Author Topic: Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?  (Read 1142 times)

Offline agent 009

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« on: April 22, 2005, 10:19:43 PM »
What happens to Malta if Germans take coastal areas of Portugal & Spain, Gibralter & Morrocco? Supplying it becomes very difficult no?

Offline Overlag

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2005, 06:11:07 PM »
wrong forum really, but i dont think there was ANY way for germany to take Gibralter.

by sea it would have  been impossible
by air its out of range
by land would mean going though spain... and even though spain was fascist and, "happy" with germany due to its help during the civil war, it wouldnt have allowed that, because that would have ment war with the UK....and later the USA.

but really, taking Gibralter wouldnt have helped the germans that much...i mean how could they seal the med? they didnt have the reasources to fill it with DD's CL's, CA's or BB's.

however its a great idea... doing that would have left egypt to fall to the italy, or germany. That would mean the middle east will have lost its supply line and Japan would have got much further into india etc......

alot of what ifs tho ;)
Adam Webb - 71st (Eagle) Squadron RAF Wing B
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Offline thrila

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2005, 06:56:21 PM »
Is the AH bb writing your ww2 history essay for you?  It sure feels like it:)
"Willy's gone and made another,
Something like it's elder brother-
Wing tips rounded, spinner's bigger.
Unbraced tailplane ends it's figure.
One-O-nine F is it's name-
F is for futile, not for fame."

Offline GRUNHERZ

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #3 on: April 23, 2005, 07:36:04 PM »
There was some article or book written theorizing about just this course of events, namely bGermany focusing on taking the Mediteranian, Egypt, and the rest of the Mid East from the British instead of attacking Russia.

Offline Pongo

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #4 on: April 23, 2005, 08:09:09 PM »
Hitler being more rational  in general would have been a nightmare for the allies. The applications of that are endless.

Offline agent 009

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #5 on: April 23, 2005, 10:29:30 PM »
Spain wouldn't have allowed that? How could they have stopped it? Besides it is possible that Germany would have taken part of it like was done in France.

Offline Ghosth

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2005, 07:51:45 AM »
Napoleon tried taking spain, it was nearly his undoing.  It would be like the US annexing Canada in the middle of a war.  Yes we are friendly now, but the first truckload of troops over the border would change that.

Plus have you ever looked at spain?
All those mountains, terriblle place to try to move troops through quickly.
At the same time a wonderful place for an unhappy populace to use guerilla warefare against an intruder.
 
To truly seal the Med Hitler would have had to have captured ships  of either  France & Italy, plus captured Gibralter itself.
Germany itself simply lacked the ships to do the job, and what ships it had were locked in place up North.


Once done what does he really gain.  Granted he'd of been better able to resupply North Africa.  But North Africa really brings no wealth of resources along with it.


If you want to "what if" Look instead at what would happen if Hitler had used a bit of paitence.  Say he didn't move against poland until 43, or 44 when he was really ready. France & the low country's fall shortly after.  He's had several years to build uboats, & surface ships, so now he is truly able to starve England into submission.

With no foothold for the US troops to muster he can now turn his attention to Russia.

Offline Overlag

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2005, 09:47:09 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
There was some article or book written theorizing about just this course of events, namely bGermany focusing on taking the Mediteranian, Egypt, and the rest of the Mid East from the British instead of attacking Russia.


im playing a Civ3 mod just like that.....all of africa is mine MUHAHAHAHA
Adam Webb - 71st (Eagle) Squadron RAF Wing B
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Offline john9001

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2005, 11:24:12 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by agent 009
Spain wouldn't have allowed that? How could they have stopped it? Besides it is possible that Germany would have taken part of it like was done in France.


germany did ask spain if they could move german troops through spain to take gibralter, spain said no.

Offline agent 009

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2005, 01:46:12 PM »
& Germany could have done it regardless.

Offline Overlag

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2005, 02:15:15 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by agent 009
& Germany could have done it regardless.


what makes you think that?

why would it do that to a semi-ally?

why would it want to control somewhere thats just been through civil war and has NO value to them?

all it would mean is extra resources needed, and more troops needed to defend, almost useless terrority.
Adam Webb - 71st (Eagle) Squadron RAF Wing B
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Offline MANDO

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #11 on: April 24, 2005, 03:01:47 PM »
Just by the end of the civil war (1936-1939), Spain military was composed mostly by veterans. Not a good idea to mess up with them in a so difficult terrain.

On the other hand, Spain was helping Germany in the East front, Blue division was used as a storm unit against Leningrad, as well as some air units.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2005, 03:04:19 PM by MANDO »

Offline agent 009

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2005, 08:28:43 PM »
Spain had plenty of value. Spain recieved milloins in bribes from Britain to stay out of an alliance with germany. Gibralter is the 1st obvious "value" in occupying parts of Spain. Natural recources as well. More atlantic coastal area is has obvious value.

Offline wipass

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2005, 07:11:44 AM »
The Royal Navy ensured that Germany didn't invade Gibraltar.

I wonder what part Portugal played in the scheme of things ?

wipass

Offline Morpheus

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Gibralter taken, med sealed, malta?
« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2005, 07:15:13 AM »
WTF???

Stop it.
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