Lets add Air/Sea rescue to AH?

[tedrbr]

Originally posted by G0ALY
But as we know, game play is subject to change. What’s keeping us from letting this be included?

I understand that not all players would want to fly rescue missions, or wait to be rescued. But some would. So what is the harm in giving them this option?

Although coming from a hardware background, rather than software background, I would guesstimate that would be keeping us from this is:  
It's a lot of rewritten and new code, as well as development and testing time, to add a feature that has little existing supporting code in the existing game. That planes can have gunners or observers does not necessarily support the picking up of other pilots.  That's a lot of work for something of very dubious value to game content.  

* All for a very minor feature with very dubious game playability beyond the initial "it's new" threshold.  
* Only really useful if the pilot being "rescued" is down close enough to a spawn point or friendly base to make it practical to make an attempt.  
* Prone to griefing as players will post false "come pick me up" messages in Country hoping to lure someone on a wild goose chase, or a shade account luring a player to become an easy vulch, or bored rescuers or rescuees getting bored and .ef out of the "rescue" half way through and frustrating the other player involved.  
* Game Code would also have to differentiate between an observer and a passenger in various planes. You can join a player to observe his flying or become a gunner.  Planes that typically cannot carry a passenger, but can carry a non-corporeal observer in the game would be handled different than planes that could do both.
* The "in real life" value is dubious at best, since we don't have all the ground activity that was actually taking place on the battlefield.  Most of the planes in the game are not suited to picking up passengers, and I'm sure being picked up by plane would be desirable, or this whole concept becomes very limited to the reasonable range of a Jeep.   Downed players not at risk of being picked up by a patrol.  


Was BAT21 or Flight of the Intruder on t.v. again this past week?  We tend to get these posts after one or the other is on.

[dedalos]

I love it. Can you emagine Hub or Jaxxo bailing out and beging for me to pick them up.  I'd tell them Im on my way and then go for a smoke. muahahahahahahaha

I wonder how long they would wait crying for help

[Solar10]

Originally posted by thndregg
My squad would get real weary of rescuing me, lol!:rofl

There has never been a truer word typed in these forums.

[thndregg]

ROFLMAO!!!! Hahaha!!:rofl

[Feep25th]

nah u gotta put an old helicopter  to rexcue and they need to make it so u can et in and out of planes like you ordered one and it appaered in a hanger
'

and like a c47 u can walk around in like a map room

and more than 1 peerson as a gunner

that would be cool

[Feep25th]

nah u gotta put an old helicopter  to rexcue and they need to make it so u can et in and out of planes like you ordered one and it appaered in a hanger
'

and like a c47 u can walk around in like a map room

and more than 1 peerson as a gunner

that would be cool

[Treize69]

Just be able to .join a plane or vehicle within a certain distance (or in contact) would be a start.

Just treat the rider as a gunner/observer after the pickup. Planes gets shot down again, you die; make it home you keep your points.

[tedrbr]

Originally posted by Treize69
..... make it home you keep your points.

You DO realize there are ways to keep MUCH of your points, even if you DON'T get back to the airfield?

Keeping points is the worst reason for the idea behind SAR.

Death Multipliers
Landed____x 1.0
Discoed____x 0.25
Bailed_____x 0.5
Ditched____x 0.75
Captured___x 0.4
Killed______x 0.25
Crashed____x 0.25

If points are your thing, ditch or bail and get back into the air!  You will earn more points getting back into the air than you will sitting around for an hour or more begging for and waiting to be picked up and run back to the base.

Then of course we come back to the whole griefing thing this SAR idea is vulnerable to:  How do you prevent a person from posting fake "pick me up" requests, or telling a downed pilot you are On Your Way to pick him up, while laughing in you beer that the fool is sitting on the ground somewhere twiddling his thumbs?  Or the guy with a shade account luring a do-gooder out where he can get vulched or spawn camped?

So, how do you prevent griefing with this idea?

[Sweet2th]

Originally posted by Fulmar
And besides, at the going rate of friendly check six calls you probably would be better off running back to base a sector away

Thats just because of the country you fly for.

[blkmgc]

I like the idea. It may not appeal to the points mongers, or folks interested in rushing back to the furball,but it would sure add another element to the game that would be just as attractive to like minded folks. We used to do rescue missions in "another sim", picking up paratroopers or an assault team way behind enemy lines with a JU. Was fun as hell, especially if you made it out alive.

[tedrbr]

Instructions on How to Grief SAR-dweebs

country channel
Griefer: hey, i'm down and I need picked up
Griefee: where at?
Griefer: I'm at (bogus coordinates)
Griefee: otw
.... 15 minutes pass......
Griefee: i'm here. where you at?
Griefer: keep circling, i think i hear your engine. keep in text, my VOX is out. (meanwhile running in a mission elsewhere)
..... 5 more minutes......
Griefee: u see me yet?
Griefer: not yet, try further north.
Griefer continues to string along Griefee for as long as possible.


country channel
Griefer-Shade:   hey, I'm down near the X spawnpoint and need picked up, send a jeep!
Griefer-Shade's Prime account then spawn camps and kills several incoming Griefees in their jeeps.  


country channel
Unintentional Griefer or Griefee: hey, I'm here, where you at?
Response: Sorry, I joined the mission/ .ef cause I got bored with this.
Reply: You %$^#&# !  I spent a half hour blah blah blah......
......flame war, insults, squelching, and reports ensue....


This whole SAR idea can lead to griefing and abuse and I've not seen anything ever posted by HTC employees to indicate they would not see the same obvious problems in implementing such an idea.  

So proponents of SAR:  how do you prevent griefing of SAR participants?

[mentalguy]

How bout a .Rescue command that shows where the other person is on the map.

[tedrbr]

Originally posted by mentalguy
How bout a .Rescue command that shows where the other person is on the map.

Can still use a shade account as a griefer for bait, and he kills all responders with his prime account when you come to get him,... a little more effort on griefer's part to place the bait.

Or, monitor a country with a shade account, and spawn camp legitimate downed pilots if they appear close to a spawn point using the same means to find them.

Plus you are now getting away from SAR being an easy add  ...."and may require minimal coding since it uses existing game features."... that the original post suggested.  Essentially you are creating a .wingman command that will see individuals on the ground, in addition to being able to pick up a down pilot in another vehicle added to code, plus changes to the scoring system.

[475FG Savlan]

I posted this idea with scoring as an total afterthought, to be honest.  I could give a rats buttock about the score, but some do, so I included it into the idea.

My main goal was to suggest the idea of incorporating another form of wartime operations with the bonus of added gameplay & perhaps a new plane or two that also could be used for events.  The scoring was just an added incentive for those who care about that sort of thing.

Gv guys get another dimention to play.
Pilots get a fun diversion to try on occasion.
Score potatos can attempt to get that fraction more, if they care so much and are willing to wait.
History types get to recreate something they read/saw on tv.
The entire community perhaps gets a plane or 2 added to the sim with the additional purpose of being used in unique events unavailable in any other online sim.

A win win for almost everyone in the game...and those who dont like it can go along, buisness as usual.

Also, Ill state again that my idea never suggested that the downed pilot still get his name in lights. The only person I suggested get his name in the buffer would be the driver/pilot of the rescue vehicle itself. My suggestion was that the rescued pilot get a better score than a plain safe bail, but less than a good landing, being that he returned without his airplane.

As for greifers, I see this as a non issue.  
How do you prevent a person from posting fake 6 calls, or telling a downed tanker you are on your way to resupply him , while laughing in you beer that the fool is sitting on the ground somewhere twiddling his thumbs? Or the guy with a shade account luring a do-gooder resupply pilot/ ground vehicle out where he can get vulched or spawn camped?

All that stuff is possible in game now, for the anal wart that wants to attempt them.   Greifers have always been here, always will.

How do we prevent greifers?  We dont, as long as human beings are playing it. Not even the all mighty Hitech can code out greifing
 
Treat them as you would any currently annoying player.

As for coding difficulties, we can already attach as gunners to ships, planes both while in flight & on the ground, and as observers. I think the groundwork is in place & the coding could be done, if it was desired.

Basically, I see SAR as a improvement/addition to the whole concept of suppy/resupply.  You are just picking up & dropping off  players instead of dropping supplies or paras.  

Heck, add a liferaft loadout to the C47, and drop it in the nearest CV furball, watch guys swim for it, and watch others shoot the rafts! Make raft artwork based on the PT boat model, but wayyyy slower:)

I dont see the big deal, as all your examples of how this could be abused could just as easily apply to our current game situation with supply.
Guys right now could be told to wait in tanks for supplies that never come,
troops that never arrive, etc.  C47s could be sent by greifers to troop towns that arnt down, etc.

Aholes will be Aholes.

I saw this concept mainly to be used by guys who already play together - more squad types than lone wolves - although a rescue misson would be a great introduction to the game for a lone wolf newb, and a nice way to recruit for your squad

[Martyn]

I think it's a great idea. It'd be a good excuse for including Lysander, Storch, PBY, Sunderland, Vosper etc. later on - maybe. A Jeep/M3 could take Vehicle Supps on a GV mission and then, when empty, pick-up any friendly downed pilots and take them to the newly captured field - if they capture it and the Jeep survives of course.

It's a neat idea and has my vote.