Author Topic: Understanding Norway - English language article  (Read 332 times)

Offline beet1e

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 7848
Understanding Norway - English language article
« on: May 16, 2004, 01:55:28 PM »
We have quite a few Norwegians in our community, and it is clear within the $2.61 gas thread that their economic and social ideal is very different from that of America. Norway may be a high tax economy, but a strong welfare state. Norway also has abundant supplies of oil and gas, NO national debt, and their currency - the krone - is one of the world's strongest.

Norway has steadfastly refused to join the EU. And to that I say - I don't think they could improve their lot by joining.

Perhaps another reason that Norway is economically sound is a low crime rate (?). I have never been there, but I suspect there are no real social problems of unemployment, drug abuse (and the crime that goes with it) and no ghetto culture. So police/crime/insurance costs are probably much lower than here.

So before knocking Norway for high taxes etc, here is an interesting article I read about Norway.

Source: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=%2Fnews%2F2004%2F05%2F10%2Fwnorw10.xml

Offline Toad

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18415
Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2004, 02:08:30 PM »
I guess the next thing is Strk in here pointing out that the Norwegians are just a bunch of Republicans.

"Up the ladder, mates; I'm aboard".

:rofl
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline straffo

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 10029
Re: Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2004, 02:35:29 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by beet1e
Norway has steadfastly refused to join the EU. And to that I say - I don't think they could improve their lot by joining.


Let express it another way : we have our fat arse sit on tons and tons of gaz and oil. We won't ever share a single liter with EU till we have some left. We are fat and we don't give a sh.


This post is dedicaced to AirGuard.

With love

Straffo (a true Volvo moment Guardy :p)

Offline Nilsen

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18108
Re: Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2004, 02:44:23 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by beet1e
We have quite a few Norwegians in our community, and it is clear within the $2.61 gas thread that their economic and social ideal is very different from that of America. Norway may be a high tax economy, but a strong welfare state. Norway also has abundant supplies of oil and gas, NO national debt, and their currency - the krone - is one of the world's strongest.

Norway has steadfastly refused to join the EU. And to that I say - I don't think they could improve their lot by joining.

Perhaps another reason that Norway is economically sound is a low crime rate (?). I have never been there, but I suspect there are no real social problems of unemployment, drug abuse (and the crime that goes with it) and no ghetto culture. So police/crime/insurance costs are probably much lower than here.

So before knocking Norway for high taxes etc, here is an interesting article I read about Norway.

Source: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=%2Fnews%2F2004%2F05%2F10%2Fwnorw10.xml


thx beet1e (unless this was meant as a troll or sarcastic :D(just covering my arse) )

i would just like to point out that we do have drug abuse and some crime (police are unarmed tho) we have some localised alcohol problems tho, as the picture of me below illustrates :D


Offline Tarmac

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3988
Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2004, 02:44:28 PM »
Interesting article.  Regarding the "socialist" debate in the other thread,  I think there are some big differences between Norwegian and American socialism, resulting from big differences in the societies.  For that reason, many Americans immediately shun the idea of Norwegian (or European, for that matter) socialism.  

(obligatory wall of text warning)

The major difference?  The unproductive class, or at least a perception of it.  Unproductive, underproductive, or whatever PC term you want to call it.  The only products that many American people "produce" are children that are poorly raised, crime-prone, and otherwise poorly equipped to become productive members of society.  You could write a whole book on what causes this class division, but for the sake of the socialist argument it's sufficient to say that the division (or the public perception of it) exists.  

And of course, the productive class abhors the idea of supporting the unproductive class -- who have never been, and most likely will never become, members of the productive class.  Welfare programs in this country are a tragic joke designed to sustain the unproductive class -- not elevate it -- and those paying for the programs often recognize this.  Why do these programs persist, then?  

They're a vote-buying tool for politicians.  The more money we give to politicians (in taxes), the more power they have over us.  They can regulate our lives, control who gets home loans, who gets unemployment, retirement, and medical benefits, who pays how much for gasoline, which businesses move jobs and to which states, and myriad other things that have far-reaching consequences.  And all of these are, of course, pitted against each other as dangled carrots to buy votes.  

As beetle stated, and the impression that I've gained from reading about Norway on this BB, there is a comparatively small unproductive class in Norway.  Americans would be far more receptive to ideas like socialized medicine if they didn't think that the majority of it would go to unproductive drug users, wife-beaters, and lazy fatasses.  I think many welfare states (european) have the advantage of the perception that every person in their society puts in an honest day's work, even if it doesn't pay as well (or maybe doesn't pay anything beyond subsistence) as theirs does.  People don't mind helping out an underdog who is struggling to stay above water despite all his hard work, but when he says "give me your raft, I don't feel like swimming" he can piss off and drown.  

All the above is, of course, just my perception of things.  

A big for staying out of the EU, though.  The solution to most problems is less government, not more.

Offline Nilsen

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18108
Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2004, 03:08:48 PM »
I agree... from the posts i have read here, socialism means something completly different for us compared to what it means to Americans. I guess there are several different degrees of socoalism, and how it works in different parts of the world. :)

Offline Steve

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6728
Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2004, 03:20:35 PM »
Strong currency, no national debt... sounds like positive economic signs. WTG  Norway. :)

I wish I knew the difference between what we (Americans) and Norway sees as socialism.  Is it possible that Norway has less immigration and therefore has less people on the dole than the U.S. would if it was a strong welfare state?  This is in no way criticism or excuse making... merely speculating... wondering.


Nils, in that picture you are still holding your beer upright.. so you're doin ok.  :aok
Member: Hot Soup Mafia - Cream of Myshroom
Army of Muppets  Yes, my ingame name is Steve

Offline Nilsen

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18108
Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2004, 03:26:47 PM »
yeah steve...but notice the wetness on my right leg :D

Offline Toad

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18415
Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2004, 03:32:05 PM »
It's an extremely homogeneous population. That helps too.

Norway - a multi-ethnic country

Quote
Nevertheless, it is only in the last ten years that the issue of ethnic minorities has appeared on the agenda in the Norwegian community. This is due to a number of factors, among them the growth of the Sami movement. But the most important is the immigration from non-European countries. Up to the late 1960s, there were virtually no immigrants in Norway from countries outside Europe. This year there are more than 100,000 immigrants and they constitute two and a half per cent of the population. In comparison with other countries like Sweden and Great Britain Norway has few immigrants, but immigration and the new, multi-ethnic nature of the community have nevertheless a central place in popular debate.

« Last Edit: May 16, 2004, 03:38:35 PM by Toad »
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Nilsen

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18108
Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2004, 03:41:58 PM »
cc Toad. Norway has had a very strict policy on who can, and cant get in. This is mostly because the goverment wants to be able to give those that can get in a job and integration into our society, so they dont "ghetto up" and become criminals. (thats the theory). Wether or not this has worked is another matter.

Offline Toad

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18415
Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #10 on: May 16, 2004, 03:42:55 PM »
Imagine the US trying that!  ;)
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Nilsen

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18108
Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2004, 03:50:11 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Toad
Imagine the US trying that!  ;)


Hehe, i guess your population would be the size of norway....or less :D

Offline bozon

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6037
Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2004, 04:37:56 PM »
one of the biggest oil supplyer of the world, norway is what the persian gulf could have been without the sand and the camels.

Not only they don't have a national debt, but last I heard they had the opposite of deficit  - anyone know the word for that??
So they spend all their excess money on outrageously expensive 3.5% alcohol bevrages, as nilsen's picture clearly show.

If I remember correctly, they had a prime minister who resigned due to suffering from depression. Thats what happens when you get an office and nothing to do.

Even the sun doesn't always bother to set there, or doesn't bother to rise.

but I could be confusing it with Fraz-Josef Land.

Bozon
Mosquito VI - twice the spitfire, four times the ENY.

Click!>> "So, you want to fly the wooden wonder" - <<click!
the almost incomplete and not entirely inaccurate guide to the AH Mosquito.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGOWswdzGQs

Offline Nilsen

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18108
Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2004, 04:41:51 PM »
it doesnt bother to set in the summer, and rise in the winter (for a few months up north) :D ..been there, seen that....its very strange indeed. you have to experience it to really understand it.

yes, one of our pm's did resign becuase he was sad for a short period. He could never get his tie to mach one of hi shirts i think it was... or something like that.

storch

  • Guest
Re: Re: Understanding Norway - English language article
« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2004, 08:25:02 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Nilsen
[Bi would just like to point out that we do have drug abuse and some crime (police are unarmed tho) we have some localised alcohol problems tho, as the picture of me below illustrates :D[/B]


ROFLMFAO,  Dude, I will ignore your politics but revel in your humor.  that was funny.