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Author Topic: Israeli weapons  (Read 541 times)

Offline AquaShrimp

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Israeli weapons
« on: July 21, 2006, 12:50:37 PM »
Well, seeing how we are about to see some live fire exercises performed by the Israelis, lets talk about a few of the neat weapons in the Israeli aresnal.

The Merkava


This is a really neat tank designed for urban combat.  It has modular armor, facilitating quick repairs.  Armament is simple, 120mm cannon, 50 cal machine gun, and a 60mm morter.  However, the neatest feature of this tank is its rear door.  The tank is capable of carrying 4 soldiers in the rear.  It also allows the crew to escape quickly incase the tank is burning.

F-16I


This is a heavily modified block 50 Viper.  This aircraft has two crewmembers, conformal fuel tanks, and an array of electronic countermeasures carried in a dorsal spine.

Tar-21


The Tar-21 is a 5.56mm bullpup.  It is capable of selective fire and has no open sights.  All rifles come standardly equipped with reflective sights equiped with laser pointers.
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Offline Maverick

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Israeli weapons
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2006, 02:15:17 PM »
The Merkava is a good platform, no doubt about it. The idea of it being designed for "urban combat"is not accurate. Urban combat limits 2 of the 3 main factors of a tanks usefulness in combat, that being speed and shock. A tank is far far more usefull in a mobile environment where it can use it's assets in a rapid fluid manner especially by getting to the rear of the enemy and disrupting them there. Deep penetration and exploitation missions use them to their best abilities as long as they have the support of other branches of the military like troops for ground support and air cover for an umbrella to operate under.
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Offline AquaShrimp

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Israeli weapons
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2006, 03:26:59 PM »
Yeah you're right about the tank.  The Russians put out a neat paper reviewing U.S. and British vehicles in urban combat in Iraq.
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Offline Wolfala

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« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2006, 03:32:42 PM »
Can I see this paper?
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Offline Nilsen

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« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2006, 04:06:06 PM »
Actually the merkava is designed for regular and city fighting.. unlike the tank doctrines of other countries. Saw a report about it io discovery were a soldier explained how it was designed for it. The armor on that thing is massive and fetures some neat tricks that other tanks does not have. The only real drawback of the tank is price and weight. It would not be suitable for operations were bridges etc has to be crossed but that was not something that the Israelis had to worry about. Most other western nations have to think about weight and it has become more and more important with the emphasis on transporting tanks to far away battlefields... that is again something that Israel does not have to worry about.

I would say its prolly the best tank out there if you take away the weight issues.


Btw.. anyone heard from Bozon? Last time i talked to him he had not yet been called, but now that they are mobbing reserves..
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Offline Eagler

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Israeli weapons
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2006, 05:15:05 PM »
the 2nd photo reminded me of one of my first flight sim type computer games
Strike Commander
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Offline RedTop

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« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2006, 05:40:20 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Eagler
the 2nd photo reminded me of one of my first flight sim type computer games
Strike Commander

My first flying game as well. I let my son have it and on more than 1 occasion I wish I had it again.

Any Idea where I could get a coupy of this?
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Offline Maverick

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« Reply #7 on: July 21, 2006, 05:51:51 PM »
Nilsen,

If you want to take what you hear on Discovery channel as accurate that's up to you. The Merkava's been around for a while and is nothing really new at all. It just happens to be made in Isreal so it's a domestic product for them which means they have all that they need for it now and in the furure without having to deal with any other nations.

As to the tactical aspects of armor in a city, you really should read some history of urban operations with armor in WW2. The situation has not changed since then inspite of the upgrades to tanks in general. in fact it has gotten worse given the changes and availabilities of anti tank weapons. Urban warfare is not a strong point for armor operations and seriously hampers it's ability to fight as it was designed to fight.
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Offline FUNKED1

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Israeli weapons
« Reply #8 on: July 21, 2006, 06:45:53 PM »
Silly Israelis, they could waste all those civilians just as well with Shermans, Garands, and T-28's.
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Offline Holden McGroin

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« Reply #9 on: July 21, 2006, 09:07:43 PM »
Or they could just walk into a pizza parlor with an explosive vest...
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Offline Fishu

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Israeli weapons
« Reply #10 on: July 21, 2006, 10:06:09 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Maverick
The Merkava is a good platform, no doubt about it. The idea of it being designed for "urban combat"is not accurate. Urban combat limits 2 of the 3 main factors of a tanks usefulness in combat, that being speed and shock.  


Mk4 has .50 caliber BMG just because of the urban combat. The previous models have 7.62mm BMG, but they decided to upgrade to a bigger caliber which has proved to be useful in penetrating walls and buildings, especially the ones in the middle east.
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Offline Eagler

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« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2006, 10:58:52 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by RedTop
My first flying game as well. I let my son have it and on more than 1 occasion I wish I had it again.
Any Idea where I could get a coupy of this?


my first was  actually BattleHawks 1942

looks like you can download Strike Commander for a small fee here:
http://free-game-downloads.mosw.com/abandonware/pc/simulations/games_s/strike_commander.html
but I've found most DOS games do not live up to their memories if you can get them to run
« Last Edit: July 21, 2006, 11:08:19 PM by Eagler »
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Offline ghi

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Re: Israeli weapons
« Reply #12 on: July 22, 2006, 01:40:39 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by AquaShrimp
Well, seeing how we are about to see some live fire exercises performed by the Israelis, lets talk about a few of the neat weapons in the Israeli aresnal.

.

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Offline Nilsen

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Israeli weapons
« Reply #13 on: July 22, 2006, 01:46:53 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Maverick
Nilsen,

If you want to take what you hear on Discovery channel as accurate that's up to you. The Merkava's been around for a while and is nothing really new at all. It just happens to be made in Isreal so it's a domestic product for them which means they have all that they need for it now and in the furure without having to deal with any other nations.

As to the tactical aspects of armor in a city, you really should read some history of urban operations with armor in WW2. The situation has not changed since then inspite of the upgrades to tanks in general. in fact it has gotten worse given the changes and availabilities of anti tank weapons. Urban warfare is not a strong point for armor operations and seriously hampers it's ability to fight as it was designed to fight.


I dont take what Discovery channel says as fact.. It is in many ways a joke (the channel). I used to have respect for Tom Clancy as someone with great knowledge about military stuff untill I heard his comments on a few shows there. However it was an Israeli soldier that said it, and explained how it was designed/evolved to be used in urban combat.

I know about the history and blunders made by armor and city fighting.. that still does not prevent anyone today from using tanks in cities (even your own army). The fact remains that the merakva tank is designed to be as good as possible in cities simply because they have no choise unlike most other classic tanks.
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Offline ghi

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Israeli weapons
« Reply #14 on: July 22, 2006, 09:48:43 AM »
Arrow 2 ATBM Missile  



Missile    
Missile length 7.0m  
Missile diameter 800mm  
Missile launch weight 1,300kg
Launch canisters per launcher 6
Radar    
Radar frequency L band  
Detection range 500km  
Target speed  Over 3km/s
Missile guidance to distance from target 4m from target  
Missile Performance    
Missile velocity Mach 9  
Maximum range 70.0km  
Maximum range of flight 90.0km
Minimum altitude 8,000m
Maximum altitude 50,000m
 
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