Author Topic: And another fellow Canuck gun store worker is shot  (Read 1108 times)

Offline Gman

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And another fellow Canuck gun store worker is shot
« on: October 11, 2002, 07:17:56 PM »
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GUN SHOP OWNER SHOT
Former Edmonton cop wounded in the leg during attempted robbery last night

By RAQUEL EXNER and DAN PALMER, EDMONTON SUN

A retired Edmonton police sergeant suffered a gunshot wound to the leg last night after a botched robbery by two masked gun-toting men in his downtown gun shop.

Phil Harnois suffered one gunshot wound to the upper leg during the 8 p.m. attempted robbery at Klondike Arms & Antiques, also known as P & D Enterprises, at 10552 115 St. Both assailants were brandishing handguns and fled the bloody scene after the shooting.

Harnois, the owner of the gun store, was conscious and listed in stable condition in University hospital late last night.

City police Insp. Dennis Pysyk said the shopkeeper and a woman were getting ready to close the store when the attempted heist happened.

"It's too early to tell what the motive for the robbery was as no demands were made by the suspects," said Pysyk.

North Division Staff Sgt. Brian Nowlan said Harnois retired about five years ago from North Division after reaching the rank of sergeant.

Nowlan said fellow officers at the station talked last night about how Harnois was never seriously hurt during his years on the force, but was shot in retirement.

"That's a little strange - ironic," said Nowlan, who has fond memories of his former colleague.

"He's always been a street guy. He wasn't an (administration) guy. He paid his dues. He never took a cushy job."

Downtown Division Sgt. Kevin Galvin said Harnois always took time out to keep the victim of a crime informed about a case when he worked as a detective in major crimes - sometimes joking with them on the phone for a few minutes to make them feel at ease.

"He was very committed to the craft," he said.

Harnois was also keen on police officer safety, which was one of the reasons he started his business, said Galvin.

"He brought in the stuff the organizations didn't provide, but allowed us to use," said Galvin, referring to such items as high-quality handcuffs and gun shoulder holsters for undercover officers.

Cops late last night continued the hunt for the gunmen and are pleading for any witnesses who may have seen the masked duo, or anyone with information about the case, to call police.

Cops did a high-risk takedown near 109 Street and 87 Avenue minutes after the shooting but the people in the vehicle tuned out not to be the suspects.

Investigators found a gun on the sidewalk in front of the store and placed a box over it before it was recovered. About five cruisers were on scene, as well as a police van and a forensics unit. The scene was cordoned off in yellow police tape.

In July 1993, three teens from the Stony Plain area faced charges after the manager of a downtown shooting range and gun shop was fatally shot in the head. Gordon Davidge was shot during an armed robbery at the former Firing Line, 10343 107 St., shop. Five handguns were taken.




I do buisness with Phil and his wife Diane on a regular basis.  I'm beyond pissed off now.  I just went from a "make sure my customers and people using my range don't get hurt by a robber' to a "shooting him in the face the second he walks in and tries to hold me up" mentality.  Since I can draw and fire in .6 seconds or faster, I'm willing to roll the dice now and very confident on the outcome.  I'm convinced that this scum in our society is only going to be stopped by using more force on them than they use on us, and as of now, I'm going to do it.

Also, the firing line bit in the story was also an old pal of mine.  One of my best friends Don Godfray ran the Calgary Firing Line, and was hit the next day by the same guys who had hit the Edmonton Location.  His guardian angel was with him that day, and they never shot him, like they did his co-worker and co-manager from Edmonton.

Very angry Gman.  
« Last Edit: October 11, 2002, 07:20:25 PM by Gman »

Offline Maverick

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And another fellow Canuck gun store worker is shot
« Reply #1 on: October 11, 2002, 10:28:57 PM »
Gman,

Remember to stay focused on the job, You have other customers who are NOT a problem. Don't let it color your whole world.

Welcome to the world those in uniform face every day. Not a very pleasant place is it? Don't let it rule your world or guide your actions. Act with for thought, not malice. do what you have to but remember IF you do have to act, shoot to STOP, not to kill. Key phrase there. Both might have to occur but you shoot to stop ONLY.

If you follow the "Col." (you ought to know who it is) then you must maintain condition yellow. Red takes too much energy and will leave you too fatigued to react properly when and IF there is a problem. "Gameplay" the contingencies but remember the same factors may not be present if the "refuse hits the air motivator."

Copy friend?
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Offline Nash

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And another fellow Canuck gun store worker is shot
« Reply #2 on: October 11, 2002, 11:26:25 PM »
Live by the sword, get poked in the leg by the sword.


Rut roh....

:D

Offline Kieran

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And another fellow Canuck gun store worker is shot
« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2002, 07:59:07 AM »
Was wondering which Canuck would pull that first, Nash... almost sounded as though it was his own fault, the way you put it.

Offline Innominate

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« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2002, 08:15:59 AM »
Shoot to stop?

Is that like "Shoot him, but dont hurt him too badly!"?  A wounded man can't operate a firearm?

It strikes me as stupid to do anything but pull the trigger untill nothing happens.  Then again, I'm not a law enforcement agent, and don't like people in general.

Offline Gman

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« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2002, 09:19:20 AM »
Thanks Mav, good advice, I'm a big fan of Cooper myself as well.

Nash, go fly your Nik you newb :p.

Offline Maverick

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« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2002, 02:21:25 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Innominate
Shoot to stop?

Is that like "Shoot him, but dont hurt him too badly!"?  A wounded man can't operate a firearm?

It strikes me as stupid to do anything but pull the trigger untill nothing happens.  Then again, I'm not a law enforcement agent, and don't like people in general.


Innominate,

The shoot to stop guideline is for two reasons.
1. Stop the individual from any more hostile action. If the stop involves that persons dicorporation, so be it. It involves making him STOP being a threat. The fact that you shoot center of mass tends to make it a bit permanent to the target, but the desired result is to effect the cessation of hostile actions from the individual that created the threat.

2. The second factor of course is the lawsuit that inevitably happens.
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Offline Pongo

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And another fellow Canuck gun store worker is shot
« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2002, 04:25:31 PM »
Is this a side effect of how hard it is to get a gun in canada now..people think its worth it to steal them at gun point?
Do any of these gun stores get robbed without a shoot out?

Offline Gman

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And another fellow Canuck gun store worker is shot
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2002, 05:08:08 PM »
Oh believe me, it isn't hard to get a gun in Canada at all anymore, see my post in the Sniper thread regarding that.

It's a sign of criminals being more and more brash, and being even more greedy, as on a cost per weight basis, stealing guns ins't much different than stealing gold.

Offline CavemanJ

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« Reply #9 on: October 12, 2002, 05:56:40 PM »
Mav I have to question the 'shoot to stop' advice.  In a situation where it's me or him, I shoot to kill.  Double tap high center mass.  Shooting to stop, the way I see it, is more of winging a perp in the shoulder in the hopes of disarming them or something.
The lawsuits are gonna happy either way, especially with how everyone loves to run to court for a free buck these days, and dead men tell no tales.  And I've always trained that drawing is the last resort, but if you have to shoot, shoot to kill.

Offline SC-Sp00k

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« Reply #10 on: October 13, 2002, 08:20:20 AM »
Cowboys shoot to kill. Theres a lotta dead Cowboys :)
Only the badguys shoot to kill these days.
You need to read between the lines more. You aim for the Centre mass and shoot to stop the threat.

Offline CavemanJ

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« Reply #11 on: October 13, 2002, 09:11:05 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by SC-Sp00k
Cowboys shoot to kill. Theres a lotta dead Cowboys :)
Only the badguys shoot to kill these days.
You need to read between the lines more. You aim for the Centre mass and shoot to stop the threat.


Double tap high center mass from a .45ACP is usually shooting to kill :D

Offline Maverick

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« Reply #12 on: October 13, 2002, 02:13:20 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by CavemanJ
Mav I have to question the 'shoot to stop' advice.  In a situation where it's me or him, I shoot to kill.  Double tap high center mass.  Shooting to stop, the way I see it, is more of winging a perp in the shoulder in the hopes of disarming them or something.
The lawsuits are gonna happy either way, especially with how everyone loves to run to court for a free buck these days, and dead men tell no tales.  And I've always trained that drawing is the last resort, but if you have to shoot, shoot to kill.


Cave,

Read the post again. As I said in it the goal is shoot to stop. The location to shoot to stop is center mass, largest target zone. Now look at a regulation profile target and see where the scoring rings are. I think you will see your target zone and center mass are about the same.

Claiming you are shooting to kill lands you into the area of criminal homicide as far as the bottom feeders are concerned. They will twist it to mean that you really intended to kill the person originally and provoked it to the point where you got to do the murder, not just stop someone from taking YOUR life. Get it now? Shoot to kill implies an intent to murder, not save your skin.

If you shoot to stop and the suspect dies well, that is a probable reaction to being shot but you didn't INTEND to kill him / her.
DEFINITION OF A VETERAN
A Veteran - whether active duty, retired, national guard or reserve - is someone who, at one point in their life, wrote a check made payable to "The United States of America", for an amount of "up to and including my life."
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