Participants in SNAPSHOT, "A Milk Run", post comments here:

[Buzzbait]

S! all

Please post comments on event and problems or positives regarding this event.


                  Thanks Buzzbait

[fdiron]

Just flew in the snapshot "Milk Run". I think it should have been renamed "Allied Blood Bath". Every single B17 was destroyed within 5 minutes of being engaged by Luftwaffe 190s and 109s.
REASONS FOR BEING SHOT DOWN-

Now some may say that the reason that all of the bombers were shot down because of the less than adequate fighter escort. I do agree that some of the P47 escorts did not do their job properly, but alot of them did, they stayed high and helped the B17s.

The main reason for every single U.S. bomber being shot down is LAG. In huge formations, the lag makes gunnery near impossible. My b17 was destoyed by a 190 that appeared to be 1.9k away. It then zoomed from 1.9k behind me to 2k ahead of me in about 1 second. Kaboom, my bomber is dead. I joined as a gunner on another b17. Lag was still very bad. (I have a cable modem btw and an AMD 1400mhz puter with geforce 2). This time I got hits on a 190. This is because so many of the bombers had been shot down that the lag was getting better. Lets all be glad that the brave men who flew and crewed B17s in real life didnt have lag....

POSSIBLE SOLUTIONS-
Will post this in allied forums, cant let those luftwaffles read it.

[Manedew]

have a tape of how bad it was; yell if you want it.

[Buzzbait]

S! Manedew

I may need the tape for the guys who are going to run BIG WEEK.

If you can hold on to it I'd appreciate it.


             Cheers Buzzbait

[ra]

fdiron,

I was one of the laggy 190's, and believe it or not the lag works both ways.  I rolled over and set up a very steep attack on a B-17 on the edge of the formation only to have it warp way out in front of me.  I had to pull out of my dive and saddle up on his 6 to make my attack.  At that point the lag probably saved me from his guns, but it had also saved him from my initial steep attack.  

This crowded sky lag has always been a problem, you can even see it when you are flying in close formation. Until the net code is beefed up to handle so much close activity we will never be able to simulate a large formation attacking another large formation very well.

I think all the B-17s would have died anyway.  The 190's were loaded for bear and we kept a good tight formation behind Zigrat all the way to the main bomber formation.  The escorts never got to us until after we had each made at least one pass.

ra

[fdiron]

Yeah, lag is a major problem.  I dont know if the B17s would have all gotten shot down or not if lag wasnt a factor.  My personal best is 5 kills in a b17.

[Specterx]

I think that some of the 109 drivers had 30mm cannon... I've never seen B-17's explode (and I mean blow the hell up) so easily in the MA, it seemed as though all the LW had to do was look at them to cause em to blow.

It was also sort of disorganized... I was the USAF CO so it was partly my fault, but in general the snapshot events seem to consistantly be rushed. I think that you really need to have a well-defined cutoff point, after which no more players will be admitted, and then allow 5-10 minutes for planning, setup etc. People seemed to have a problem with staying close to the buffs... I kept telling the escorts not to let the 109's pull them off, but most had other ideas.

I got 5 LW in any case  

[Specterx]

P.S.

Can we get the results?

 

[fdiron]

You did fine specterx. I dont think even the tightest formation in the world would have saved us.  I was d50 from your wing when my plane exploded.  I guess the main fault lies with the server.  Lag just made gunnery unbearable.

[Buzzbait]

S! all

Here is the AAR for ‘A Milk Run’:  (bad name, should have been called 'A Blood Run'   )

Total USAAF flyers:  37 plus a few late joining gunners

Total Luftwaffe flyers:  26

Luftwaffe Kills and Assists:


11-24-01 14:27:18,Animal,Kill Awarded,Mighty1,P-47D-11
11-24-01 14:31:20,AKLarry,Kill Awarded,FDiron2,B-17G
11-24-01 14:33:00,Nilsen2,Kill Awarded,Goner,B-17G
11-24-01 14:33:46,SELECTOR,Kill Awarded,Awulf,B-17G
11-24-01 14:33:53,Pei,Kill Awarded,CSMC,B-17G
11-24-01 14:34:01,Wigwam,Kill Awarded,jpeg,B-17G
11-24-01 14:34:02,Soviet,Kill Awarded,ingy40,B-17G
11-24-01 14:34:03,Flittt,Kill Awarded,Gabbers,B-17G
11-24-01 14:34:19,SiggiAH,Kill Awarded,Sunchasr,B-17G
11-24-01 14:34:34,AKLarry,Kill Awarded,Redx,P-47D-11
11-24-01 14:34:40,RA,Kill Awarded,chunder,B-17G
11-24-01 14:34:40,Pei,Assist Awarded,chunder,RA
11-24-01 14:34:43,SELECTOR,Kill Awarded,Rompa,B-17G
11-24-01 14:34:43,Zigrat,Assist Awarded,Rompa,SELECTOR
11-24-01 14:34:49,Zigrat,Kill Awarded,Krusher,B-17G
11-24-01 14:34:55,Shorty,Kill Awarded,axle,B-17G
11-24-01 14:34:55,Flittt,Assist Awarded,axle,Shorty
11-24-01 14:34:57,Flittt,Kill Awarded,Vruth,B-17G
11-24-01 14:34:57,Shorty,Assist Awarded,Vruth,Flittt
11-24-01 14:35:37,Martell0,Kill Awarded,ygsmilo,P-47D-11
11-24-01 14:35:40,dawvgrid,Kill Awarded,BuzzR,B-17G
11-24-01 14:35:40,BLUEmako,Assist Awarded,BuzzR,dawvgrid
11-24-01 14:35:40,Shorty,Assist Awarded,BuzzR,dawvgrid
11-24-01 14:35:40,Flittt,Assist Awarded,BuzzR,dawvgrid
11-24-01 14:35:40,MBirdCZ,Kill Awarded,anRky,B-17G
11-24-01 14:35:40,RA,Assist Awarded,anRky,MBirdCZ
11-24-01 14:35:40,BLUEmako,Assist Awarded,anRky,MBirdCZ
11-24-01 14:35:40,Shorty,Assist Awarded,anRky,MBirdCZ
11-24-01 14:36:13,SiggiAH,Kill Awarded,Ripsnort,P-47D-11
11-24-01 14:36:13,Martell0,Assist Awarded,Ripsnort,SiggiAH
11-24-01 14:36:26,airmess,Kill Awarded,thirty,P-47D-30
11-24-01 14:36:42,AKLarry,Kill Awarded,Yukon,P-47D-11
11-24-01 14:37:05,Martell0,Kill Awarded,KidFury,P-47D-11
11-24-01 14:37:05,JoeCrip,Assist Awarded,KidFury,Martell0
11-24-01 14:37:05,Soviet,Assist Awarded,KidFury,Martell0
11-24-01 14:37:05,SiggiAH,Assist Awarded,KidFury,Martell0
11-24-01 14:39:16,Nifty,Kill Awarded,seabat,P-47D-11
11-24-01 14:42:21,DC,Kill Awarded,Furzy,P-47D-11
11-24-01 14:42:25,Soviet,Kill Awarded,Spectrex,P-47D-11
11-24-01 14:42:25,RA,Assist Awarded,Spectrex,Soviet
11-24-01 14:42:25,AKLarry,Assist Awarded,Spectrex,Soviet
11-24-01 14:42:45,RA,Kill Awarded,ManeTMP,P-47D-11
11-24-01 14:44:13,Soviet,Kill Awarded,Piedra,P-47D-11
11-24-01 14:44:21,AKLarry,Kill Awarded,Blitz,P-47D-11
11-24-01 14:44:29,Animal,Kill Awarded,raff,P-47D-11


Total Kills:  

15 B-17G  (That’s every B17 which upped)
         
13 P-47D11
1 P-47D30  (how the hell did that get into the mix?)

Leading Experten:

AKLarry:  1 B17G, 3 P-47D11 kills, 1 assist on P-47D11

Soviet:  1 B17G, 2 P-47D11 kills, 1 assist on P-47D11

USAAF

11-24-01 14:32:36,jpeg,Kill Awarded,Charge,Fw 190A-5
11-24-01 14:33:34,Furzy,Kill Awarded,Nilsen2,Fw 190A-5
11-24-01 14:34:40,Awulf,Assist Awarded,chunder,RA
11-24-01 14:34:43,Spectrex,Assist Awarded,Rompa,SELECTOR
11-24-01 14:34:48,Spectrex,Kill Awarded,SELECTOR,Fw 190A-5
11-24-01 14:34:51,Spectrex,Kill Awarded,Zigrat,Fw 190A-5
11-24-01 14:35:26,ygsmilo,Kill Awarded,Vespa2,Bf 109G-6
11-24-01 14:36:26,LHodo,Kill Awarded,Wigwam,Fw 190A-5
11-24-01 14:36:26,jpeg,Assist Awarded,Wigwam,LHodo
11-24-01 14:37:02,Blitz,Kill Awarded,MBirdCZ,Fw 190A-5
11-24-01 14:37:10,Buzzbait,Kill Awarded,airmess,Fw 190A-5
11-24-01 14:37:18,Blitz,Kill Awarded,Pei,Fw 190A-5
11-24-01 14:37:18,ManeTMP,Assist Awarded,Pei,Blitz
11-24-01 14:38:05,Blitz,Kill Awarded,Flittt,Fw 190A-5
11-24-01 14:38:15,Spectrex,Kill Awarded,BLUEmako,Fw 190A-5
11-24-01 14:38:15,ManeTMP,Assist Awarded,BLUEmako,Spectrex
11-24-01 14:40:39,MonZuma,Kill Awarded,JoeCrip,Fw 190A-5
11-24-01 14:40:49,Spectrex,Kill Awarded,airbull,Fw 190A-5
11-24-01 14:42:06,ManeTMP,Kill Awarded,SiggiAH,Bf 109G-6
11-24-01 14:42:06,MonZuma,Assist Awarded,SiggiAH,ManeTMP
11-24-01 14:42:12,LHodo,Kill Awarded,Martell0,Bf 109G-6
11-24-01 14:43:01,raff,Kill Awarded,DC,Bf 109G-6
11-24-01 14:43:01,Piedra,Assist Awarded,DC,raff
11-24-01 14:44:00,Blitz,Kill Awarded,dawvgrid,Fw 190A-5

Total Kills:

13 190 A5’s
 4 109G6’s

Leading USAAF Ace/Gunner:

Spectrex:  (Gunner) 4 190A5 kills, 1 assist on 190A5
Blitz:  (Fighter)  4 190A5 kills


Thanks all for your patience...
 

[Buzzbait]

S!

By the way...

Obvious Luftwaffe victory.  Not even counting  the points for all those B-17's, the bombers didn't even make it to target.

Have to see what we can do about the lag for BIG WEEK.

                Cheers Buzzbait

[Vruth]

I was flying slot position #3 in the B17 formation.  

Because of LAG, I was not able to aim my guns at any target.  I'm on a T1 here, and the 190's were hopping and appearing out of no where.

Seriously, with that many B-17s in close formation, there should been decent defence but all nmy fighters (even some b-17s) were warping all over the place.

I couldn't get a bearing on any nmy fighter and as a result, gave up and awaited my fate - poof.  

I hope this is not repeated for the Big Week.  Either HTC increases their bandwidth, or have a seperate server to host it.  Today's SNAPSHOT was not fun.

---------------

http://www.13thtas.com

 vruth@13thtas.com  

Dem's fighten words!

[Buzzbait]

S!

My mistake, Spectrex was flying a P-47D11.

[Goner]

well, i'm new to AH so i have no real experience here with lag and it's effects ...
but to me it seemed a matter of buff-tuff (if that's a setting in AH as it was in AW) ; i didn't even get a chance to fire, saw a 190 coming at me, jumped to upper turret, waited for him to get in range and hardly got a shot off when he did ... 2 or 3 pings and i was dead. that's not what i'm used to in the MA ... B-17's are thougher.
also if it was lag, why did the LW not have problems getting hits ??

Goner - Bloody 100th

oh, btw ; other planes in the formation and the attackers were not really warpy for me ... AMD 1Ghz, GeForce2 MX, 56k modem from the other side of the pond  

[ 11-25-2001: Message edited by: Goner ]

[Goner]

Originally posted by Buzzbait:
Here is the AAR for ‘A Milk Run’ ...

can players also get this info from the host ?

Goner