Late Night US Time Training

[funked]

Hi ya, I'm an Instructor and I fly real late at night, after midnight US time.  You can email me for an appointment, or if you see me in the arena just holler if you want to train.



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Mike "FunkedUp" Waltz
Aces High Instructor Corps

Squadron Leader, 308 (Polish) Squadron "City of Cracow" RAF

[Elp]

A question Funked: flying the Spit9, I could use Spiral Climb as effetive maneuver, while attacking, I can build altitude advantage, while in defense, making the opponent to overshoot me. When I fly the 109g6 or g10, Spiral Climb looks like the best way to be shoot down because everyone could follow the 109 during the spiral. So, is the 109g6/g10 ( whitout gondolas ) very heavy to use the spiral or there is a particular way to make this maneuver whit 109g6/g10?

Do you remember "Battle of Brittain" ( the movie ), my english is so good as that Polish
Squadron.

[Kieren]

I'm not Funked, but let me try...

The 109's spiral climb very well, especially without the heavy gondolas. The trick is to correctly assess the energy state of your opponent. If the enemy has lots of energy you may not want to immediately go for the climb. The idea is to get the other guy slowed down, then use the spiral climb (exploiting the 109's superior climb), to climb over their head.

A G10 will outclimb a Spit IX, but not by much. This makes a spiral climb (against the spit IX) kinda risky. Know too that the margin you will gain may be very slim, so you have to be extremely careful. It can be done, but you will need to be sharp to gain/exploit it.

[humble]

I certainly will defer to kieren with regard to 109 FM matters so he may want to correct me if I'm wrong here.

The 109 G10 will outclimb the spit at all altitudes (and out accelerate it as well I believe)...however...the 109 is a trickier plane to fly with regard to trim etc. I'd recommend a rope vs a spiral climb vs a spit...stay level till 380 or so and then climb to maintain seperation (without wep if possible)once you get some vertical seperation 750 (2000 or so horizontal) or so I hit wep and pull a little G's...you gain some alt but lose some E ..lot of spit drivers will lag low and try and zoom you here. Level out for a bit to gain E back and start a gentle climbing left hander (never turn 109 to right) to gain vis on con, then pull into a true spiral climb as closure rate stops...you can always roll on over and dive if you miss judged E or continue up if you've got him.

I've found that if I go directly from def manv. (scissors for ex) to spiral climb a good spit driver will hang the prop on me if I get to aggresive on move.

[Kieren]

Well, I am not an expert, just relay what I have found works for me. I'd be interested in Hristo's opinion here.  

BTW, I think you better expressed an aspect of the FM I alluded to (that is, you have to be careful with Spits in this maneuver). The Spit may not climb better than the G10, but it is more stable and can hang on the prop easier. You're a big fat target if you don't get enough separation here!

[wells]

The spit can hang on it's prop in about a 45 degree angle, so you'd better be right over his head if you're spiral climbing or you could get nailed by a nice snap shot.  The 109 only has a 200 fpm climb advantage over a Spit IX at lower speeds (175 mph), but at high speeds (275 mph) it has an 800 fpm climb advantage!  It'd be better to use the higher speed and do a real big lazy spiral climb to keep the spit in the vicinity while you climb above him quicker.

[funked]

Thanks guys, I don't use the spiral climb considering the plasma rifles they've mounted on our planes.  Any ACM that involves being in front of the bandit for long periods of time is too risky in my book.

[Elp]

Thank you all  
I do like this kind of discussion! The minimum speeds that you recommend to fly the 109g6/g10 is very useful: never fly below 300 mph, trim to stay at this speed or more. Even in a spiral climb, go into it at 300mph. Make or a flat spiral climb or a zoom spiral whit tons of E, never a "pure spiral climb" like in Spit-9. Yes!

[Jekyll]

Wells hit it on the head.  Trying to spiral climb a 109 against a spit at 150 kias is tantamount to suicide.

But spiral climbing him at 250 kias is another matter entirely.  He'll be tempted to stay fast so you can't get too much horizontal separation, but at the higher airspeed the 109 will have a marked climb rate advantage.

It takes far more patience to gain the advantage in a high speed climb, but it will leave the spit with no option other than to try to disengage... then you can reverse on him with impunity.

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C.O. Phoenix Squadron
www.users.bigpond.com/afinlayson/index.htm
'feel the heat .......'

[funked]

Did I mention I was a Spit Dweeb® ?



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Mike "FunkedUp" Waltz
Aces High Instructor Corps

Squadron Leader, 308 (Polish) Squadron "City of Cracow" RAF

[Ripsnort]

Did some tests with a student last  night in TA, he was in Spit5, me in 109F, had student D800 behind me and had  him follow my  manuevers, dove to 435 IAS, then pulled up into a vertical zoom, ending with a hammarhead (throttle  chopped at 100IAS to  help nose is over), he stayed on me and actually gained ground to D400 at the top of the hammar head...don't know what  this means, (other than the spit does  have superior acceleration of  any plane in AH) but this  is what  it means  to me, I have an 11 to 1 K/D ratio in spit.. I stay away from spits when  I fly 109F  

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Ripsnort(-rip1-)
++JG2++ ~Richthofen~ XO
Aces High Training Corps
JG2 "Richthofen"

"Some people are only alive because it is illegal to shoot them."

[humble]

The only way I think you'll get a good spit driver with a 109 is using his greed/feeling of invincibility against him. If you use your total potential E agaisnt him you can get him in deep. I don't have the #'s like wells but his #'s and my observations tally. At higher speed the 109 will easily rope the spit and you can suck the E out of him with a spiral climb after your truely positive E.

[Kieren]

I most humbly defer to those more experienced than myself. Again, the Spit is the main fly in the ointment for the 109 pilot.  

[bloom25]

IMO the spit IX is the most dangerous plane if flown well in the game.  It can turn better than all but the spit V, can out-accelerate nearly all the planes, and is very stable as a BnZ platform if you choose to fly that way.  The only major advantage most planes have against it is top speed, and unless you have E to make up for inferior acceleration, that won't even help you.  (Not only that, but the spit seems to have an amazing ho ability, and paired with it's turning ability, can almost always force a ho.)

When I meet spits in the f4u I always try to get them to try to climb to me, then I will zoom climb away from them.  All that's left to do is zoom back down on them and use the only real advantage the f4 has, roll rate.  In a dive, the f4u can dive to a faster speed and match any turns the spit tries to make.  The spit's only real weakness is its roll rate, and in some situations you can use it to your advantage.

Unfortunately I don't really know the best method for fighting spits in a 109.  I haven't had much success, other than just keeping an altitude advantage and waiting until they expose their 6 to you.  I'm sure Hristo or Hblair can tell you how to do it though.

bloom25
THUNDERBIRDS