slashing attack

[df54]

what is ment by a "slashing style attack".

[Xasthur]

The way I understand it, you attack with superior speed to your opponent.

IE. you do not slow down and start turning with them.

An example of this is when you attack bombers or when you're in a fast/poor turning aircraft in a fight with a far superior turner.

Bomber slashing attack example:

Come in from their high 3 o'clock, 'slash' down, make a quick attack, quick 1 second burst and then extended and reposition for another slashing attack.

[Yknurd]

And don't attack from six o'clock.

[Oogly50]

or 12 o'clock... Because I'm eating lunch at that time.

[Mace2004]

Xasthur has it right.  In RL it's more common to refer to "B&Z" type attacks as slashing attacks.  The main point to a slashing attack is that you're not going to stay, instead you enter the fight at high speed, take your shots as you pass through and keep any maneuvering to a minimum to maintain your e.  You then exit the fight at high speed and use your speed to return to an altitude refuge or gain separation from the fight.  

I can give you an RL example.  We (a division of F-14's from VX-4) were engaged in a big furball with four Topgun bubbas (2 A-4 and 2 F-5) out over San Clemente island off the coast of San Diego.  While we were in the process of spanking the bubbas, we heard two "Fox 1, Fox2" calls on the radio and looked up to see two Naval Reserve F-4's screaming down from high altitude taking shots on whoever they could.  Rather than turning (the F-4 was not known as a "turning" airplane) with us they blew through the fight and raced away at 650kts to the west.  Everyone broke on the shot calls but then resumed turning and burning when the F-4's left.  A few minutes later we hear two "Fox 1, Fox 2" calls again and it was the same two F-4's but this time they were screaming along on the deck and zoomed up through the fight taking shots and then they headed off to the East and back to Miramar. (They had been in afterburner the whole time and were out of gas).  In the end, the F-4's got a total of 8 valid shots on those of us who had "dropped anchor" to turn fight so they could have killed all 8 of us in two passes.  This was a classic slashing attack.

[Bruv119]

" he slashes one way, he slashes the other way,  it's like connect 4 in dagger terms"


if anyone can tell me from what programme that is from I ~S~   you.

Slashing attacks are just high speed angled deflection shots.  You line them up scream at them split second on the trigger then go past pull up and ahead of the enemy then do it again.

[BaldEagl]

Originally posted by Mace2004
In RL it's more common to refer to "B&Z" type attacks as slashing attacks.

Right or wrong I make a distiction.  

I think of a B'n'Z attack as more of a one-time event, typically begining with altitude and followed by a zoom climb and a large extension.  While this may be repeated the time interval is relatively long due to the zoom climb and extension.

I view a slashing attack as a high speed repeated event with less seperation before reversal and not nessesarily containing a climbing element (although it may).  Relative to timing I see a slasher getting 3-5 passes in the time it takes a true B'n'Zer to make two.

Just my interpretation.

[lengro]

Awesome read, Maze!  

Originally posted by Mace2004
In the end, the F-4's got a total of 8 valid shots on those of us who had "dropped anchor" to turn fight so they could have killed all 8 of us in two passes.

How is such a result obtained - does a computer register missile locks and/or gun solutions with a high probability of a hit ?

Or is it some sort of estimate from a supervisor?

[Mace2004]

Originally posted by lengro
How is such a result obtained - does a computer register missile locks and/or gun solutions with a high probability of a hit ?

Or is it some sort of estimate from a supervisor?

In this case it's done by reviewing the HUD camera video.  A valid Fox-1 (AIM-7 Sparrow) requires a radar lock, the target to be within a good launch acceptability region (LAR), and good radar track for the entire time of flight of the missile.  The Fox-2 (AIM-9 Sidewinder) means the pilot has to have a good acquisition tone meaning the seeker is locked onto the target, the diamond had to be on the target meaning the seeker was actually locked on the target and not a cloud or flare (or your wingman) and the launch is also within the LAR.  Certain maneuvers such as a break turn with chaff/flares can defeat the missiles so there is some element of judgement involved.  Gun shots are a bit harder to judge and usually everyone agreed that you had to have the shot on video and the pipper had to be stabilized on the target for a certain period of time like 2 seconds.

There is also a system called TACTS (Tactical Air Combat Training System).  A telemetry pod is hung on a Sidewinder rail and the pod is tracked on a TACTS range.  This is the system you may have seen in TOPGUN (the movie) where you can see the entire engagement real-time or the aircrews can view the recording afterwards.  TACTS knows the correct parameters required and will score a "kill" or miss in real-time so dead guys can get called out of the fight.  It's a pretty cool system but there are a limited number of TACTS ranges.  The one we used most is at Yuma and there were additional ones on the West Coast at Fallon and Nellis, there wasn't one off SOCAL where San Clemente is.

[Mace2004]

Originally posted by BaldEagl
Right or wrong I make a distiction.  

I think of a B'n'Z attack as more of a one-time event, typically begining with altitude and followed by a zoom climb and a large extension.  While this may be repeated the time interval is relatively long due to the zoom climb and extension.

I view a slashing attack as a high speed repeated event with less seperation before reversal and not nessesarily containing a climbing element (although it may).  Relative to timing I see a slasher getting 3-5 passes in the time it takes a true B'n'Zer to make two.

Just my interpretation.

That can all be true, but B&Z tends to be more AH terminology that RL.  While B&Z is very descriptive of a certain type of slashing attack, typically any high-speed pass on a target where you don't intend to slow down and turn is a slashing attack.  Your comment about the length of time between B&Z runs is correct.  It happens all the time in AH but then it's also a sign that the attacker doesn't know what he's doing.  A proper B&Z, assuming you don't get a kill on an unaware target on the first pass, is to force the target to maneuver and bleed his e....or at least prevent him from gaining e.  When the attacker takes too long between passes he's allowing the target to get his e back while the attacker loses some e on each pass.  Properly done, the attacker should make his attack, get the necessary separation and immediately re-attack before the target can recover.  I like to fly the Hurri so have been the subject of these sorts of attacks far more than any other and I love it when an adversary takes his time re-attacking.  I can just fly around at 200-300 mph all day long doing occasional break turns and then re-accelerating followed by a short climb as the attacker keeps topping out lower and lower.  That's a fight I'll usually win.

[TequilaChaser]

I had typed up some more tips to throw in here right about same time Drunky had posted the other day........but got called away to work , so I copied it and saved it  to post later  

Originally posted by Yknurd
And don't attack from six o'clock.

 
sorry  for the delay.....this stuff I am posting is probably not much needed ....after reading the others replies and  helpful tips, but here goes....

Originally typed for posting on  June 10, 2007, 10:49:17 AM

I would also add....when coming in from  a higher alt off angle ( 2, 3, 4, 5 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 oclock....start from about 2k seperation....and as you roll in to your target, predict where he is going to be  by the time you get there.......don't forget that you will be increasing your E ( speed / kinetic energy ) as you roll in......this is to help you zoom out up and away ( extend ) to rebuild your E...  store some E by climbing  ( Alt / potential energy )

and use a long sweeping arc, rather than straight line at your target...... this makes it harder for bomber gunners to track you, it throws off their aiming because it takes more skill to lead if you attack in this way.....



as for attacking other fighters.you can do the same approach, it just takes time practicing.the idea is to be able to saddle up  with in firing range at the end of your long sweeping arc......regardless if you are just taking an off angle snap/deflection shot then zooming on by..

or if you are wanting to stay on point for more than a quick burst ( 1 second really is only good for cannon equipped planes....unless you are gifted with aiming....)

your opponent/target will have to work harder  to figure out how to avoid or counter your move, if you use this approach....verses using a slashing attack in a straight line.....

in either case, you must fly lead pursuit  with the straight line off angle slashing attack.....the long sweeping off angle slashing attack will use all 3 pursuit modes lag, pure, then finishing up with lead for the snap/deflection shot at the end........( hmm....let me go back to the saddle up part, you can saddle up from an off angle/out of plane angle for a short period of time...more than 1 second but prob no more than 5 seconds if you wanted to get technical about it ) ( this reference to saddle'ling up is different than to Saddle'ed up on dead 6 o'clock postion........)

at the end of each attack, use your speed to extend/zoom off at the opposite off angle as you had attacked, using a pitchback type maneuver to re-engage once you have extended out to around 2K distance

now as for Turning and Burning ( Stall Fighting / Angles Fighting ), and Boom and Zooming ( BnZ / High Speed attacking passes ),  and E - Fighting ( Energy Fighting )

I would like to mention this.......these terms are more about a particular fighting style instead of a Fighter Tactics..........

and Energy Fighting combines the best of both BnZ & TnB  in a more indepthed articulate approach ..and takes the longest to learn to use in game on an efficient level .......

well there it is, some more thoughts from me........

hope they are of use to some of you....  ~S~

[jeebusro]

I just had a few slash kills on bombers the other day and man, that doesn't get old....

[Yknurd]

Originally posted by TequilaChaser
I had typed up some more tips to throw in here right about same time Drunky had posted the other day........but got called away to work , so I copied it and saved it  to post later  
 
sorry  for the delay.....this stuff I am posting is probably not much needed ....after reading the others replies and  helpful tips, but here goes....


now as for Turning and Burning ( Stall Fighting / Angles Fighting ), and Boom and Zooming ( BnZ / High Speed attacking passes ),  and E - Fighting ( Energy Fighting )

I would like to mention this.......these terms are more about a particular fighting style instead of a Fighter Tactics..........

and Energy Fighting combines the best of both BnZ & TnB  in a more indepthed articulate approach ..and takes the longest to learn to use in game on an efficient level .......

well there it is, some more thoughts from me........

hope they are of use to some of you....  ~S~

That's exactely what I meant when I typed, "and don't attack from 6 o'clock."

All of it.  I was just more succinct.

[TexInVa]

Originally posted by Bruv119
" he slashes one way, he slashes the other way,  it's like connect 4 in dagger terms"


if anyone can tell me from what programme that is from I ~S~   you.

The Mighty Boosh