Flag waving

[easymo]

I have been active on this board for the last few days.  And I have made references to my service in Viet Nam. I would like to post the reason.

  First of all, any sense of uniqueness I may have felt at being a combat veteran disappeared on Sept. 11.  We are all vets now.

  Secondly, the politicians have begun saying some disturbingly familiar things about what is to come.

 The thing that was our undoing in that old war, was simply a lack of national will.  Our forces won every major engagement with the enemy, for the first time in American history.  In spite of that we lost.  It was a lack of will.

  Right now there is a lot of flag waving, everyone is pissed, ready to go to war.  That is fine. But what about 5 years from now?  When the constant drain on our economy, to fight this thing, seems to have no end.  When the far greater cost of American lives continues.  I can warrent, the weaker ones among us will start coming up with some very clever reasons why we should quit.  Under no condition can we afford to do this.  If we back away from one more, we have had it.  Everything we belive in will gradually wither until there is nothing left for our children.

[StSanta]

Aye easymo, this is what I'm concerned about.

Americans are very impatient - it's both a virtue and a drawback. Am wondering if there's gonna be a repeat of the Viet nam war if things turn ugly :/

[Toad]

Easy, valid concerns, good post.

The weaker ones are already saying we shouldn't even start.

[Eagler]

 

Now and for as long as it takes

[ 09-20-2001: Message edited by: Eagler ]

[batdog]

I dont see this war being a protracted groundwar as in Vietnam. I see this war having strikes and engagements but it'll be more similar to the "cold" war mentality than anything. Perhaps that isnt even a good description....it'll be like a war on drugs with the FULL government miltary and intel involved and the will to go in a hit the sources.

 The thing that makes me sleep better at night is that guys like  Sec of State Powel remember Vietnam and our mistakes and the high cost to many young soldiers and the nation. I think we'll fully commit and use as much force as we can bring to bear.

 I forsee a conflict that will ethier A: Bring about a "safer" maybe more united world. Or B: A world living in constant terror of some radicals retribution to you because he disagrees w/your way of life and or allies. I fiqure B is gonna happen regardless... eventualy terrorists WILL gain access to weapons of mass destruction and THEY WILL use them. Why should they care if they kill millions of infidels? We HAVE to win this war... if we give up or in...we're screwed and we've screwed our future as well.


xBAT

[Sandman]

Originally posted by batdog:
I dont see this war being a protracted groundwar as in Vietnam. I see this war having strikes and engagements but it'll be more similar to the "cold" war mentality than anything. Perhaps that isnt even a good description....it'll be like a war on drugs with the FULL government miltary and intel involved and the will to go in a hit the sources.
xBAT

I sure hope not. The drug war is an abyssmal failure.

[Eagler]

Originally posted by Sandman_SBM:


I sure hope not. The drug war is an abyssmal failure.

Sandman
It has been a failure because we are fighting it in the wrong place. If we attacked the drug lords & their plantations as we seem to be planning to attack the terrorists, we could win that war too. It wouldn't fix the worlds drug problem but it would dry up the source(s)..

[Skuzzy]

Big difference between this and Vietnam.  We have been attacked and lost lives already.

There will be those that do not have the stomach for what will come, or what may come.  It is the nature of our society.  We have all manner of people with all manner of ideas.
Just scan this board alone and you can see that.

If anyone start crying about a war, then the propoganda machine in our country will go to work.  I can see banners all over this country of pictures of what happened in New York.  I have already hung mine on the wall.

Another big difference between now and Vietnam;  Virtually every country on the planet has pledged some level of support.  This is probably the biggest reason why a war will happen and will continue to some logical conclusion.

My son, who is 18, and in the Air Force got to call me last night.  He says, he is nervous, but he will not allow his children to grow up in a country worrying about being the next target.  I had to ask,..you sure you're only 18?

Damn,..I am one proud papa.  So,..for those that cannot stomach a war, move out of the way because we also have a country full of prideful folks that will not roll over and take it on the chin.

[Toad]

Here ya go mates...


"Wednesday, Sept. 19, 2001

Miami Firemen Refuse to Ride on Truck Carrying Flag

Three Miami firefighters refused to ride on a fire engine carrying the American flag because they deemed Old Glory "offensive," the fire department said today.

The U.S. flag represents "oppression," the three government employees griped - and they refused to respond to emergency calls Saturday until a crew chief removed it, the Associated Press reported."

****

So you see, this too is not a question of "if" but of "when".

Skuzzy, (and all the rest of you proud parents) please convey to your offspring my thanks for their service.

I suspect my two will be taking their turn in this Hundred Years War as well. It fills me with fear but I know they'll go and I'll support them.

[ 09-20-2001: Message edited by: Toad ]

[Skuzzy]

Those firefighters should be terminated, immediately.

Don't read into this.  I have incredible respect for anyone taking on the jobs of protecting our people.


Hmm,...better yet, send them to New York for a few months.  Let's see what the New York fire fighters have to say  .

[Ripsnort]

City council in Berkley ordered all fighter trucks to remove their flags due to the protests that focused on City vehicles displaying flags during the Gulf war..but then again, it IS Berkley...

[batdog]

F*&^ them all. I hope they get run outta the damn country.

 Once again America has proven why we're such a great place to live... try to do that in anthor nation...

xBAT

[Eagler]

Originally posted by Skuzzy:
Those firefighters should be terminated, immediately.

Don't read into this.  I have incredible respect for anyone taking on the jobs of protecting our people.


Hmm,...better yet, send them to New York for a few months.  Let's see what the New York fire fighters have to say   .

Probably three of the group who didn't know how to vote correctly last November either...

[ispar]

I suppose you could say I have the stomach for a war, if one is to be fought. But that one is to be fought is a terrible shame. A war to destroy terrorism will not solve this. It will instead only escalate and escalate until the only measure of victory is that some of us are still alive and all of them are dead. That's not a victory. A victory is to find a way to stop terrorism with the minimum bloodshed possible. If we are going to hit Afghanistan, so be it. I won't shed any tears over those responsible.

But to carry out a war against any who we determine to be terrorists (very likely an unavoidable conflict if we even hit Afghanistan - which is why it's such a stupid idea) will not lead to a solution. Only a "victory," and one that will be too costly to consider as such. Sorry, but global compassion, understanding, right sharing of resources, environmentalism (yes, this important) and an understanding that terrorism is a crime and will be treated as such are the only things that will lead to a true solution. There is no way to totally eliminate it, but there are ways to deal with it that don't involve simply killing many thousands or millions.

[ 09-21-2001: Message edited by: ispar ]

[easymo]

Best of luck skuzzy.  Im sure the boy will do fine.