Author Topic: No flaps climb  (Read 991 times)

Offline SavedSaint

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No flaps climb
« on: December 24, 2004, 10:20:32 AM »
Okay..
The other day i found a post about the double imm (the double loop w/ roll in middle of it)
After that i learned how to rope.

On the way up on secound loop sometimes i have trouble climbing it (mainly in ki 84la) so i bring flaps down to a center.

is this a good idea.. Is it a good idea to try to climb with flaps down a notch.
what effect does it have..

Offline Flyboy

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No flaps climb
« Reply #1 on: December 24, 2004, 10:38:02 AM »
basicly flaps do the following: they increase lift and decrease speed (becuase they produce drag)


so in a sustaind climb flaps will not help you, but if you need to get the plane just over the loop then by all means use them.

i use flaps alot when trying to rope an oponent, they help you "hang" up there for those extra precious seconds before you bring down the hammer

Offline SavedSaint

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No flaps climb
« Reply #2 on: December 24, 2004, 10:46:14 AM »
i was thinking that flapsdown will keep drag down and make you climbe higher.. quicker...

but i don't think im right.

Offline StarOfAfrica2

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No flaps climb
« Reply #3 on: December 24, 2004, 11:53:52 AM »
Various planes have different types of flaps designed to do different things.  But the effect in all planes is the same, in varying degrees.  Engaging "flaps" brings part of the trailing edge of the wing down.  In any plane, this increases drag, as it would have to.  It also increases lift.  

In most planes, this is used for landing.  As you approach the airfield, and your speed drops into the range where control becomes difficult and you approach stall, dropping the flaps will help slow you down while giving you extra lift to stay in the air and maintain control until you are on the ground.  

In other planes, designed with "combat flaps", the flaps are actually intended to be used in a fight to tighten the turns and help maintain control of the aircraft in those turns.  They engage at the first "notch" in relatively shallow degrees, to minimize drag and slightly increase lift.  Minimized or not, they still produce extra drag.

In AH, as in other sims, you will see people use the first kind to do the job of the second kind, with various degrees of success.  You can definitely use them in loops or Immelmans to help "get you over the top", although if you are performing an Immelman and you are that slow at the top, it rather defeats the purpose and leaves you a sitting target.

Offline TequilaChaser

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No flaps climb
« Reply #4 on: December 24, 2004, 11:55:20 AM »
Saved Saint,
in most cases when performing a double Immel you will need to drop at least 1 notch if not 2 when going into and finishing up the second Immel, your speed will have bled offf to much to try and do this with out flaps. Not saying it can not be done but most times youshould use a notch or 2 of flaps..........Some even use a notch when performing a basic Immel just to help,  regarding loops use of flaps is good when slow near top of loop to help kick plane over the top faster, to get started back on the down slop once pointed down bring in flaps fast

Flaps cause drag period, how much drag verses the speed you want/need is the key factor, you do not want to be in a situation where the drag overcomes the lift and leaves you in a crawling state of flight. Unless you specifically chose to be in that type of situation like trying to stall out your lower opponent
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Offline Ack-Ack

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No flaps climb
« Reply #5 on: December 24, 2004, 03:52:00 PM »
In all truth, you really shouldn't have to use flaps to get over the top of the 2nd Immelman when doing the Vertical 8.  If you have to use flaps then that means you started the maneuver without sufficient energy.  Now, if you were going for a triple Immelman then flaps will be needed to get you over the top of the 3rd Immelman.



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Offline SavedSaint

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No flaps climb
« Reply #6 on: December 24, 2004, 04:07:21 PM »
well...

first think i do is leave flaps at maxed..

after i roll and nose up.. i then decrease flaps a notch.. and check my 6.. if a plance is gaining on me, then i can level and turn.. it then kind of looks like a loop with a top spin..

but if i got secound loop and am nosed up i make sure my flaps are all the way down..

then i look at bogey.. and engage full flaps.. as i do the plance flips right over and levels easy...

Offline Ack-Ack

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No flaps climb
« Reply #7 on: December 24, 2004, 07:16:13 PM »
When you are doing the Vertical 8, you want to pull no more than 3.5 Gs on the first Immelman.  This will help you preserve your energy during the maneuver and help sucker the guy into following you up.  For the second Immelman, pull it a little tighter.  If you're blacking out during any part of the maneuver, you're pulling too many G's and needlessly wasting your energy.

I don't know for other planes but in the P-38, the best speed to do a Vertical 8 is 350mph IAS but you can do the maneuver with as little as 300mph IAS.  



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"If Jesus came back as an airplane, he would be a P-38." - WW2 P-38 pilot
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Offline TequilaChaser

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No flaps climb
« Reply #8 on: December 24, 2004, 08:15:00 PM »
Ack-Ack how much you need for a triple Immel ?  in the 38, I never tryed or tested for the triple Immel
"When one considers just what they should say to a new pilot who is logging in Aces High, the mind becomes confused in the complex maze of info it is necessary for the new player to know. All of it is important; most of it vital; and all of it just too much for one brain to absorb in 1-2 lessons" TC

Offline StarOfAfrica2

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No flaps climb
« Reply #9 on: December 24, 2004, 09:39:26 PM »
I would think 350 IAS would be enough for a triple even, although you'd have to walk it up the last leg with the flaps.  Or I take that back.  I would.  Ack Ack might be a different story lol.