Author Topic: An appeal to the AH community (Read 1130 times)

toonces3 · « **on:** May 18, 2007, 01:14:49 PM »

Hey all,
Ok, I'm a newb, and haven't paid my dues here enough to really have this opinion, but I'm gonna throw it out there anyway. I'm sure this horse has been beaten to death at some point, but since I'm new, I haven't seen it yet.

Look, the LW main arenas are what they are. Although I haven't been here long, I already understand that you have to accept what you get there. I assume at any head on pass that I could get shot in the face, I accept that I can get gang banged at any time, and I accept that at any point somebody can come in and spoil my good time...or I can go in and spoil someone elses (although I try not to).

Shortly after joining here, I flew a couple nights in the early war arena and had a blast. I like that arena because a) I can fly my beloved P-40E and have at least a fighting chance of survival and b) the lower numbers means that I can concentrate more on smaller furball scenarios and not have to worry too much about being bounced on by 5 or 8 or 10 on 1 like I have in the LW MA a few times.

The first few times in there, I found a higher calibre of player. People seemed to be more into having fun and playing with a sense of fairness that is missing from LW many times. It stands to reason, I would think, that if you're going to take the time to go into EW and have the patience to find a fight, you're there to actually have a good fight and not just land kills.

However, the last few trips into EW have left a really bad taste. I brushed it off to a bad night the first few times, but last night was really bad. I know this is going to sound whiney, but it really bugged me.

Myself and 3 of my squad mates joined up, and upped P-40's. We even changed countries to even up the sides. We were enroute to the other side and got into a fairly good fight. Eventually I got shot down by a top-25 ranked guy in a FW-190. He also shot down a couple other guys on our side. So far so good. Then, somebody HO'd another squaddie. In aggravation, he upped a FW-190 and shot down the top-25 guy. Then he got HO'd again.

At any rate, after some back and forth, I was up again in my P-40 with my squad mate in a P-40 or Spit I, and we get engaged with a A6M. We're having a good fight until a Spit 9 joins the fight. I see the Spit and start to fight with him, but since I was already engaged with the A6M, I didn't have a lot of energy to play with and of course I eventually got shot down. And then I checked, and the Spit 9 is a 36 perk point plane, and was being flown by the same top-25 guy.

And then I got kind of pissed. I mean, there's maybe 8 of us altogether fighting over here, 4 v. 4, and the top 25 guy has to up a perked plane to fight me, ranked 3000 something, in a P-40?

So, basically we all left to the LW MA where at least we knew what to expect. But it really got me thinking. What possible reason is there to do something like that in the EW arena? Who in the world is going to keep playing if every engagement you're going to be fighting someone much better than you in a much higher performance plane, or where you're going to spend 15 minutes commuting to the fight only to get HO'd at the merge? I'm not saying that what anyone did is wrong exactly, but it seems self-defeating for everyone if you're going to play like that. I don't mind getting beat by someone in a different plane; I do mind getting beat by the best guy in the arena flying the highest performance plane in the arena.

Ok, so I told you that to say this. I'd like to suggest that as a community the veterans get together and enforce some sort of 'code' for lack of a better word on one of the arenas. Players in this arena would be expected to play at a higher level of integrity and fairness- meaning no gang banging other players, no vulching, no upping perked planes in a 2 or 3 or 4 v. scenario, etc. This would be somewhere where, when a player gets tired of the meat grinder of LW MA, they can fly with a little less free-for-all and have a good time.

If this arena already exists, please point me in the right direction because I'd like to spend more time there.

Thank you very much for your time. Nobody is going to care what newguy Toonces says, but perhaps if some of the folks with some weight on here got behind the movement, we'd get somewhere.

Laurie · « **Reply #1 on:** May 18, 2007, 01:18:24 PM »

you use technical words for a newbie;)

Lusche · « **Reply #2 on:** May 18, 2007, 01:25:50 PM »

Just a few comments:

- you were lucky to find any airborne planes at all in EW, that has become increasingly rare (unless one side can muster a at least a 8-1 advantge, which does happen quite regular)

- It takes two to tango, err Ho

- When is someone not allowed to fly a 190 anymore? Have I have earned my perks to now just being not"allowed" to spend them?

- There is a arena with a supposed "code of conduct". It's the Axis vs Allies. You might give it a try, seems more like that what you are looking for. Folks in there may be very happy if you and your mates will show up.

- When will people stop to worry about what others people fly

- Ty on switching sides to even the ratio between countries a bit.

- No it wasn't me toonces3 was talking about. Not this time. Honestly.

The Fugitive · « **Reply #3 on:** May 18, 2007, 01:25:50 PM »

in the whole senerio you got there the biggest mistake you made was assuming that this "top 25" really is a better pilot. Rank means nothing in this game. It is far to easy to game the game and build a rank. Of the top 25 I'd guess that maybe 6 are good pilots, but you'll most likely find them in the LW arenas than any other place.

Most of the guys in the "top 25" guys are going to be those who, like this guy, hangs out in the EW, MW arenas and cherry picks and vulches to add to his score. Don't go by the scoreboard on rating people.

As to your idea, this community has never been very good at self-govening. Those who respect and will listen to the "vets" are few and far between. Yes what happened to you is frustrating, but you solved the problem the best way you could, you went looking for a new fight.

hubsonfire · « **Reply #4 on:** May 18, 2007, 01:27:31 PM »

Toonces, first off, you've got to realize, for the most part, rank is absolutely no indication of skill.

Second, while you may have noble thoughts with regard to the EW arenas, the only guarantee is that it's an early war planeset. There are no real rules regarding gameplay, and there probably aren't going to be any.

Just fly what you want, how you want, and don't have any expectations regarding the gameplay, actions, or conduct of others. You will only be disappointed and frustrated. That's just the reality of online gaming with no real structure or rules.

Xargos · « **Reply #5 on:** May 18, 2007, 01:28:26 PM »

Was that a overall score of 25 or a fighter score of 25? Some people with a overall low score get that from gaming the game, not from actual skill. If they depend on a LW plane to get kills, then their really not that good.

Blooz · « **Reply #6 on:** May 18, 2007, 01:32:04 PM »

The 'code' disappeared in 1915.

This sim is about combat.

Someone's going to win and someone's going to lose.

There are no fair fights.

Next time fly better planes with more people and earn huge perk bonuses each time the enemy comes.

Shoot him down a few times and he'll leave rather than you.

The Fugitive · « **Reply #7 on:** May 18, 2007, 01:33:30 PM »

oh ya, and I forgot to add, you can look at it this way.... he had to up a perked ride to get you

toonces3 · « **Reply #8 on:** May 18, 2007, 01:35:09 PM »

Just to clarify:

Anybody can fly whatever they want when they want. I fly the P-40E because I like the plane, even though I know I'm unlikely to land alot of flights because it is not the best plane, and I'm not the best stick.

There were 26 people in EW when I was on. That means almost the entire roster will fit on the clipboard.

It's not hard to see the relative ranks of the folks you're fighting against, even if the numbers are subject to interpretation.

I DO think it is poor form to up the highest perk plane in a scenario like last night when we're basically fighting 4 on 4. I especially think it's poor form if you're a really good pilot. I say that because it totally spoils the fun of the fight. This leads to me leaving. Then (I assume) everyone loses because it's hard to dogfight yourself. I suppose one might get satisfaction from beating everyone in your perk plane, but to me, it'd be about has much satisfaction as hitting a homerun against my 5 year old's T-ball team. Just my opinion.

Further, I ALWAYS assume I am going to get shot in the face on the merge. I actively maneuver to avoid it.

Finally, I disagree that the vets here couldn't enforce a code. When I first started playing I thought the HO was a perfectly valid thing to do. The overwhelming opinion of the better players here has convinced me that I should play to a higher level than than, and I don't HO even if I'm being shot at first.

I'll look into Axis and Allies- but that seems even emptier than EW.

Vudak · « **Reply #9 on:** May 18, 2007, 01:36:46 PM »

Look on the bright side, at least you found a fighter to shoot at. Most of the time I pop into EW and find a few bombers milkrunning strats.

The EWA is pretty much the best argument in the world that rank means nothing.

Hornet33 · « **Reply #10 on:** May 18, 2007, 01:42:59 PM »

Even though the EW arena normally has better fights due to the reasons you stated, there will ALWAYS be at least one guy in the mix that will do anything to protect his score. That's what you ran into. Top 25 guy was doing whatever he had to do to protect his ranking.

Personaly I hate people that fly for the score. The whole "look at me, I'm in the top 100" or whatever their score is, is in my opinion stupid. Who cares right??? Well they do and that's a fact and when you run into them, it makes for a not so fun night.

Challenge most of the top "aces" to a fair 1v1 and many won't accept the challenge. For a long time I wondered why this is, but I've learned that those guys only get their score by flying massive hours and only getting into a fight when they KNOW they have a big advantage. They pick off the easy targets and then run like hell if the danger to their score gets too great.

While I understand your frustration because I've been there myself, there is really nothing the community can do about it. Those people only see their score. A fair fight is a concept lost to them. Having a high ranking makes them feel good about themselves and the way they fly and fight shows the rest of us how much they NEED that high ranking to feel good about themselves.

Really the only thing you can do is pity the poor guy. He needs his kill. You don't. You only need the fight, good, bad, or a draw doesn't matter to you and that's a good thing. Keep flying and when you run into one of those poor sad people like that just remind yourself that your only in it for the fight, not the win.

FiLtH · « **Reply #11 on:** May 18, 2007, 01:55:08 PM »

Fellow P40E lover...

My advice is stay in the MA and take your licks. You will soon learn from your mistakes, know what other planes can do against you, learn how to counter it, and just get better over time.

As far as the guys who mostly use top end planes all the time, and who are high in score, they play for score. Its hard to get high in score without using the better planes although it can be done. Some people just hate to lose, so they want every advantage they can get. Dont let it bother you. Every once in a while you'll kill one of these guys, and that one kill feels better than all the losses combined.

fuzeman · « **Reply #12 on:** May 18, 2007, 01:55:34 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by toonces3
Just to clarify:
Finally, I disagree that the vets here couldn't enforce a code. When I first started playing I thought the HO was a perfectly valid thing to do. The overwhelming opinion of the better players here has convinced me that I should play to a higher level than than, and I don't HO even if I'm being shot at first.

That part really says more about you than a code the vets enforce, which I think they can't.
A vet can say this or that and its up you the receiver of the message to believe it and do it or to ignore it.

I ~~you for rasiing your standards.~~

Vudak · « **Reply #13 on:** May 18, 2007, 02:21:31 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by fuzeman

I ~~you for rasiing your standards.~~

~~Well said, Fuze. I second that~~

Morpheus · « **Reply #14 on:** May 18, 2007, 02:41:41 PM »

nah, i've been ho'd by some of the "best" and "nicest" in the game over the years. If you got a shot in the MA, take it. End of story. The days of knowing everyone in the MA by first name and having a tight knit community like there was years back, say... 4-5 ago, are over.

Now its a MMPFPS game. Not a bad game at all mind you... Just a bigger more commercialized game. Not so much like "home" anymore.But that's just me.