Author Topic: Lazs will like this - even though it's a wall-o-text (Read 1582 times)

StarOfAfrica2 · « **Reply #15 on:** December 07, 2004, 01:18:57 PM »

Best 1-2 punch for home defense I could find. 12 ga. Mossberg "riot" gun loaded with 0-0 Buckshot, and a .357 magnum with a 2" barrel, loaded with .38 Glasers. Both will drop an attacker in his tracks and make a huge mess of his internals, neither will overpenetrate and hurt the neighbors or the wife.

I have to agree with Lazs on the tazers. The very fact that it's non-lethal makes people think it's ok to use it even if they arent sure about the target. They dont think twice, where they would with a gun. And because they tend not to think of Tazers as a "weapon", people may get lax in making sure they are ready for use at all times. Another reason is that, if you buy a gun (if you have any sense anyway), you make sure you are intimately familiar with it and how to use it, and do so safely. Because the tazers are non-lethal, people may not take the time to become familiar with what they can and cannot do, and/or how to properly use it. Or at least are unfamiliar enough with it that they cant use it fast enough.

And as Krusher said, even a stun gun can be lethal, if the person has a heart problem or some other condition that makes them more vulnerable than the average person. I'm afraid the UK isnt alone in its fanatic liability lawsuit practicioners. If I'm going to be put on trial for killing a home invader, I'm damn sure going to let them know I fully intended to put him down quick to protect myself, not let some lawyer drag out jury sympathies with stories of the criminal's bad heart and my awkwardness with a supposedly 'non-lethal' product causing his death.

lazs2 · « **Reply #16 on:** December 07, 2004, 02:24:25 PM »

I like to be from assleep to ready to shoot in like 2 or 3 seconds.. I also like to have something short enough to weild and preferably night sights (tritium) or something that is a natural "pointer" or better yet... both night sights and a natural pointer.

45 auto with night sights works good. All the time. no situation where it won't .... revolver same deal... shotgun.... maybe.... if you have enough room and can see well enough to aim and have the time (yes, you have to aim a shotgun or you will miss).

lazs

Muckmaw1 · « **Reply #17 on:** December 07, 2004, 02:27:25 PM »

I have one of those pistol grip guns, so it's pretty easy to maneuver.

With kids in the house, I have to keep it trigger locked and unloaded.

I hope I never have to use it.

lazs2 · « **Reply #18 on:** December 07, 2004, 02:42:20 PM »

just curious...if it is inoperable why have it unloaded?

lazs

StarOfAfrica2 · « **Reply #19 on:** December 07, 2004, 02:44:16 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
I like to be from assleep to ready to shoot in like 2 or 3 seconds.. I also like to have something short enough to weild and preferably night sights (tritium) or something that is a natural "pointer" or better yet... both night sights and a natural pointer.

45 auto with night sights works good. All the time. no situation where it won't .... revolver same deal... shotgun.... maybe.... if you have enough room and can see well enough to aim and have the time (yes, you have to aim a shotgun or you will miss).

lazs

Exactly why I always have, and always will choose a revolver as my primary home defense weapon. Less moving parts, less to go wrong over time. Since I'm not carrying it concealed, I dont worry about those light-frame option guns either. The shotgun is there in case I actually have time to get out of bed and have to go hunting the bastige through my own house. I agree with the night sights, necessary in the dark. Any wounded animal becomes more dangerous, including a human one. I want to drop him, not wing him.

While the .45 ACP might be the best one-shot-stop round out there, a .38 with Glasers is right up there, without the concerns of shooting through a wall. One of my main concerns when shopping for any home defense round. No matter how well you train yourself to think beyond the target, who knows what will happen in a home invasion situation. The Glasers give me the flexiblity to actually increase the damage done to an intruder while minimizing the chance for a ricochet or a miss to penetrate a wall or door and kill or injure someone accidentally.

lazs2 · « **Reply #20 on:** December 07, 2004, 02:54:36 PM »

glasers have spotty reputations... way overhyped.

I am a revolver guy too.... had em all my life and am very comfortable with em.

I bought a Kimber 45 acp with night sights and.... I liike the gun... after a year or so of shooting everythi8ng I could buy or reload out of it.... zero problems. the night sights make it a natural for the nightstand..

I like my chopped down Ruger redhawk in 44 mag but it is a bit much for the house... I would still not hesitate to use it... just that the .45 seems a better comprimise for resedential neighborhoods.

lazs

Muckmaw1 · « **Reply #21 on:** December 07, 2004, 02:55:13 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
just curious...if it is inoperable why have it unloaded?

lazs

I'm paranoid.

I worry that it will go off if it is dropped or somehow can be fired even with the trigger guard on.

Plus, won't the shells corrode or something if left in the gun for extended periods?

lazs2 · « **Reply #22 on:** December 07, 2004, 03:02:44 PM »

muck... not sure what you have other than it is 20 guage... leve the mag loaded and in a locking rack that won't allow the pump to actuate (like the one police often use in their cars.).

If the ammo stays in there long enough to corrode... you probly shouldn't have a gun. Take it out and shoot it and then clean it once in a while.

lazs

StarOfAfrica2 · « **Reply #23 on:** December 07, 2004, 03:35:39 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Muckmaw1
I'm paranoid.

I worry that it will go off if it is dropped or somehow can be fired even with the trigger guard on.

Plus, won't the shells corrode or something if left in the gun for extended periods?

No gun will fire if there is no bullet in the chamber. If you are paranoid, just leave the chamber empty and remember that if you need it.

What, are you going to leave it out in the rain? Considering I sleep with mine in a nylon web holster that is velcroed to the bottom of the nightstand beside the bed, the only thing I really have to worry about is dust bunnys, but I still take it out and remove the bullets and give it a run through with the cloth every so often. Unless I take it to the range, which I like to do to stay comfortable with it once a month or so. Then it gets thorough cleaning ASAP upon return home.

If you mean by "corrode" that the gunpowder will somehow break down with age, I suppose its possible (but not likely in your bedroom). Still, if it makes you feel better, put new shells in it every so often.

Bottom line, you treat guns as an expensive and important tool, and with respect for what they can do, you will never have a problem with it when you need it.

And Lazs, I know there has been some controversy over the real effectiveness of Glaser bullets, but I've shot em through the gun without any problems, and most of the tests I've read from various magazines on them have been favorable. The only real complaints I have seen focus on the energy transfer claims made early on, and on the theory of multiple small wounds from the frangibles causing lots of extra damage. This was especially noted in the MagSafe types. The arguments they use for this are based on gelatin block tests, as are most tests of bullet effectiveness. Detractors use Shaw's tests (from Handgun magazine) with dye inside gelatin to show the dye doesnt seep into the tiny wounds caused by the pellets. In a human body though, blood is pumped under pressure, and if it is just "seeping" into cavities, the person is already dead. I dont agree with the way their tests were performed, or the interpretation of the results, but of course everyone is welcome to an opinion. Besides, I use Cor Bon bullets almost exclusively, and reload my own as well. Cor Bon likes them, and I trust their judgement. I know for a fact they dont overpenetrate, and that solves one of my problems of a handgun home defense round.

lasersailor184 · « **Reply #24 on:** December 07, 2004, 04:26:46 PM »

I've heard that M1 Carbines are great for home defense.

Ripper29 · « **Reply #25 on:** December 07, 2004, 04:38:31 PM »

Okay..I am flying into Orlando tommorow and will be stayiing in the Kissimmie area. How big of a gun should I have and do they issue them at the airport?

ra · « **Reply #26 on:** December 07, 2004, 04:40:54 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Ripper29
Okay..I am flying into Orlando tommorow and will be stayiing in the Kissimmie area. How big of a gun should I have and do they issue them at the airport?

Don't forget to check out the Heritage of Flight musuem.

Ripper29 · « **Reply #27 on:** December 07, 2004, 04:42:48 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by ra
Don't forget to check out the Heritage of Flight musuem.

I was planning on going there, is that the same as the Warbirds musuem?

Chortle · « **Reply #28 on:** December 07, 2004, 05:03:42 PM »

Beetle your either pissed or the daily Torygraph has warped your mind. Admittedly they had their arse whipped in the Galloway libel case but thats no reason to get hysterical.

If you ever feel like butching up or reading the Guardian let me know.

StarOfAfrica2 · « **Reply #29 on:** December 07, 2004, 05:13:24 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Airhead
"One of the key measures of a society's health is how easily you can insulate yourself from its underclass. In America, unless one resides in a very small number of problematic inner-city quarters or wishes to make a career in the drug trade, one will live a life blessedly untouched by crime."

This is so patently false I stopped right here. Crime limited to the Inner City? I lived in a great neighborhood, complete with Neighborhood Watch, and I can guarantee you that if I left my garage open for an hour or so some a-hole would steal my fishing poles. Now I live in the country, and there's every bit as much crime here as there is in the City.

The only thing we DON'T have is as many home invasions, and that's because bad guys in America know they may get shot breaking into an occupied dwelling, while England has created "easy" victims for the criminal element by banning their citizens the right to protect themselves.

It doesnt say crime is limited to the inner city. It says an indicator of the relative health of society as a whole is how easily you (as an average citizen) can be insulated from the underclass of society (read here, criminals who would break into your house). What the rest is saying, is that STATISTICALLY, unless you live in an inner city slum or choose to be a drug smuggler, you are unlikely to be such a victim. We all know it can happen anywhere, in any town. But nationwide the statistics bear out the statement. Look at how many home invasion crimes they have in a large city, then break THAT down and see what percentage of them happened in low income areas. Then compare those statistics to home breakins in rural america or suburbia. Granted, the statement is slightly misleading as it is written, but I dont think you are interpreting it as the writer intended. Just sayin.