Author Topic: Too Close for Comfort! Near Collision Over My House!!!  (Read 402 times)

Offline flight17

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1612
Too Close for Comfort! Near Collision Over My House!!!
« on: October 22, 2009, 06:32:04 PM »
Well my heart is still pounding from it.. but a C-130 and a piper warrior or possibly an arrow just nearly collided over my house.

I was working outside and heard a loud jet over head and looked up and saw a C-17 flying north over my house from the south and went inside and asked my mom if obama was in town because Pit doesn get C-17's that often and thats the airlifter used when he goes somewhere... she said that she didnt hear of him coming or being here already...

Then 20secs later i heard another heavy plane coming and so i walked back outside. i also heard a small plane approaching from the southwest. then the C-130 came into veiw and it was heading northwest from the southeast. Mean while i heard the piper (what it turned out to be) getting louder and i knew it was going to be close so i started looking for it. the piper came into view and then i was like, damn i wish i had my camera... but then my heart dropped when i saw them coming for each other. the piper decended before they met and flew under it. it was EXTREMELY close. There was absolutely no horizontal seperation and they passed vertically under 1000ft. the 130 had to have been just over 3000ft and the piper about 2250-2500ft. (thats the normal altitude most GA fly over my house when approaching KBVI.) though if they had collided they would have been in the perfect location. Our firehall is just .5mile away from my house and then two more are within 4miles. if they had collided the piper would have crashed on my property or my neighbors.

I checked flight aware and didnt see anything.

but now i want to know what was both the C-17 and C-130 was doing here? anyone know if there was any training exercises around the Pit area? i mean Pit is half airforce, but we never see 130's or 17's so close to the airport.
119th Riffle Tank Regiment leader -Red Storm Krupp Steel Scenario

Active Member of Air Heritage Inc. http://airheritage.org/

Offline EskimoJoe

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 4831
Re: Too Close for Comfort! Near Collision Over My House!!!
« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2009, 06:36:40 PM »
Daang, I have no information but I'm just glad they didn't make contact!
Put a +1 on your geekness atribute  :aok

Offline jododger

  • Copper Member
  • **
  • Posts: 210
Re: Too Close for Comfort! Near Collision Over My House!!!
« Reply #2 on: October 22, 2009, 10:14:34 PM »
You should be be careful using words like "Near Collision" on something that sounds like standard separation.
Dodger
It's about the fight.

Offline Strip

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3319
Re: Too Close for Comfort! Near Collision Over My House!!!
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2009, 10:21:19 PM »
I believe at altitude 1k vertical separation is all that's required....

Other wise five miles for passenger airliners at same alt I believe?

Offline flight17

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1612
Re: Too Close for Comfort! Near Collision Over My House!!!
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2009, 10:37:31 PM »
You should be be careful using words like "Near Collision" on something that sounds like standard separation.
nope its not normal seperation. normal seperation is 1000ft vertically and 3000ft horizontally (i believe) below fl290, above that they increase and horizontal is measured a little different. horizontal is either 3 or 5miles depending on where the planes are and how they are flying.

ive studied aviation for years amaturely... i can tell the difference of being close and being a near miss... it was deffinately a near miss.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2009, 10:52:30 PM by flight17 »
119th Riffle Tank Regiment leader -Red Storm Krupp Steel Scenario

Active Member of Air Heritage Inc. http://airheritage.org/

Offline Golfer

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6314
Re: Too Close for Comfort! Near Collision Over My House!!!
« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2009, 10:46:05 PM »
Depending on where you live around PIT there very likely was no loss of separation.  If either the Piper or the Herc was VFR and the other IFR you can have as little as 500' vertical separation between the two while being perfectly legal.  Happens all the time when we're stuck repositioning up/down the east coast down low.  8000-9000' and 250kts without TCAS between NY and Philadelphia is a place I'd rather not be.

Study up on RVSM because 2000' separation between FL290 and FL410 went away several years ago over the CONUS.  It's now 1000' provided your airplane and operation is approved for RVSM or Reduced Vertical Separation Minimums.  Above 41 due to the air density and error in altitude measuring devices they continue using 2000' separation all the way up to FL600 above which you're on your own.  Not that it matters much because I don't fly a U2 and despite my airplane being certified to 51,000 I've only been to 49 in it.

Doesn't sound like much of an event today in all reality.

Offline Cougar68

  • Nickel Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 600
Re: Too Close for Comfort! Near Collision Over My House!!!
« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2009, 10:54:37 PM »
While I have no doubt it looked very close from your end, I truly doubt that it was.  Vertical separation is extremely difficult to gauge from the ground and it gets even more difficult when the aircraft are so dissimilar in size. 

Offline jododger

  • Copper Member
  • **
  • Posts: 210
Re: Too Close for Comfort! Near Collision Over My House!!!
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2009, 01:51:38 AM »
nope its not normal seperation. normal seperation is 1000ft vertically and 3000ft horizontally (i believe) below fl290, above that they increase and horizontal is measured a little different. horizontal is either 3 or 5miles depending on where the planes are and how they are flying.

ive studied aviation for years amaturely... i can tell the difference of being close and being a near miss... it was deffinately a near miss.
here is PIT Class B procedures http://www.zobartcc.org/include/viewfile.php?action=view&ID=25 which encompasses BVI.
IFR-IFR 1000ft vertical
IFR-VFR 500ft vertical

I received my private pilot licence at BVI and have worked in BVI tower,  also I have been in air traffic for 20 years.

This happends every day all day.


Dodger
It's about the fight.