Author Topic: Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?  (Read 4693 times)

Offline DoKGonZo

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1977
      • http://www.gonzoville.com
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #120 on: May 13, 2006, 10:49:04 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Urchin
The only thing that kinda irritates me about the Bore n Zoom guys (the ones that aren't noob jousters, that is) is they keep trying to come back.  

...

It sucks.


Yeah, they're annoying to those of us higher up too. Because up there if they miss a couple passes you can equalize altitudes ... and then they either run or go into HO-motion.

Offline WMLute

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 4512
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #121 on: May 14, 2006, 12:48:39 AM »
Quick question for Dok.

Let's say you are in a P51D, @18k up.  You see a spit16 @16k and closing on your 12.  

What do you do, and how would this fight typically play out for you.
"Never tell people how to do things. Tell them what to do and they will surprise you with their ingenuity."
— George Patton

Absurdum est ut alios regat, qui seipsum regere nescit

Offline MIShill

  • Copper Member
  • **
  • Posts: 182
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #122 on: May 14, 2006, 01:32:59 AM »
I am really having fun in this game. If I get mad in an endless 80 fighter furball, I just go elsewhere & b&z for a while. I can buff or gv to my heart's content, Exactly what is there to complain about here?
-MI- {Shillelagh}

Offline pluck

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1302
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #123 on: May 14, 2006, 01:38:02 AM »
pardon me, i will warn you i have had a few drinks tonight:)

one thing i'll never quite get about this game is this......AH is a game about fighting other players. you win some, you lose some, you can't win em' all. why are there so many care bears in a game that is focused on player vs. player contact?  good god, you lost a plane, oh no chicken little!  it's not like some lv 50 wizard killed you and took your precious sword that you spent 6 months getting.

really, i resepect someone 20x more for actually fighting than spending the day bore'n' zooming you for 5 minutes.  where's the guts, has the MA been reduced to a bunch of chicken' lilly azzed' care bears worrying about a plane they did not buy, what score they have, who's FH's need to be killed?

bah, i say there is something wrong with worrying about keeping your plane alive, you should worry more about fighting....isn't that the game?  i don't get mad when i get picked, or b'n'z'ed all day, but i sure don't think that pilot has 133t skillz.  i actually think to myself "wow he suxs."

what ever though, if people want to spend $15 to float around and pick of people without jeopardizing their precious plane to no end, because it is so important (obviously) then have at it.  i would never question the reason, i just assume that's all they know. (true or not).  maybe the can get a 60/1 k/d ratio, boy must they be good.  maybe fly for hours and hours and log 1000's of kills. oh yea, it's in the sake of realism though right?

p.s.  to date the best ever care bear whine came to me the other day, when someone was crying about the fact that i got a kill after they tried to ditch. lol, and they called me the lamer:huh

play to have fun, when you find yourself worrying that your plane might get shot down maybe you should switch to a more care bear friendly game.  anyone have another  beer for me:)
-Vast
NOSEART
80th FS "Headhunters"

Offline Boxboy

  • Nickel Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 740
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #124 on: May 14, 2006, 02:17:10 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Booz
Says you. But you're wrong. There's no shame in keeping your plane alive, only shame in diving in without a plan and expire like a dweeb. I'm not willing to give AH up to the arcade boys.

 btw what does LOLH mean? You seem to use it a lot.


TOO Late it's already arcade:cry
Sub Lt BigJim
801 Sqn FAA
Pilot

Offline DoKGonZo

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1977
      • http://www.gonzoville.com
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #125 on: May 14, 2006, 03:15:34 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by WMLute
Quick question for Dok.

Let's say you are in a P51D, @18k up.  You see a spit16 @16k and closing on your 12.  

What do you do, and how would this fight typically play out for you.


Usually if I encounter that in the current MA the Spit will start to turn and dive away once he gets in con range and sees its not a P47 or Fw.

If he don't, the next move depends on what he does. If he starts to climb to me I'll dive at him to scoot underneath and Immelman at the merge. This basically erases any altitude he gained climbing to me when he reverses after the merge - it also makes him go nose-down at the merge if he wants the HO shot. If he flies level, I expect the Immelman from him from below and zoom climb at the merge point; then pop flaps at the top and come down on him.

The way it usually plays out these days is 20% of the time I get HO'd or rammed  (no matter how I try to avoid it), about 20% of the time I'll screw up or be outflown and scram, about 20% of the time the Spit will run once he sees I've secured a critical advantage, about 20% of the time I'll get a kill out of it, and the rest is some combination of the Spit's buddies trying to intervene or rubber bullets or I just lose patience with dodging Hispano HO's and look for something else to shoot at.

Could I fly more aggressively in this situation? Sure. Probably the biggest reason I don't is I'm not very confident of my gunnery. Both because of lack of consistent practice and the flakiness of my connect since the SBC-ATT merger.  I just never know from one engagement to the next if I'm loaded with blank ammo or not.

Offline DoKGonZo

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1977
      • http://www.gonzoville.com
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #126 on: May 14, 2006, 03:22:44 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by pluck
pardon me, i will warn you i have had a few drinks tonight:)

one thing i'll never quite get about this game is this.........


This kind of closed-mindedness is what is making this game less and less fun for me.

Offline LEDPIG

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Copper Member
  • **
  • Posts: 320
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #127 on: May 14, 2006, 06:09:25 AM »
Boy people sure do complain how people don't play the game how they want them to. I've gone to playing axis and allies alot because in there i can avoid a horde and go 1 to 1 with a guy or in a team setting where people work together to kill the enemy and not have to worry about 500 people picking me, when i'm doin it. The other day i got into a 5 minute long dogfight with a p-51, it was most fun, each of us spiraling around for position, i scored some definite hits, then we hit the deck in  a stall fight going around and around on the edge, stall horn blaring then i start gaining advantage again, the p-51 starts running, i'm right behind in wep chasing in a p-38 not really gaining, finally i say forget it, a buddy of mine calls zero 2 o clock we start working him, as soon as we focus on the zero the p-51 comes back sneaking up so i turn on him again gaining definite hits to his wing structure, being that i'm in a 38, i tell my buddy to handle the zero since he's wearing something a little more maneaverable, the zero shoots my buddy down then the horde sets in on me, low and slow in a 38 after having turn fought a 51 i'm dead meat and the 51 gets away. I live for engagements like this the aerial balet of air combat, it got my blood boiling, but one of the things i don't like about the main arena is the point whoring and people who do anything to get it. My scores suck, 1) cause i suck 2) cause i don't care, 3) and three cause i played this game for the first couple months not even trying to land after i scored kills, i didn't even know that's how it worked, i'd have much fun staying till i died, i didn't even try to land. When the p-51 ran i didn't really care,  it's his business, but some people here have some major problems when people don't play the game how they want. It basically amounts to people being in grade school and going, Billy didn't play hopscotch how i wanted so now i'm going to whine, i was never like that, i would wait till Billy was ready to play then i'd kick his prettythang. Some people here have to learn the magical life lesson that it's not all about me and that people have free will to do whatever they want, AND THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT. When the p-51 ran from me, he was beat, i was all over him the whole time and he had the disadvantage, i consider it smart to run sometime, to formulate a new plan of attack or to even up a disadvantage in plane performance. I have to do it all the time since i fly the American iron and the whole dam# arena now is made of spit and la's, often times i'll bleed my energy trying to get a shot and who's behind me but Mr spit 16, so i run to get away knowing i'm a dead man if i don't do something,  cause i'm dead in Mr Spit's territory in a P-38 at 150 mph so i disengage. Meanwhile on ch 200 i hear these guys talk about run coward run, and i'm going you want me to stay here and give you my behind on a silver platter?  How selfish are you. If i'm lucky enough to disengage and gain some alt and speed i'll loop back down and try to get a finishing shot, then i'll here these same guys whining about he picked me. Yea he picked you, what do you expect watch your prettythang next time.  Anyway i think it amounts to a bunch of children whining that you don't play how they want, and when they get killed they cry about that too. That attitiude has got to stop. Whatever happened to sportmanship? A simple hey man good job, or you got me, it happens to me all the time and try i not to complain about it.

P.S. I don't think the La or Spit should be perked anymore, who am i to tell somebody what they can fly:)
« Last Edit: May 14, 2006, 06:17:57 AM by LEDPIG »
S.A.P.P. member (armed and lubricated)

Providing bait for other SAPP pilots since 2005

Formerly Leadpig...Proud to be one of the PNG'd...
Skuzzyfied!

Offline Dead Man Flying

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6301
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #128 on: May 14, 2006, 08:47:28 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Booz
Says you. But you're wrong. There's no shame in keeping your plane alive, only shame in diving in without a plan and expire like a dweeb. I'm not willing to give AH up to the arcade boys.


You're both wrong.  There's no shame in anything; it's just a game.  You're not giving up anything to the "arcade boys," and Mars isn't actually striking a blow for intrepid dogfighters.  Now would you gentlemen please put down the purses?

-- Todd/Leviathn

Offline Grits

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 5332
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #129 on: May 14, 2006, 08:59:17 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Dead Man Flying
You're both wrong.  There's no shame in anything; it's just a game.  You're not giving up anything to the "arcade boys," and Mars isn't actually striking a blow for intrepid dogfighters.  Now would you gentlemen please put down the purses?

-- Todd/Leviathn


Exactly. I just kill red guys however I feel like at that moment. Sometimes its TnB, sometimes its E fighting, sometimes its cherrypicking, sometimes its a HO, sometimes I dive into 10 badguys and dont kill anything. The only thing that has any real relevance is whether I (you) have fun or not.

Offline pluck

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1302
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #130 on: May 14, 2006, 09:00:02 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by DoKGonZo
This kind of closed-mindedness is what is making this game less and less fun for me.



didn't think it was closed minded, i didn't know having an opinion made the game less fun for you.  like i said it's your money, spend it the way you want, i'm not going to tell you your playing the right way or not.  but they way is see it, people need to show me they can actually fly the plane before i start giving them the .  b'n'z and picking is not a able act imho.

i was just trying to point out that some, and wasn't speaking at you, care far to much about dying than fighting.  i'm not talking about the guy who does not want to turn fight a spit in a 109, but the guy who refuses to learn how to fight in one.

the other night i was defending a base from wave after wave of p51's and typhs.  after gaining some alt in my 190, i was able to start running these guys down.  all they did was drop there eggs, and fly straight. i get behind them shoot them......they make to attempt to do anything.  rinse repeat.  and lets not even bring up all the vulch monkeys the fly straight to a base and start vulching, while 20 enemy planes still up defending base, then runs home.  how about the guy that has 10k advantage on you and b'n'zs for 10 minutes.  maybe its fun to them, but i don't see how, you could do the same thing offline.   vast
-Vast
NOSEART
80th FS "Headhunters"

Offline lazs2

  • Radioactive Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 24886
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #131 on: May 14, 2006, 09:34:54 AM »
gonzo... didn't realize you were so sensitive...  I would agree with you that the HO boys and hordes are ruining the game... even then... if 5 guys are on you... might as well take the HO... take every shot you get till you die sorta thing... I think you mean the other way round tho... 5 guys come at one but they all just put down thier visors and ram..

So fine... we agree on that... what we don't agree on is that this is not a historical game.  I didn't sign on to relive history per se... I love WWII prop planes... I like gunnery and balistics... I allways wanted to see  what it would be like to fly the things and shoot the guns and I like flying (virtualy) against real humans..  I want to fight equal agtainst equal too... spit against spit or ally against ally.

Now... The problem is... WWII was the hight of piston engine development and armement.   it went from 500hp and 2 .30 caliber machine guns to allmost 3000 hp and 8 .50's or 4 20 mm cannon.   We can choose any plane from the era.

simply clicking on a later war monster gives you a huge advantage.... you are all but untouchable when fighting early war slow planes if.... you are immune to boredom and have even a modicum of skill....  You can bore and zoom to your hearts delight.

this is gaming the game no matter how you say it.   The only real way that  we could have equal fights with such choices of planes is voluntary.

If you have a fast late war plane.... stay high and fight only other late war planes... if you go low... stay and fight low.   Slow planes at alt are fair game.   early planes stay low.   Fight only late war planes in your late war plane and see how it goes.

I don't think anyone would call gaming the game on bore and zoom tactics when two late war fast planes are involved but....

That is not what is happening... the late war planes look for the slower planes to bore and zoom or catch when occupied..

zooming down in a late war monster... taking your sissy little kick at the engaged early war plane and then zooming back up to your high alt foxhole...

is just as gamey as the HO warrior or horde.

lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's

Offline lazs2

  • Radioactive Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 24886
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #132 on: May 14, 2006, 09:40:46 AM »
pluck... that is well put.   I upped a tempest in the late war only infinity map because I got tired of the only thing that passed for "air combat" being pee51's and doris's taking sissy little kicks at me and then running.

I chased a pee51 and duh.... dora... for allmost a sector.. everytime it looked like they might have to engage with equal e... they ran further..

This is no doubt fighting like a "smart" WWII pilot might have but.... to say that they allways flew like that would be insulting to their memory in my opinion.   It really seems strange in a game.   If those guys weren't in the game it would not bother me in the least... I have no use for em.

lazs
Public Relations Officer for the BK's

Offline Toad

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 18415
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #133 on: May 14, 2006, 09:45:18 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by LEDPIG
The other day i got into a 5 minute long dogfight with a p-51, it was most fun, each of us spiraling around for position, i scored some definite hits, then we hit the deck in  a stall fight going around and around on the edge, stall horn blaring then i start gaining advantage again, the p-51 starts running, i'm right behind in wep chasing in a p-38 not really gaining, finally i say forget it, a buddy of mine calls zero 2 o clock we start working him, as soon as we focus on the zero the p-51 comes back sneaking up so i turn on him again gaining definite hits to his wing structure, being that i'm in a 38, i tell my buddy to handle the zero since he's wearing something a little more maneaverable, the zero shoots my buddy down then the horde sets in on me, low and slow in a 38 after having turn fought a 51 i'm dead meat and the 51 gets away.  


Let's see... you had an inconclusive 1v1 with a P-51 (or was your "buddy" already helping you with the 51?)

Then you and your buddy tried to gang a zeke 2v1 and the -51 comes back making it 2v2. The horror.

Your buddy loses and it's now 2v1 against you.

I'm sorry.... I just have to laugh at your sorrowful predicament.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline NoBaddy

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2943
      • http://www.damned.org
Do scores affect gameplay? Do captures interfere with fun?
« Reply #134 on: May 14, 2006, 09:54:52 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by lazs2
simply clicking on a later war monster gives you a huge advantage.... you are all but untouchable when fighting early war slow planes if.... you are immune to boredom and have even a modicum of skill....  You can bore and zoom to your hearts delight.

this is gaming the game no matter how you say it.   The only real way that  we could have equal fights with such choices of planes is voluntary.

If you have a fast late war plane.... stay high and fight only other late war planes... if you go low... stay and fight low.   Slow planes at alt are fair game.   early planes stay low.   Fight only late war planes in your late war plane and see how it goes.

I don't think anyone would call gaming the game on bore and zoom tactics when two late war fast planes are involved but....

That is not what is happening... the late war planes look for the slower planes to bore and zoom or catch when occupied..

 


Pure, unadulterated bullpucky. Lazs, if you honestly believe this is true...you deserve everyone's sympathy. That tactic has nothing to do with the plane people chose to fly.
NoBaddy (NB)

Flying since before there was virtual durt!!
"Ego is the anesthetic that dulls the pain of stupidity."