Air Force ROTC

[DoNKeY]

Hello everyone. 

For the past while, I have been throwing around the idea of joining the Air Force ROTC program when I go off to college.  I'm still reading up on it, gaining as much information about it that I can.

My question is if anyone here has gone through, or is currently apart of the A.F. ROTC program?  I know my greatest source of information will be their main website, or perhaps someone at a recruitment office, but I was wondering if anyone who does have experience with it has anything that they would like to share, or feel that I should know. 

I know that this will be a HUGE commitment, probably one of the most important decisions I will make in my life, and potentially alter my life a lot if I do go through it, which is why I am seriously debating this decision and throwing it around, but I don't want to rule something like this out, as my love for flying and everything associated with it has been a very big part of my life, and joining the military, even though the chances of becoming a pilot aren't great, is something that interests me.

So, if anyone has experience in this, and has something that they would like to share, I'd appreciate it a lot.

donkey

  

[Yenny]

1% of the cadet become pilot. I saw this stats some where but I couldn't remember. Depends on how bad you wants to fly or how good you are in school. Army is good place for chopper pilots. Navy and AF are good for fix wings. Send me a msg in the game and I'll give you a brief on it if you like.

Yenny.

[Saurdaukar]

If you want to fly, forget a BS ROTC program, go Marine Officer Candidate School.  They will *guarantee* you an air contract prior to you making any commitment.

Best deal for an O aspiring to fly the unfriendly skies in any US service.  If you pass all the tests, are accepted into the program and make it through training, your problem becomes "I hope I get jets" instead of "I hope they don't stick me in a tank."

[Saurdaukar]

Duplicate.

[Anaxogoras]

A life-long friend of mine did AF ROTC at UC Berkeley and made a pilot slot.  Now he flys a block 50 F-16C.  No kidding.   Even if you make it to pilot training, a lot of cadets washout and end up flying cargo planes or something even less glorious.

He's a busy man, but if you send me a pm I'll see if he can answer some of your questions.

[toonces3]

Here's my take:

I've done a few different routes to the cockpit- Navy ROTC, Marine OCS, and Navy OCS.

I started in Navy ROTC, with a 3-year guarantee.  Get a 3.0 first year out of pocket, the next 3 years are on the Navy.  When I was in my second semester I met with my class advisor to go over my grades and stuff.  He asked, "What do you want to do in the Navy?"  I answered, "Fly jets."  He said, "Well, with these grades you're going to be driving ships."  Basically, in Navy ROTC (and I imagine AF ROTC isn't too much different) your grades determine your rank.  Higher your grades, higher your ranking.  When it comes time to pick 'jobs' the start with the #1 guy and give him his choice.  Then the #2 guy and give him his choice.  And so on.  When they get to you, you pick what you want and if there's still slots available, you get it.  Otherwise, you get something else.  I wonder what slots go first in the Air Force? 

So, if you want to drive planes, and go the ROTC route, you HAVE to do well in school in order to be competitive for a job you want.  If you are a C student, I guess you better plan on doing something in the USAF besides flying.

For me, I got a 2.98 GPA and had the option of paying to stay in ROTC or drop out.  I dropped out.

Fast forward a year.  I went to the Marine recruiter, took all the tests, got an air slot (1 of 2).  All set with an OCS report date.  2 months before Quantico I get the call..."Yeah, uh (Toonces), one of our air slots got pulled so I have to put you on a ground contract.   But, hey, don't worry about it.  When you get to Basic School you can compete to get an air slot instead...."  Turns out that's about a 1 in 100 chance.  So I did my first 6 weeks of OCS, and when it came time to go back for the second part I declined.  I had no desire to drive tanks.

Fast forward another year.  Senior in college, still want to fly jets.  Call the Navy recruiter.  "Hey, I want to fly jets."  He says, "Well, we need jet pilots, come on down."  Took the tests, got accepted into the Navy as a pilot and after graduation reported to Pensacola and proceeded to get my wings. 

So, here's the bottom line.  ROTC is a great program that will pay for your college and offer you a guaranteed job making decent money, and you will learn a skill that will be useful somewhere for something.  You also can get the GI Bill in the military which might not seem like a big deal now, but a few years from now when you're looking at getting a masters, the GI Bill is great to have.  I used it to get a masters degree.  The downside of ROTC is that it is sort of mickey mouse business, and it sort of drags out the whole military indoctrination process for 4 years.  It's a bit of a pain, alot of silly things you have to do. 

If you're goal is, like mine, to fly or else, then I don't think ROTC is necessarily the way to go.  Sure ROTC gets you in the front door, but you have to really kick bum in school in order to be competitive for a pilot slot.  I was a horrible student, so leaving ROTC was definately the right call for me. 

OCS, Navy or some other branch, is a safer option if you're goal is only to fly.  The downsides are that you won't know if the military is hiring pilots until you've missed your chance for ROTC.  Also, you'll have to pay for college.  Also, you'll still have to do well enough in school to have a competitive application for OCS.  Of course, you can go to OCS for something besides pilot, but then you've sort of wasted the chance to go ROTC in the first place.

Either way, there are no guarantees.  You are doing the right thing by considering your options carefully.  It all really depends on what your goals are in the military and in life.  I think the military is a great deal.  I've been very lucky and I have no regrets.  I'm facing about 2 of the next 3 years away from my family starting next year, so it's not all happy times, but overall I think the military has alot to offer, besides just getting to fly cool planes.

Good luck!

[Yenny]

Also on another note. Depend on whether you want to be fix wing or rotary. You have a much higher chance to fly helicopters for the army. Your grade will be the #1 determination in your ranking in the OML in nation. There are a few other factors involved but mainly your grade will play the most important role. I went with Army ROTC and this was what I did.

I went to a community college for two years then transfered to a 4 years. The reason I went to a two years is when you transfer into a 4 years ALL your GPA from the two years reset back to a 4.0, so you start your junior years in the university with a 4.0 . That's a HUGE advantage over  other cadets that straight into the 4 years because if their grade took a pounding due to too much drinking in the 1st two years they can still reset it. Once I transfered I choose an easy major (Law enforcement) to keep my GPA in the upper 3.7. For the army the "branch or job within the army" selection took place at the end of your junior years. With a 3.7 gpa I was within the top 20% cadet in the nation. When you're in the top 20% bracket you guarantee your branch of choice, so whatever you want in the army you get it.

Now if you're not within that top 20% you have another choice. I forgot what it's called, but basically you give in 2 more extra years in service for your branch of choice. With that your active duty time went from 5 to 7. Usually top 30% of army cadet will get their aviation slot. In the army the #1 choice is infantry, #2 is armor, #3 is aviation. The chance of flying chopper in the army is much higher then other branches.

The financial side of this is pretty easy. You can get a tuition, books paid for. You can get a 2 years scholarship if you're a transfer, or a 4 years if you decide to jump straight into a university. I'm a newly commissioned Lt. so all these stuff I still remember pretty well. Send me private message if you likes to know more other details etc.

Yenny

[BaldEagl]

I really can't tell you anything about the military or ROTC as I never served but my nieces husband just retired last week from the Air Force as a Colonel at about 40 years old.  Not a bad deal.  They did move an awful lot and he got back from an extended tour in Iraq a year or so ago during which time the family was apart (they have 2 young children) but all in all I think they thought the military was just fine.

They are "retiring" near an AFB where he thinks he can work either part or full time.

[68Dougal]

I'm currently finishing my junior year in Army ROTC and can confirm what Yenny wrote above, with some minor corrections. Right now, it is the top 10% on the national OML who get their first choice. The OML takes into account more than just your GPA, however. GPA is 40% of the total score. Another 40% comes from your evaluation at LDAC, a month long evaluation camp that you attend in the summer before your senior year. The other 10%, I believe, comes from your school commander's evaluation of you.

The other choice Yenny referred to is called the ADSO (Active Duty Service Obligation), which is actually a 3 year commitment that you can sign to guarantee your branch choice, location of first assignment, or fully paid graduate school. If you want aviation, though, you have to sign another ADSO once you get into flight school that adds another 6 years of active duty (they're spending a few million bucks to train you and they want to keep you). So, if you ADSO for branch and then get aviation you have a minimum 13 year obligation. There are also a few back doors into aviation, so it's almost guaranteed that you'd eventually get into the cockpit.

Army ROTC is definitely the best deal going right now. The Army wants people, so to get a full scholarship you basically need to do no more than pass the PT test and keep your GPA above 2.5 (obviously, though, to get what you really want you need to do much better than that). Many schools will also kick in money for room and board. Plus you get the chance to attend schools like Airborne, Air Assault, Mountain Warfare, and Sapper school.

From my observation it seems pretty difficult to get a scholarship from the Air Force or Navy ROTC, and even harder to get a pilot slot, but if you have the grades and are set on flying jets, then obviously either of those would be a better choice than the Army.

But remember, there's nobody cooler than an Army Aviator.

[Whitten]

Well if you really want to be an Air Force pilot or navigator as opposed to a Marine, Navy, Army, or Coast Guard pilot, then you have a much better chance of getting a slot through AFROTC as opposed to OTS or similar commissioning programs. Though of course it is not guaranteed and you won’t know what job you’ll get until you’ve already committed to serving at least four years in the Air Force after graduation. But you can take your chances and if you don’t get a slot then after your 4 or so years you can possibly migrate over to another branch and see if they’ll let you fly.

Grades are a very important determining factor for whether you’ll get your first choice job via AFROTC. But the other things that are considered are your AFOQT score, how your commander ranks you in comparison to your peers (i.e. top cadet, 2nd, 3rd, etc), and your physical fitness test score. There are other criteria they look at as well but these are probably the most important. 

A ROTC detachment officer can tell you what’s involved in the selection process better than I can so when you go on your next college visit call ahead and set up an appointment to meet with one of the detachment officers; that’s what I did and they told me a lot of valuable information that can’t be found by just browsing the internet.

However if you’re dead set on flying anything for any branch then both the Marines and the Coast Guard can guaranteed you a flight slot. In the Marine Corps you can get it through the PLC program and the Coast Guard has something called the Blue 21 Flight Initiative Program.

Hope this helps

[Dragon]

GPA is 40% of the total score. Another 40% comes from your evaluation at LDAC, a month long evaluation camp that you attend in the summer before your senior year. The other 10%, I believe, comes from your school commander's evaluation of you.

Great information all of you, my son, LilDragn is currently enrolled in high school Navy ROTC program and is set of flying a jet.  I don't think he was aware of how important grades are. 

The total from above is 90%.  Maybe 50% for grades?  Just wondering.
 

[Brooke]

What about being a National Guard pilot?  How does that work?

[68Dougal]

The total from above is 90%.  Maybe 50% for grades?  Just wondering.
 

Doh! Now you know why I'm in the Army. I meant 20% for that last one. It's actually a composite of everything you do in ROTC at school. Over the 4 years (or 2 if you're a transfer student) you get many evaluations, PT test scores, ROTC classes, etc. All of these are factored into an OML made by the battalion commander that ranks each cadet. This, I think, then makes up 20% of the national OML.

Extra points are also added for some things like community service, Army schools (Airborne, etc.), and college & ROTC related extracurriculars. When considering that 0.1% can separate a hundred or more people, these extra points can be huge.

Of course, the Army being the Army, the only thing that's really guaranteed is that nothing is really guaranteed. I've heard of people who just missed the top 10% getting their 13th branch choice, and people down in the 75% region getting their first choice. It's really up to the "needs of the Army".

[Yenny]

btw dougal GL w/ LDAC lol, that camp sux =p. You might see me on some committee down there.

[DoNKeY]

Well, there's no Air Force ROTC program offered at my school, and there aren't any 'cross town' programs either, or whatever they call them.  The only one offered is the Army ROTC, which I'm really not sure about, so right now it's not looking good 8(.

donkey

PS:  Thanks for all of your help guys.