Author Topic: F4U-1C vs GV's (Read 2748 times)

AquaShrimp · « **Reply #45 on:** January 02, 2008, 07:50:34 AM »

Bomb blasts did flip over panzers and panthers.

After D-day, as the allieds were advancing through France, the 8th Airforce knew that a Panzer division (or some large group) was in a certain French town. Hundreds of bombers bombed this town, and when the infantry advanced, they found tanks flipped over, german tank crews totally shell-shocked with busted eardrums and over-pressure injuries.

I believe I read this in Stephen Ambrose's "Citizen Soldier", or one of his other books.

lyric1 · « **Reply #46 on:** January 02, 2008, 08:50:07 AM »

I & Rogerdee have been working on a skin for a former p47 pilot who flew with the 358th f/g he said you could kill tigers with 50 cal's, how ever he says napalm worked best it sucked the air out of your lungs causing them to collapse & you suffocated & if you survived that you would then cook in the tank or as the tank crews tried to get out they burned. They liked napalm more so than bombs.

Larry · « **Reply #47 on:** January 02, 2008, 09:06:13 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by lyric1
I & Rogerdee have been working on a skin for a former p47 pilot who flew with the 358th f/g he said you could kill tigers with 50 cal's, how ever he says napalm worked best it sucked the air out of your lungs causing them to collapse & you suffocated & if you survived that you would then cook in the tank or as the tank crews tried to get out they burned. They liked napalm more so than bombs.

AquaShrimp · « **Reply #48 on:** January 02, 2008, 09:29:31 AM »

How dare you laugh at the fact that he thinks a ricochetting 50 caliber bullet could destroy a 50 ton tank!

Flayed1 · « **Reply #49 on:** January 02, 2008, 09:49:45 AM »

Lil late here but I have had exelent luck killing panzers with the 9-T. Just come in low at the rear and I can kill them in 3 or 4 shots if my aim is good. T-34's are tougher but I have managed to smoke the engine several times but never kill them and I don't think I've ever killed a Tiger this way.

I think the most spectacular panzer kill I ever did was when a panzer had parked in a fighter hanger and we didn't have any ord at the base so I got on the deck with my trusty 9-T, blasted the tank and flew through the explosion in the hanger... Wish I would have recorded that, I would have posted screen shots

I bet the tank driver was pissed.

Adonai · « **Reply #50 on:** January 02, 2008, 10:16:19 AM »

It was pretty common for allied fighters (mainly american) to leave some fuel in drop tanks incase they run across tanks simply dropping next to tank then strafe it, strafing a tank with 50 cal however im sure scared living crap outa the tankers.

Sketch · « **Reply #51 on:** January 02, 2008, 10:43:00 AM »

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Originally posted by Adonai
It was pretty common for allied fighters (mainly american) to leave some fuel in drop tanks incase they run across tanks simply dropping next to tank then strafe it, strafing a tank with 50 cal however im sure scared living crap outa the tankers.

Those things bounce like a crazy when they hit the ground... not really knowing where they are going to land would make it hard to judge where to drop them...

E25280 · « **Reply #52 on:** January 02, 2008, 07:41:40 PM »

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Originally posted by E25280
Probably won't get Rifle's film until tomorrow.

I got one film from Rifle. It is actually of him in the MA killing a panzer with the Yak. Again, he uses a low angle and appears to shoot for the engine box.

After thinking about it, I know I have killed panzers with the 37mm HE on an osti (usually I die long before I can get close enough, but it has happened on occasion), so the fact the Yak can kill them should not have been such a surprise after all.

Quote

Originally posted by Slash27
Thanks for the testing El Target. Any luck killing a Tiger with it?

We didn't actually do any testing against the Tiger.

The Panzer and Ostwind have only 12-15mm armor on top, and 20mm armor in the rear. Given the Panzer can be killed from the rear, we can assume the Sherman with 19mm armor on top and the T-34 20mm could also be killed with well placed shots from above. The Tiger has 25mm on the top. I wonder if that would offer just enough protection to keep it safe?

(Armor values from this site that someone posted a while back.)

AquaShrimp · « **Reply #53 on:** January 02, 2008, 10:22:43 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Adonai
It was pretty common for allied fighters (mainly american) to leave some fuel in drop tanks incase they run across tanks simply dropping next to tank then strafe it, strafing a tank with 50 cal however im sure scared living crap outa the tankers.

Chuck Yeager and his wingman dropped their droptanks with fuel in them with the purpose of seeing if they could get them to explode. They strafed the droptanks until they were out of ammunition, but they wouldn't burn.

MYTH BUSTED.

Source: Chuck Yeagers biography "Yeager".

lyric1 · « **Reply #54 on:** January 03, 2008, 07:35:08 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by AquaShrimp
How dare you laugh at the fact that he thinks a ricochetting 50 caliber bullet could destroy a 50 ton tank!

Well my post is based off some facts & as I said it came from a former jug pilot not us cartoon warriors. I think I would take the word of this man who was there & flew such missions & risking his life. You can snicker at me & my post I don't mind that, how ever you discredit the like's of this man who served with courage & distinction & great honour. He says you could kill a tiger with 50cal's I am not going to second guess him. Should you? http://www.p47pilots.com/P47-Pilots.cfm?c=incP47BiographyHome.cfm&vm=BIO&pilotid=80&p=Joseph%20P.%20Celauro

DREDIOCK · « **Reply #55 on:** January 03, 2008, 07:56:09 AM »

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Originally posted by lyric1
Well my post is based off some facts & as I said it came from a former jug pilot not us cartoon warriors. I think I would take the word of this man who was there & flew such missions & risking his life. You can snicker at me & my post I don't mind that, how ever you discredit the like's of this man who served with courage & distinction & great honour. He says you could kill a tiger with 50cal's I am not going to second guess him. Should you? http://www.p47pilots.com/P47-Pilots.cfm?c=incP47BiographyHome.cfm&vm=BIO&pilotid=80&p=Joseph%20P.%20Celauro

Its relitively easy to discredit these bogus claims as the only way he would know if he managed to destroy the tanks he strafed would be if he landed and went to see if they were distroyed.

I doubt very much he was able to tell how much damage he did while traveling at several hundred miles per hour while trying not to hit the ground.
not to mention trying to avoid any return fire that would have been comming up from the ground.

Because unlike us cartoon pilots. If he screwed up. he didnt have the luxury of being able to immediately re-up another cartoon aircraft.

lyric1 · « **Reply #56 on:** January 03, 2008, 08:47:52 AM »

He has confirmed kills on tanks. Although I don't know if he killed tigers him self in this fashion I didn't think to ask him that. I will the next time I speak with him, I asked could you kill tigers using nothing but the eight 50's on a jug he said yes but napalm was the best way to kill tanks.

Urchin · « **Reply #57 on:** January 03, 2008, 09:09:23 AM »

Then he is wrong.

Can't really argue with physics, and the armor penetration values of a .50 caliber round are well documented.

lyric1 · « **Reply #58 on:** January 03, 2008, 11:12:42 AM »

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Originally posted by Urchin
Then he is wrong.

Can't really argue with physics, and the armor penetration values of a .50 caliber round are well documented.

Well let me ask you this then. Can p47's destroy & sink a Geman destroyer with 50cal's alone? Lets see who knows the answer to that one. So lets for a moment presume the answer is yes if you can sink a destroyer with it's amour & it is many times thicker than a tanks & not to forget all the AAA that a ship like this would throw up at a air attack would you at least concede that a tiger tank could meet the same fate?

Lusche · « **Reply #59 on:** January 03, 2008, 11:46:12 AM »

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Originally posted by lyric1
Well let me ask you this then. Can p47's destroy & sink a Geman destroyer with 50cal's alone? Lets see who knows the answer to that one. So lets for a moment presume the answer is yes if you can sink a destroyer with it's amour & it is many times thicker than a tanks & not to forget all the AAA that a ship like this would throw up at a air attack would you at least concede that a tiger tank could meet the same fate?

Comparign apples & oranges.
Destroyers are actually not armored better than a Tiger, which has ALL of it's components protected by a thick armored shell.
The absence of AAA doesn't improve the physical ability of a .50cal round to penetrate armor.

(What's the point in producing heavy tanks when they are pierced by mere machinegun bullets?)