓈𝑒𝓈 𝒻𝓇𝑜𝓂 𝓉𝒽𝑒 𝑔𝓇𝒶𝓋𝑒

  "Onward to the land of kings—via the sky of aces!"
  Oh, and zack1234 rules. :old:

Offline Russian

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Re: DCS: MiG-15bis
« Reply #26 on: January 26, 2015, 01:35:35 PM »