Author Topic: Invisible Mozzy  (Read 1350 times)

Offline WMDnow

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Invisible Mozzy
« on: November 03, 2007, 06:17:20 PM »
The Mosquito *SHOULD* be invisible to radar.

Offline DoNKeY

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« Reply #1 on: November 03, 2007, 06:28:26 PM »
Havn't seen this one in a while...

It's been asked for before, and the answer stays the same.  


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Offline Stoney74

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Re: Invisible Mozzy
« Reply #2 on: November 03, 2007, 06:49:27 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by WMDnow
The Mosquito *SHOULD* be invisible to radar.


Ok, I'll bite...Why?

Offline MjTalon

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Re: Re: Invisible Mozzy
« Reply #3 on: November 03, 2007, 07:17:33 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Stoney74
Ok, I'll bite...Why?



Think because majority of the plane was WOOD :D

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Offline Latrobe

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Re: Re: Re: Invisible Mozzy
« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2007, 07:55:46 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by MjTalon
Think because majority of the plane was WOOD :D


WRONG! it was made of TIMBER! oh wait that is wood. :o

Offline Stoney74

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Re: Re: Re: Invisible Mozzy
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2007, 08:30:58 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by MjTalon
Think because majority of the plane was WOOD :D


What, wood can't reflect radar?  It certainly can.  Birds in large enough groups cast radar returns.  Just because something isn't metallic doesn't mean it doesn't reflect radar.  More folklore.  The Mossie was successful because it was fast and particularly suited to its assigned role--not because it was "stealthy".

Offline Kev367th

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Invisible Mozzy
« Reply #6 on: November 04, 2007, 08:43:07 AM »
It was partially stealthy.
Not totally because it was made of wood, but also its shape.
German radar operators did experience difficulties in trackiing them.

Maybe not invisible to radar,  but how to implement a 'difficult to track' part in the game may be problematic.
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Offline Stoney74

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Invisible Mozzy
« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2007, 09:49:01 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Kev367th
It was partially stealthy.
Not totally because it was made of wood, but also its shape.
German radar operators did experience difficulties in trackiing them.


You got some sources where I can look this stuff up Kev?

Offline bozon

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Invisible Mozzy
« Reply #8 on: November 04, 2007, 10:03:24 AM »
Just the metal in the two engines is more than enough to compensate for the wooden spars and skin (which does reflect some radar). I also can't see what in its shape reduces radar signature. Sounds like a typical urban legend.

With the old radars, the difficulty to track it could be attributed to it flying in small formations and not in huge gaggles. If it flew low then yes it could be "invisible" and hard to track.

It also depends what "tracking" means. The way the air-war was controlled was with boards, where the markers were updated from time to time by the hand of people in contact with the radar operators. Saying that this is a slow and cumbersome is an understatement. The Mossies cruise speed was almost twice that of the bombers making the prediction of their current location more difficult. In order to intercept something which is as fast as the interceptors, the planes have to be directed with precision to cut the way of the target. If you fail to predict the correct interception point, the fighters will either never find the mossies (small formations and planes are harder to spot visually from a distance), or find themselves far behind in a long chase.
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Offline Karnak

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Invisible Mozzy
« Reply #9 on: November 04, 2007, 11:33:39 AM »
I agree with bozon.

I have seen this claim a lot, including in wartime comments, but I've never seen any tests that documented it.  I think it was/is wishful thinking.  Smaller numbers of faster, smaller aircraft are going to be naturally harder to track on the radar of the day.
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Offline Redlegs

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« Reply #10 on: November 04, 2007, 11:35:44 AM »
I looked to find anything about it being invisible to radar. But the best I could find was that was hard to track by radar and that it was "stealthy."
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Offline Spikes

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Invisible Mozzy
« Reply #11 on: November 04, 2007, 12:00:20 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Kev367th
It was partially stealthy.
Not totally because it was made of wood, but also its shape.
German radar operators did experience difficulties in trackiing them.

Maybe not invisible to radar,  but how to implement a 'difficult to track' part in the game may be problematic.


Maybe it showing up, then going away...etc etc.
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Offline Greebo

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« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2007, 12:17:58 PM »
Shortly after the war in Europe ended the RAF staged Operation Post Mortem. This involved a series of exercises to evaluate the German radar defences. Luftwaffe radar operators enthusiastically cooperated in the exercise and tracked simulated raids of up to 200 RAF heavy bombers and/or 30 Mosquitoes while supervised by RAF specialists.

One thing they discovered was that when there was no RAF jamming, high flying Mosquitoes could be picked up by German long range radar as far as 200km away. The stealth thing is a bit of a myth I'm afraid. It was the Mosquito's high cruise speed that made it a pain to intercept.

Source is the book "A radar history of WW2" by Louis Brown.

Offline Wmaker

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Invisible Mozzy
« Reply #13 on: November 04, 2007, 12:24:56 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Kev367th
It was partially stealthy.
Not totally because it was made of wood, but also its shape.



There is nothing in the Mosquito's geometry that I can see which would make it partially stealthy. Please do clarify, I'm all ears.
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Offline Masherbrum

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Re: Invisible Mozzy
« Reply #14 on: November 04, 2007, 12:47:21 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by WMDnow
The Mosquito *SHOULD* be invisible to radar.
You'd be incorrect in your request/misinformation.
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