Author Topic: Avoiding HO's...advice (Read 1078 times)

batdog · « **on:** June 28, 2001, 10:39:00 AM »

Okies...I uselly avoid them like the clap BUT everynow and then it seems like you encounter the one that wants to HO real bad like.Whats a good tactic to avoid/and or turn to my advantage. Oh...I fly the 38 mostly so take into account my huge profile.

xBAT

Drano · « **Reply #1 on:** June 28, 2001, 11:23:00 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by batdog:
Okies...I uselly avoid them like the clap BUT everynow and then it seems like you encounter the one that wants to HO real bad like.Whats a good tactic to avoid/and or turn to my advantage. Oh...I fly the 38 mostly so take into account my huge profile.

xBAT

I haven't had too much trouble with HO's since making the switch from AW where they were essentially turned off. I just came to the conclusion that to get HO'd it takes 2 to tango. If you give the other guy that shot more often than not he's gonna take it in here. So I just don't. Just a matter of un-learning AW tactics. Sounds easy I know, but what I try to do is to pass under the NME's nose figuring gunnery is hard enough here and what he can't see he prolly aint' gonna hit. If I can't get myself oriented the way I want I'll make sure I do some kinda jink or roll as I pass. Again--to throw off his gunnery. Seems to work most of the time for me. It gets hard when you're in a furball and the third guy coming by shoots your face. Only so much jinkin a guy can do! But that's how this game works. Just gotta be lookin for it.

Personally I like it when the bad guy shoots at my nose. When they do that its like givin me a free angles advantage. I like free stuff.

Good luck,

Drano

Naudet · « **Reply #2 on:** June 28, 2001, 12:15:00 PM »

most times it seems enough to point the nose below the nme, than at around 1-1.4K u do a left or right roll and thats normally enough.

Also most often ever turn, loop or anything else i enough to avoid the HO when u start ur turn/loop with speed and with ur nose pointing below him.

flakbait · « **Reply #3 on:** June 28, 2001, 04:05:00 PM »

Avoiding HO's? That's easy in ANY plane.

Diving in: if he raises his nose up to fire, just swing it around in a half-assed Split-S and you'll avoid his fire. Plus he'll over-shoot. Or you can do a diving spiral and level off still going in your original direction, only at a lower altitude.

Stuck low: if he dives in for the HO, roll it left or right and pull it off to one side. But not too far or he can come around to nail you. You can also dive slightly and punch WEP; he'll over-shoot but you'll have some extra speed.

Level: nose-to-nose with anyone is kinda dumb, but it happens to every body. Depress the nose when he's at 1.6k in a zero-gee extention until your nose is down at around a 15º angle. He'll have to shove the stick forward to nail the HO, so instead most just over-shoot. You've got a bit more speed (simple rule: nose under horizon = WEP on) so you can swing around in a turn or vertical.

All this, plus some other stunts I can't think of right now, work in ANY aircraft. Especially my Yak. Use vertical maneuvers to dodge if your aircraft can't roll (Bf-109 @ 350mph+). Use roll if you're low on speed or the elevator response stinks. Either way, you can get out of the way with minimal trouble.

-----------------------
Flakbait [Delta6]
Delta Six's Flight School
Put the P-61B in Aces High
"During the Battle of Britain the question 'fighter or fighter-bomber?'
had been decided once and for all: The fighter can only be used as a bomb carrier
with lasting effect when sufficient air superiority has been won." Adolph Galland

Sancho · « **Reply #4 on:** June 28, 2001, 09:57:00 PM »

A wide barrel roll can be very hard to track and usually foils most HOs for me.

batdog · « **Reply #5 on:** June 28, 2001, 10:00:00 PM »

Thanks guys.. tried alot of these tips tonight...all worked well. I guess it comes down to the fact that I've been flying abit stupid... lol. Anyway appreciate the help.

xBAT

Lephturn · « **Reply #6 on:** June 29, 2001, 09:06:00 AM »

The number one way to avoid the HO is not to shoot back.

Have a read of this article I wrote: http://users.andara.com/~sconrad/hodefense.htm

Almost every time I die in an HO, I find I was shooting back, or at least trying to. If you make even the most basic attempt to avoid the HO, you normally not only avoid being shot, but also turn the situation to your advantage.

Oh, and if you find yourself avoiding but STILL being hit, make sure you are starting your avoiding nice and early. Like D 1.5 in a head-to-head high closure situation.

johnross11 · « **Reply #7 on:** June 29, 2001, 08:47:00 PM »

What's an HO?

Sancho · « **Reply #8 on:** June 29, 2001, 09:11:00 PM »

HO = Head On attack

When you see another plane flying straight at you guns blazing, that's an "HO".

humble · « **Reply #9 on:** July 03, 2001, 03:45:00 PM »

have to add my 2 cents...

1) any con focused on a HO is giving up ACM options...leph's advice is outstanding...don't ever shoot back.

2) How can you maximize the penalty he pays...I'll almost always go for the "under" position. This allows me to drive up thru the con.

3) horizontal displacement is most often overlooked...if you force the bogie to go down and turn into you..his shot is much harder...also he'll tend to burn more E and the chances of him losing you in his views increases.

I've always felt that the FM here rewards gains in angle over savings in Energy ever since 1.4 came out. 90% of the time a bogie that focuses on the HO never recovers an offensive opportunity...sometimes you can't even run afterward...stories of tiffies, jugs and nikki's running cons down are often on BBS...I'd bet most are victims of vertical/oblique lead turns into a HO focused con

Drex · « **Reply #10 on:** July 06, 2001, 06:03:00 PM »

batdog let me throw a bit of ACM philosophy at you.

Instead of thinking of a HO as something to avoid. Think of it in the terms of gaining position. Visualize what you would do to get on his 6. Work different approaches on this and come write them down here. Let us give you some different insights. You will get a lot more out of it then someone telling you what cookie cutter move to perform. It's never that easy.

food for thought:

The shooter in a HO situation has a 1-2 second reaction time loss. This is a huge advantage, and is the main reason I do not fire back in a HO. Unless your at 400 ft with 12 bad guys swarming around then you eat the lead with the hammer down.

Drex

Drex · « **Reply #11 on:** July 06, 2001, 06:06:00 PM »

well I had this written at noon but didn't get to send it until now. Pass my post off as being an echo.

Drex

raven 8 · « **Reply #12 on:** July 08, 2001, 08:33:00 AM »

in dunno, just dont fly into the guy? i mean i havent played in main arena for a long time (1 year). in h2h there arnt many people and u always see them comming miles away so plan ur flight path according to that

what i do sometimes is get alittle alt over the guy, and dive into him at 45 deg when ur approaching him. if he tries to turn up on you, he'll miss and u'll get him.......if h turn or do a split s, u have the advantage on him.

well thats what i do and it worked when i was doing it. might seem like a dumb idea to u pros:-)

rav