Bye bye, GM

[rkanjl]

Bye bye GM...hello Government Motors.

rkanjl

[Masherbrum]

Land Rover and Aston were profitable. Aston was sold to raise capitol. Land Rover was the sweetener for someone to take Jaguar off their hands. I agree that both were much better companies after Ford than before though.

Ford did make Jaguar better as well. It just took them longer and cost more than they ever thought. Ironically, they've bailed just as they finally seem to have gotten it right. The XK and XF are stunning and the new XJ is due out soon. Those are all the fruits of Ford's work. Its now OK to be under 50 and drive a Jag because they are cool. They've also done well in customer sat surveys for a number of years (although I think these surveys are more a representation of a customers expectations of a vehicle rather than the reality i.e. buy a Kia and you'll rave about it if the engine starts each time you turn it whereas buy a Merc and you'll slate it if the leather isn't the right kind of soft). All that said, with the current economic climate, it'll be some time before Jag turns a profit so offloading them was probably the right thing to do. Can't help feeling Tata are going to make a killing from them though.

Incorrect.   Reliability with Jaguar never improved, XK8's were plagued with electrical issues.  The X types have been plagued with shoddy interior fit and finsih, electrical issues and literally being a rebadged Mondeo.  Jaguar never turned a profit from when they were purchased by Ford from 1989 until they sold it.  Aston Martin and Land Rover never turned profits.   That is why they dumped the "Premier Auto Group" in California, PAG HQ's.   

[CAP1]

Incorrect.   Reliability with Jaguar never improved, XK8's were plagued with electrical issues.  The X types have been plagued with shoddy interior fit and finsih, electrical issues and literally being a rebadged Mondeo.  Jaguar never turned a profit from when they were purchased by Ford from 1989 until they sold it.  Aston Martin and Land Rover never turned profits.   That is why they dumped the "Premier Auto Group" in California, PAG HQ's.   

jag's also had a LOT of suspension issues.

[68Wooley]

Incorrect.   Reliability with Jaguar never improved, XK8's were plagued with electrical issues.  The X types have been plagued with shoddy interior fit and finsih, electrical issues and literally being a rebadged Mondeo.  Jaguar never turned a profit from when they were purchased by Ford from 1989 until they sold it.  Aston Martin and Land Rover never turned profits.   That is why they dumped the "Premier Auto Group" in California, PAG HQ's.   

Results from both sides of the pond

http://www.whatcar.com/car-news/jd-power-customer-satisfaction-poll-08/executive-cars/232612
http://www.autoblog.com/2009/03/19/jaguar-and-buick-upset-lexus-in-j-d-power-2009-vehicle-dependab/
http://www.whatcar.com/NonCar/7588125111.jpg

I'll grant you the X-Type was a poor effort, but other than that, the cars were good. However, until this latest generation of vehicles, they were mired with stupid retro look that alienated the under 50's that were buying Mercs, BMW and Lexus in droves.

Almost every report I can find says Land Rover and Aston were profitable when sold - by as much as $1.2 billion in Land Rover's case according to some reports.

http://www.leftlanenews.com/report-jaguar-and-land-rover-now-profitable.html

If you've information to the contrary, post it.

PAG overall was never profitable, but that was mainly because of Jaguar. Hence I stand by my statement that Aston was sold to raise cash for Ford's restructuring whilst Land Rover was used to sweeten the deal for whoever would take Jaguar off their hands.

[Masherbrum]

The Designs of Aston Martin going in were excellent.   However, the head of the design team for Jaguar was appointed to Head of Design for Aston Martin, drawing criticism of "stale designs seen before on Jaguars".   

Volvo and Lincoln were the only "profiteers" from PAG.   

[68Wooley]

The Designs of Aston Martin going in were excellent.   However, the head of the design team for Jaguar was appointed to Head of Design for Aston Martin, drawing criticism of "stale designs seen before on Jaguars".   

Volvo and Lincoln were the only "profiteers" from PAG.   

If you are referring to Iain Callum, you've got it the wrong way around - he actually moved to Jaguar after designing the Aston DB7 and Vanquish (he was actually a contractor and never directly employed by Aston). His first design for Jaguar was the XK, which was criticized by some for looking too much like an Aston DB9. To quote Jeremy Clarkson, "that's like criticizing a man for looking too much like Brad Pitt".

Again, if you've got any links to show either Land Rover or Aston weren't profitable at the time of their sales post them. The only info I can find says they were.

[RipChord929]

Well, I guess the Ford vs Chevy duel is finally over! Chevy DNF's,
FORD wins!       I'm a Chevy guy too!

This whole GM bankruptcy deal, is one of the biggest ripoffs in history!
I'll never buy another GM product, because I won't support this corrupt
govt takover, and theft from the real investors!!!

RC

[68Wooley]

Again, if you've got any links to show either Land Rover or Aston weren't profitable at the time of their sales post them. The only info I can find says they were.

I will give you this - over the lifetime of Ford's ownership, Land Rover cost them money. Any profits they saw in the last years of their ownership would not have made up for the investment they made.

On the other hand, what they did with Aston was remarkable - turning a 600 a year car company that had never once in 75 years turned a profit to a 7000 a year car company with a balance sheet in the black.

We've probably hijacked this thread enough now so I'll shut up.