Author Topic: rudder control  (Read 880 times)

Monte99

  • Guest
rudder control
« on: November 30, 2000, 05:08:00 PM »
This has probably been done to death, but anybody using dedicated rudder pedals these days? I've been getting by with the twist rudder on the MS Sidewinder PPro; just wondered if foot pedals add anything. Or if that lefthanded throttle setup like Saitek is worth anything, for that matter. I want to set my next computer up as the ultimate (sort of) combat sim rig...

Offline SKurj

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3630
rudder control
« Reply #1 on: November 30, 2000, 05:56:00 PM »
Heya

I think you will find alot of guys using pedals.  I have one of those twisty sticks myself and found it quite difficult to maintain precise rudder control while manuvering.  Sooo AH and a few other sims accept multiple controllers.  I am using an MS SW Prec Pro USB with a TM Supersport wheel and pedal combo. +)  I use the stick for everything except rudder which I use the pedals from the TM combo.  I guess I could possibly setup the wheel perhaps for taxiing +)

I love pedals and would never go back to stwisty stickin...

AKSKurj

Monte99

  • Guest
rudder control
« Reply #2 on: November 30, 2000, 07:56:00 PM »
Thx for the advice. I like the look of the new CH rudder pedals -- can even use 'em as toe brakes in AH, it appears. One other question: if the stick is USB and the pedals are USB, do they each take their own USB port?

Offline DrSoya

  • Zinc Member
  • *
  • Posts: 51
rudder control
« Reply #3 on: November 30, 2000, 11:09:00 PM »
Yes, they take a port each, and are listed individually as controllers (the X36U throttle connects on the joystick, so both take only 1 USB port, and are seen by Windows as only 1 controller). That means only games that support multiple controllers will see your rudder pedals, and very few games do (AH does; WarBirds doesn't).

The CH Pro Pedals USB are great, I got a pair to use with my Saitek X36U combo.

The X36U rudder rocker on the throttle is too awkward to use for me. I'd have probably been able to get as proficient with it as I was with the twisting stick of my old MS SideWinder 3D Pro, if it were not for 2 important factors:

- I'm a right-handed guy to the extreme, and control of rudder using only 2 clumsy fingers while having to use the two rotary dials, two buttons, two hat switches and two mode switches would have been quite hard for me to master, not impossible, but:

- I got carpal tunnel syndrome. Since the throttle rotates over an arc, instead of sliding on the base, at full throttle the wrist is bent and controlling the rudders with the rocker in that position is uncomfortable for me, and leads to pain after a while (I know, I had to use the rocker for weeks in WarBirds, before making AH my only home)

Because of that, it was clear from the first though that I was getting rudder pedals with my Saitek X36U.

I'm pretty satisfied with the range of the rocker though. I have no doubt it allows the same precision of control as with twisting sticks, with practice. I just can't use it this way though.

I love my setup.  

DrSoya

P.S. Some guy programmed a driver that gives Saitek X36U users support for external rudder pedals. It replaces the input from the throttle rudder rocker with the input from external rudders (gameport or USB), so in that way we can still use the external rudder pedals in games that recognize only one controller. The only game I know of in which it doesn't work, is European Air War (because of a bug in EAW). If you want more info on that subject, check the Saitek X36 USB Help Center.

[This message has been edited by DrSoya (edited 11-30-2000).]

Monte99

  • Guest
rudder control
« Reply #4 on: December 01, 2000, 08:50:00 AM »
Excellent post! Thanks. Ordering those pedals today.

Offline Lephturn

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1200
      • http://lephturn.webhop.net
rudder control
« Reply #5 on: December 01, 2000, 12:07:00 PM »
It comes down to this for me.  The twisty stick rudder control is good enough for ACM and BFM, but not good enough to tune your firing solution.

When you are in a stallfight and both of you are trying to get guns-on at 100 Mph, the guy with the pedal rudders will kick your ass.  Rudder pedals will give much finer control in situations like this where the twist rudders will tend to over-control leading to bounce.  In short with the twist stick you'll miss more in low speed situations especially.  It matters at high speed as well I find, but not as much as you are less likely to get over-cotrol and "bounce".

It also matters in head-on confrontations.  The fellows with rudder pedals can make the fine adjustments much better and will generally out-shoot a twist stick shooter.

I've had a Microsoft twisty stick for many years and still use one.  I find if I do 1v1's against good pilots, I'll lose the low-speed HO's at the top of vertical fights most of the time.  I think a set of pedals would allow me to make those shots.

I'd like to see a comparison of gunnery percentage between twisty stick users and pedal users.  I'll bet you dollars to doughnuts that the rudder pedal folks would have a much higher gunnery percentage overall.

------------------
Lephturn - Chief Trainer
A member of The Flying Pigs  http://www.flyingpigs.com

"A pig is a jolly companion,
Boar, sow, barrow, or gilt --
A pig is a pal, who'll boost your morale,
Though mountains may topple and tilt.
When they've blackballed, bamboozled, and burned you,
When they've turned on you, Tory and Whig,
Though you may be thrown over by Tabby and Rover,
You'll never go wrong with a pig, a pig,
You'll never go wrong with a pig!"
-- Thomas Pynchon, "Gravity's Rainbow"

[This message has been edited by Lephturn (edited 12-01-2000).]