Author Topic: Cherry picking is O.K.!!  (Read 3758 times)

Online waystin2

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Re: Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #15 on: October 02, 2007, 12:37:36 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by IronDog
I don't know why most people think cherry picking is a bad thing.Cherry picking is nothing more than good flying,and it should be applauded.Believe it or not most the good pilots in WWII got  most of their kills via cherry picking.Does never seen what hit them ring any bells?!It takes a lot of skill lining up a victim,running in,and then applying the kill shot,and getting out.rinse and repeat.Furballers create the pickers by doing just that.No furballs,no pickers.Do I enjoy getting picked...heck no,but I can appreciate the effort put in by the picker.I notice most the good furball pilots,are the most vocal when they get picked.Does (*&$#@! picker sound familiar? :lol.many of the aircraft in AH are made for picking,and not for furballing.Oh some of the better sticks can turn fight in a picker,but they aren't made for it.Next time you get picked,give that skilled picker a big !
IronDog

Now that I have a rough idea of what that is, I guess I would "cherry pick" given the opportunity.  I feel that a majority (IMHO) of MA battlers would do the same.  There are those who feel that their approach to the game is the only viable or real methodology, however it always seems to favor their strengths.  There is nothing wrong with this, we all (I assume) try to create or take advantage of situations that favor our skill level, plane, etc.  The pilots that complain the loudest about this, I think you will find they prefer 1 vs 1 type engagements.  Not that they cannot handle other setups as well!  As an admitted lowly recovering newb and working on my 3rd tour, I will take any kill shot when offered(except HO, which really is a Spitfire related decision).  My thought is don't hang it out there, unless you want it blown off.  I appreciate the chivalrous attitude, but it has no place in cartoon plane fighting.  Issue your salute to the guy that just smoked you, and adjust your tactics so it does not happen in the future.  A kill is a kill. If it's red, it's dead.
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Offline JimBeam

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Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #16 on: October 02, 2007, 12:44:34 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by john9001
P38's an P47's won't turn fight my spitty :cry :cry :cry


ill turn fight your spitty in either makes for a fun fight most the times i lose but dying is worth having a good fight to me in the cartoon plane world
JimBeam 367th "Dynamite Gang"

"In my experience JimBeam never goes down easy" -wil3ur

Pilots...looking down on people since 1903

Offline IronDog

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Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #17 on: October 02, 2007, 03:52:46 PM »
Geezus Skyrock your a school teacher,and you can't spell.Oh well Texas, halfwit,yah it makes sense LOL!!!

Offline Murdr

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Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #18 on: October 02, 2007, 04:06:46 PM »
Picking is a reality of the MA.  I can't see an argument for saying it is 'wrong'.  However, claiming picking takes skill is laughable.  By definition a picker is giving himself 2 to 1 odds or better.  Any effort load being placed on the picker is due solely to the skill of the outnumbered target plane, or lack of skill of the picker.

A picker is not looking for a fight.  They are looking for a kill.  Complaints only hit home when the picker knows they wouldn't stand a chance in a "fight" with the victim.

Offline 2bighorn

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Re: Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #19 on: October 02, 2007, 04:20:46 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by IronDog
I don't know why most people think cherry picking is a bad thing.Cherry picking is nothing more than good flying,and it should be applauded.Believe it or not most the good pilots in WWII got  most of their kills via cherry picking.Does never seen what hit them ring any bells?!It takes a lot of skill lining up a victim,running in,and then applying the kill shot,and getting out.rinse and repeat.Furballers create the pickers by doing just that.No furballs,no pickers.Do I enjoy getting picked...heck no,but I can appreciate the effort put in by the picker.I notice most the good furball pilots,are the most vocal when they get picked.Does (*&$#@! picker sound familiar? :lol.many of the aircraft in AH are made for picking,and not for furballing.Oh some of the better sticks can turn fight in a picker,but they aren't made for it.Next time you get picked,give that skilled picker a big !
IronDog


Dogfighting is just like sex, the longer, the better.
Cherry picking is like pleasuring yourself.

Your pick...

storch

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Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #20 on: October 02, 2007, 04:22:04 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Murdr
Picking is a reality of the MA.  I can't see an argument for saying it is 'wrong'.  However, claiming picking takes skill is laughable.  By definition a picker is giving himself 2 to 1 odds or better.  Any effort load being placed on the picker is due solely to the skill of the outnumbered target plane, or lack of skill of the picker.

A picker is not looking for a fight.  They are looking for a kill.  Complaints only hit home when the picker knows they wouldn't stand a chance in a "fight" with the victim.
word

Offline llama

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Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #21 on: October 02, 2007, 04:32:17 PM »
HiTech himself has said that the whole goal of this game is to piss off the other guy.

So now when I pick a juicy, target-fixated, "I'm-not-responsible-for-my-own-6-because-these-are-cartoon-planes" cherry, and then he gets all pissed-off and whiny on channel 200, I think to myself "Mission Accomplished."

Now don't get me wrong - I love a good turn and burn session (and actually, I really love trying to defend a base that's getting overwhelmed - lots of targets and good turnfighting despite lots of deaths, but I digress), but I really don't get the anti-cherry picking arguments much. Here's why:

(and this is longer than I expected - sorry in advance)

When someone complains about getting HO-ed all the time, most of the experienced pilots will say something like "It is easy to dodge the HO," or "You should be able to see the HO coming from a mile away and avoid it," or "You can use their HO attempt to your advantage." It is a matter of being aware of your surroundings and denying the HO shot, and if you can think far enough ahead, plan a countermove.

Getting picked is, to me, basically the same thing - the "pick-ee" isn't  completely aware of their surroundings, and they've chosen to engage a turnfight where their rear quarter is facing a potential picker at just the right time -- in other words, the Pick-ee isn't denying the Cherry Picker a good shot -- and in fact, they could be setting up a great shot inadvertantly. Good picker's go for "good targets," not just "any target" in the furball, and a good target is one that just isn't paying attention AND has chosen to start a poorly-planned turnfight.

I can't tell you the last time I've been picked successfully (just as how I haven't been successfully HO-ed in at least two months either), because you can deny the picker a good shot and/or make other targets in the furball look more attractive. Remember the joke about not having to outrun the angry grizzly bear, but just your chubby hunting partner, Fred? Well when you're in a furball with pickers orbiting around, if you make an effort to pay attention, you really can figure out which picker is ready to dive in, what direction they're probably going to go, and where they'll probably climb away. My goal is to NOT be there when they do, and if that means passing on the left-turning bogey 400 in front of me because it is going to drag me into the picker's path, then that's the thing to do. Honestly, someone else who doesn't see the danger can take that guy, and that's going to be the new cherry.

So, getting back to being the Cherry Picker instead of the Cherry. I sincerely believe it is possible to avoid being the cherry when in a furball - you just need to pay attention and look around all the time, and I mean ALL THE TIME, and avoid the danger zones. If you aren't doing that, or choosing not to do that, then why should I feel bad for shooting you down as the Picker? (Hint: I don't.)

And if you complain about it on channel 200 after I Cherry Pick you, please refer to the first line of this reply. "Mission Accomplished."

Learning to not be a Cherry is as important a skill as dueling, if not moreso since honest dueling normally only happens in the DA and denying the pick happens all the time, every day, in every other arena. It is a learned skill and much tougher than just whining about how you were the juicy Cherry, which is probably why we are seeing a lot of whining about it these days...

(Ducking and Covering already..)

-Llama

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Offline Speed55

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Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #22 on: October 02, 2007, 04:34:03 PM »
I'll take getting picked anyday, as long as i got the guy i was initially fighting, even if i see the picker barreling in.   Worse is to let the first guy go and avoid a pick, only to be killed by the guy  who's tail you were on.

The best, although it doesn't happen very often, is getting the picker to killshoot himself on the guy he's saving, then killing your intitial target.
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Offline shamroc

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HOOING PICKTARDS !!!!
« Reply #23 on: October 02, 2007, 04:35:44 PM »
If your personal goals are:
   - winning the war
   - getting a top score

...then, picking & ganging is the most effective way to do it.

Think of it as "sanitizing strategic airspace" via overwhelming firepower.

If, however, your goals are:
   - having good quality fights with like-skilled opponents
   - bettering your ACM skills to the top level
   - gaining respect from the AH player community in general

...then picking & ganging is definitely NOT the way to go.

Comes down to what you're looking to get out of the game, and what means
"fun" to you.

I'm of the opinion that players looking to win the war/score-race should stick to
the MAs, and players looking for good clean fights should stick to the
AvA or DA.

I don't judge or hassle either type of player - it's their dime.

Compromise solution - but I see it as the only way to make everyone happy.

I'm also of the personal opinion that there's certain skilled players out
there who are AFRAID to fight clean fights against like-skilled opponents.
They only look to fight LESSER skilled opponents using "Gentleman's Rules" as to
completely dominate them - and then subsequently get off on rubbing the loser's
face it in.

These are the types who Yell and Scream that everyone should fight via
"Gentleman's Rules", yet they never go into the AvA or DA for fear of
losing to other players close in skill to themselves.

You also have another breed of player who only cries "foul" when they
are a victim of picking/ganging - yet they partake in said activities
indiscriminately - which is why they only fly in the MAs.

It's a sad fact that the AvA and DA are almost always empty - it frustrates
me to no end.  I also deeply respect anyone who hangs out regularly in the
AvA/DA - they make the game fun for me. :)

Shamroc

Offline RedTop

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Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #24 on: October 02, 2007, 04:40:43 PM »
hehehehehe


Funny thread.
Original Member and Former C.O. 71 sqd. RAF Eagles

Offline falcon23

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Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #25 on: October 02, 2007, 05:19:25 PM »
Me and a few guys were discussing the other night about 262's and how they fight.Well,if I am wrong then please correct me,but basically a 262 is a glorified cherry picker?I mean,I have yet to see a 262 get in the middle of a fur-ball and turn fight..What I see is a 262 come zooming in,hit someone,and then fly out get their E back,then come ZOOOMMMING back in to get another kill or 2..

 So I guess my question:

 Is a 262 only an emergency cherry picker for whichever country is flying it??

                                                            Kevin

Offline MjTalon

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Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #26 on: October 02, 2007, 05:28:20 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by RedTop
hehehehehe


Funny thread.


agreed, got popcorn? :D

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Offline RedTop

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Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #27 on: October 02, 2007, 05:39:49 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by MjTalon
agreed, got popcorn? :D




Coors Light?
Original Member and Former C.O. 71 sqd. RAF Eagles

Offline Xargos

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Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #28 on: October 02, 2007, 05:49:22 PM »
This thread is like a thief telling you it's alright that he robed your house because he wiped his feet before he entered your home.
Jeffery R."Xargos" Ward

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Offline llama

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Cherry picking is O.K.!!
« Reply #29 on: October 02, 2007, 06:10:07 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Xargos
This thread is like a thief telling you it's alright that he robed your house because he wiped his feet before he entered your home.


I think it's very sad that you equate being cherry picked to being robbed.

Being robbed is a totally passive thing -- you aren't responsible (most of the time) if you are robbed. It is just bad luck of the draw.

I believe that being picked is NOT bad luck of the draw. It is due to the pick-ee being inattentive to their surroundings, either intentionally or unintentionally, and putting themselves in harm's way without regards for the consequences.

In other words, being robbed is a passive activity that you had nothing to do with. Being cherry picked is an active activity that you could have prevented, but didn't.

Two very different things. Two very different attitudes.

-Llama

Interesting server at 69.12.181.171