Tis a sad day :(

[-tronski-]

Originally posted by Blue Mako:


Okay, going off topic here but:  How do you figure that furballs are the "only realistic, manly and SA taxing combat in the game"?

How many battles do you know of in WW2 (or any war for that matter) where both sides just kept throwing planes into a big furball for hours on end, pilots upping from fields 5 miles from the fight and flying straight into combat without gaining alt etc?  IMO furballing is a result of the no-consquences-to-death game environment.  If it were RL, I doubt any pilots would be so eager to entering furballs as they are here, with no teamwork and no heed to personal safety.

Also, furballing is the only way to measure how macho you are?    It's a game for goodness sake, how does a computer game measure how macho you are????

Well said Blue,
I for one don't really care about the Ta152 cause I've never actually needed to up one. As previously posted it doesn't have a clear advantage over other types to reward the perkie cost.
I do however think the Ar234 perk cost should be significantly reduced to reflect it's overall usefullness in the 1.08 enviroment. I disagree with the 262 being a major counter to the Blitz, unless you run into a patrolling con at alt. A well executed attack even at alts of 10-15k can gain the Blitz some immunity from cons.

 Tronsky

[Apar]

Also, furballing is the only way to measure how macho you are?  It's a game for goodness sake, how does a computer game measure how macho you are???? Besides, wading in like Rambo and spinning around in tight circles until you die doesn't strike me as a sign of how manly anyone is, just makes me think they should be playing Quake instead.

And finally, as far as testing your SA is concerned, there is a sig someone has here on the board with a quote that goes along the lines of: "A superior pilot uses superior judgement to avoid situations where he has to use his superior skill" I agree with that. I think it is a better test of your SA to avoid getting tangled up in a furball. I think it takes more SA to always keep an escape route open and to enter and leave the furball when you desire, not wade in and dodge bullets until the 15 guys on your six nail you. That just means you were lacking the judgement to keep you alive.

Right on Mako,  

[lazs1]

mako... the actual melee or 'furball' is the only realistic combat I have seen in any flight sim.   While you are in it.   Certainly...it is more realistic than lone wolf B&Z against low alt fighters LOL.   No... the melee time frame is compressed... It is being "fed" but, that is a function of the time compression that is inherent in combat flight sims.   I don't think you would like to fly for weeks and then find one 5 minute furball.   And yes... it is the only manly way to fly.  the sissy little girl kick and run from outside the fight is effeminate.

Of course... I belive that there should be a place that the "timid" can fly... just not with the rest of us.   I don't care how good they are at it or how poor they are at dogfighting... they need to fight others of their ilk in a late war "area" of the arena.

Oh... This is a game and in a war where your life was at stake it would be best to be prudent and to take every advantage but... even in a war... if everyone else was down there mixing it up and you had the latest uber ride and were doing very little to help except saving your hide.... Watching fellow pilots die..you might soon get labled a coward.  
lazs

[ 11-14-2001: Message edited by: lazs1 ]

[Blue Mako]

Originally posted by lazs1:
the sissy little girl kick and run from outside the fight is effeminate.

I think the word you are looking for is "smart", not "effeminate".  

 

Of course... I belive that there should be a place that the "timid" can fly... just not with the rest of us.   I don't care how good they are at it or how poor they are at dogfighting... they need to fight others of their ilk in a late war "area" of the arena.

I think the basis of this comment is that you don't like the fact that people who have carefully conserved there fuel/ammo/E-state or whatever can come by and pick you off because you have been mixing it up with no thought to getting back to your base alive.  When that happens, you prefer to blame it on their supposed "cowardice" rather than your own lack of forethought.

 

if everyone else was down there mixing it up and you had the latest uber ride and were doing very little to help except saving your hide.... Watching fellow pilots die..you might soon get labled a coward.

And if everybody just rushed into a hopeless situation just to save some idiot who has not had enough judgement to choose a winnable fight then you would soon be labeled an idiot... but not for long because they would soon be dead.  

Seriously though, I fly to try and land my kills.  I don't run from a fight, nor do my squadmates.  We also don't hang around the edge of furballs, waiting for helpless victims.  We get in there and mix it up, we also choose when to bug out, as opposed to staying in a furball until we are dead...  Keeping your aircraft in a state to be able to do so is much more difficult than just chasing tails in a never ending, never get anywhere furball.

We do try to choose our fights, to give ourselves the greatest advantage.  Anyone who does any differently isn't macho, smart or a better player, they're just stupid.

Who wants a fair fight?  The loser, that's who.

[lazs1]

Originally posted by lazs1:
the sissy little girl kick and run from outside the fight is effeminate.

"I think the word you are looking for is "smart", not "effeminate". <http://www.hitechcreations.com/cgi-bin/rolleyes.gif>

Well...Yeah, i guess we would all admit that women fight "smart" compared to men but.... I've never liked fighting women allthat much.

quote: Of course... I belive that there should be a place that the "timid" can fly... just not with the rest of us. I don't care how good they are at it or how poor they are at dogfighting... they need to fight others of their ilk in a late war "area" of the arena.

"I think the basis of this comment is that you don't like the fact that people who have carefully conserved there fuel/ammo/E-state or whatever can come by and pick you off because you have been mixing it up with no thought to getting back to your base alive. When that happens, you prefer to blame it on their supposed "cowardice" rather than your own lack of forethought."

No... I think what you don't understand is that conseving "e" is not simply the pervue of B&Z... All players try to attain a higher e state.  I personally don't have much trouble avoiding the timid girly men but they are annoying.   Which brings us full circle eh?   If you fly a plane that starts out with a huge "bank" of e... One that is impossible to get into trouble with against slower planes.... you are well... "timid"  That's fine but... U need to have your own "area" of the arena filled with like minded sissies so that you can while away the hours hiding from each other.   To ask for a plane as fast as the 152to be even more comon against the likes of Hellcats is pretty lame.   I would like to seel la7, P51's and d9's 152's all, in a seperate "area".   You could still fly em just not against lesser planes unless it was the lesser planes choice... not yours.

will skip this quote for lack of content and go on to the next .

"Seriously though, I fly to try and land my kills. I don't run from a fight, nor do my squadmates. We also don't hang around the edge of furballs, waiting for helpless victims. We get in there and mix it up, we also choose when to bug out, as opposed to staying in a furball until we are dead... Keeping your aircraft in a state to be able to do so is much more difficult than just chasing tails in a never ending, never get anywhere furball.

We do try to choose our fights, to give ourselves the greatest advantage. Anyone who does any differently isn't macho, smart or a better player, they're just stupid."

Actually... we don't fly all that differently.  I try to pick a fight with at least a good chance of survival but...  I like one that strains my SA..  one with a lot of things going on and that means.... I got to get into the thick of a melee.   I die a lot but I have fun and if I wanted organizaton, planning and hard work... I woulda worked overtime and made some money.

"Who wants a fair fight? The loser, that's who.
null"

Perhaps... but.  I think that a close fight, hard won is allways preferable to sneaking up and killing someone who doesn't even know your there.   sure... it's fun to watch toejam blow up but it's not much of a victory.   I love flying a plane like the hog into a furball and  coming out against spits lags and niks.   I do Ok against those planes.... I wouldn't if i didn't have so much practice.   I don't mind if my SA finally gets ovewhelmed and some newbie blasts my out of e hog out of the sky... I bet he get's something out of it... more than being B&Zed to death by an untouchable and cowardly uber ride.
lazs