Author Topic: Clearer Communication in the MA  (Read 13972 times)

Offline hubsonfire

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #15 on: June 23, 2008, 05:56:46 PM »
I have this suspicion that it will never occur to him that the problem is his, and not everyone else's.
mook
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Offline Ack-Ack

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #16 on: June 23, 2008, 06:00:11 PM »
 Don't try to apologize or rationalize away uncooperative and rude radio etiquette to me with "make believe" excuses.  If they didn't know I was inbound with a C-47 the first time, they darn sure should'a responded differently the second time I was shot down trying to reach the same base.  Guess what. A repeat of the first incident.  
  Only on the third attempt did I manage to deliver the supplies, and the ONLY reason I succeeded was because the two nme planes had expended all their bullets on the bananas hiding under their own flak and we're outbound back to their base to rearm.  I got ZERO communication support from anyone during the entire episode.
   Here's the ONLY irony in the situation..  Once the Ord was restored the bananas were able to take the fight to the nme, knock out two factory complexes and capture the enemy air base consolidating the island.  Which was the reason why the supply drop was so urgently needed in the first place.
   The whole situational awareness routine is getting old.  By the time a C-47 SEES an LA-7 he's DEADMEAT..  and you bananas darn sure know it.  The only way a C-47 can EVADE an LA-7 is if it gets a warning and can turn away before the LA-7 identifies him.
   Sure you can be childish and refuse to communicate.   I could be childish too and just fly somewhere else.  Or else sit in a Flak gun on the field WITHOUT shooting at the nme planes and enjoy watching you bananas die, because you have no ordinance to fight back with.  The whole time, I could be sitting on the ground throwing "CHECK" SIX up at you and work on your situational awareness for a while.  That sounds like something you would do.  I don't play like that though, because it RUINS the game for everybody.  

Situational Awareness is your sole responsibility and no one else's.  If you can't be bothered to check your own six (it's easier to check 6 in a C-47 than it is on a fighter so you don't have an excuse how it's hard) then why should I take the time to watch yours when I have my own to watch? 

Remember the old saying, 'When you're pointing a finger at someone, you have three pointing back at you." 


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Offline whiteman

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #17 on: June 23, 2008, 06:02:33 PM »

  Often while playing in the Main Arena I try to make contact by voice and text with other players and I get no responce.  Just dead air and empty text.  I know these players are actively engaged in the game, because I can see their blips flying around on the screen.  Yet they refuse to communicate or can't be bothered with it.
 
This lack of respect for proper communication etiquette is extremely frustrating and adversely effects the game play of the flier needing to communicate.  I'll give you an example.

  You're flying airfield supplies into a base where the radar is down and you're trying to find out what kind of opposition you are facing.  You can see half a dozen of your countrymen flying directly over the base and getting ZERO responce.  The next thing you know, you got an nme Typhoon shooting down your C-47 while your heretofore silent and too busy to be bothered countrymen holler "CHECK 6" ! "CHECK 6" !

  Lemme tell all of you something.  If you're too #*^#ing busy to warn me about the nme Typhoon at 5K over the base, I sure as heck don't need to hear your stupid #*^#ing "CHECK 6" warning either.  I can tell from the flames and the sound of the bullets hitting my C-47 I've got an nme plane shooting at me.  But I suppose some people can't pass up the chance to get in some sarcastic humor.
  This hasn't happened once or twice.  It happens repeatedly in the MA and it happens no matter what country you fly for.  This behavior is boorish, childish and completely below the standard of professionalism expected of a combat pilot (even in a game). 
   

CTRL+Z, and start a new account with a different in game name.

Offline NoBaddy

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #18 on: June 23, 2008, 06:14:19 PM »
CTRL+Z, and start a new account with different game.

Now THIS is great advice!!!! :aok
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Offline Widewing

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #19 on: June 23, 2008, 08:29:53 PM »
I can't blame others for what I didn't notice. I'm responsible for me.

On the other hand, it seems like I'm constantly giving verbal warnings to friendlies in the area, or a check six if there is excessive radio chatter. Because I'm quick to offer warnings, I get lots of warnings in return. With rare exception, I am already aware of the enemy, but I always say "thanks" anyway as it isn't someone's obligation to watch my six. It is a courtesy, and I appreciate it.

I give the most warnings when I'm in a Wirbel or an Ostwind as I have a better view of the situation around me, and thus can see something developing that the guys flying may not yet detect. In a similar fashion, I can direct someone to my location where I can shoot the attacker off his tail if need be.

Speaking of communication, team work breeds communication. As an example, I'll see a town flashing near an enemy spawn. I go there and investigate. If there is a significant vehicle attack under way, I ask for assistance on country channel. Most of the time, a few guys respond. I talk with them and organize a coordinated defense. Some will roll tanks, others launch aircraft. Within minutes you will find that players will cooperate, spotting for ground assets or drawing fire to give a teammate a clean bomb run. When my bombs are gone, I'll fly as a FAC, giving detailed accounts of what and where the opposition is, guiding planes and tanks to the enemy. Once the others have a good concept of the situation, I'll rearm.

You can be a leader without issuing orders. You will never be a leader if you spend much of your time whining. Complement your teammates for trying, not just for succeeding. Don't give them grief if they screw up. Instead, encourage them to try again. "You'll get 'em next time."

Being a team player goes a long way to developing a relationship where teammates know that you will try to get them out of trouble if feasible. That doesn't mean diving into a horde trying to save someone with poor judgment. It means providing advice before the mistake is made. Offering help if needed, without be presumptive. That requires paying attention, having good situational awareness. Don't think that you're a Field Marshal, directing people to do your bidding. Trust me, you're not an expert. Even if by some strange quirk of fate, you are; no one cares. This is recreation, not the military. Been there, done that; not interested in putting up with it in my spare time.

Be an asset, not a liability. Be polite. Don't berate others if they don't play the way you would like them to. It's their "nickel". Don't complain about things unless it's an overt breach of etiquette. Every country has its share of dorks who will shoot wingless aircraft or run their mouth endlessly. These guys don't get warnings or a check six. They don't deserve the courtesy. However, the bulk of the players are good guys trying to have some fun, and they will respond to courtesy and respect.

Think of it this way; it's like peeing in the pool and complaining about the water being yellow.

Just because you elected to fly a C-47 into a base with a big, red DARBAR, don't expect people to cover your mistake. You have to accept the consequences of your decision, not complain about their decision to attend to their own issues. Run in an M3 instead. I run supplies to beleaguered bases all the time. However, I don't hope that someone will come to my rescue. In that regard, I opt for the M3, which is rarely detected by enemy aircraft. C-47s are big, fat targets and difficult to protect. I've killed many a C-47 that had escorts. They could do nothing.

It doesn't matter which country you are flying for, there is little difference if any. We have strat players, horde hounds, lone eagles, aces and the helpless. What all of them have in common is the desire to have some fun. If you as a player enhance that, add to the fun or help them enjoy themselves, everyone will be glad you are on their team. It seems to me that to accomplish this, even in the smallest of terms, you need to change the way you think. If you're having issues with lots of folks, you need to realize that the only sure-fire constant in every situation is you....

My regards,

Widewing
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline stephen waldron

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #20 on: June 23, 2008, 09:09:26 PM »
  Nobody inflight can be held "responsible" for knowing what enemy planes are vulching a base he's flying towards if the radar is down.  That kind of "Situational Awareness" simply DOESN'T EXIST.  Unless you happen to be GOD, or, you're playing on TWO computers simultaneously.  Because you'd literally have to be in TWO places at one time.  The only way you get that kind of information inflight, is from OTHER players in text or vox who are already at the base.  So the argument about players being SOLELY responsible for their OWN awareness is complete rubbish.  It's FANTASY.  And anyone who's played the game for more than one hour knows it.
  See that's the problem with the way you guys respond to complaints.  You just make up unreal, unbelievable stuff and post it like it's the gospel with a few choice insults thrown in.  Then you wonder why other players don't take anything you say seriously. 
  I already know why you want my game i.d.  So you can post my score and other comments in other forum threads and do all kinds of childish nonsense in a vain attempt to change the topic so you can try to conceal your IGNORANCE from the forum.  Been there. You already done that in other threads.  STAY ON TOPIC OR STOP POSTING OR YOU WILL BE REPORTED TO HITECH.   

Offline Ack-Ack

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #21 on: June 23, 2008, 09:25:38 PM »
  Nobody inflight can be held "responsible" for knowing what enemy planes are vulching a base he's flying towards if the radar is down.  That kind of "Situational Awareness" simply DOESN'T EXIST.  Unless you happen to be GOD, or, you're playing on TWO computers simultaneously.  Because you'd literally have to be in TWO places at one time.  The only way you get that kind of information inflight, is from OTHER players in text or vox who are already at the base.  So the argument about players being SOLELY responsible for their OWN awareness is complete rubbish.  It's FANTASY.  And anyone who's played the game for more than one hour knows it.
  See that's the problem with the way you guys respond to complaints.  You just make up unreal, unbelievable stuff and post it like it's the gospel with a few choice insults thrown in.  Then you wonder why other players don't take anything you say seriously. 
  I already know why you want my game i.d.  So you can post my score and other comments in other forum threads and do all kinds of childish nonsense in a vain attempt to change the topic so you can try to conceal your IGNORANCE from the forum.  Been there. You already done that in other threads.  STAY ON TOPIC OR STOP POSTING OR YOU WILL BE REPORTED TO HITECH.   


If you take off from a base and head to your target completely blind then you have no one to blame but yourself for flying into the kind of situation you described.  It's your fault, no one else's.  Then to demand that someone else be your eyes because you refuse to open yours is silly at best.  All you have to do is ask over vox "hey, any bogies over field XX?" or "Hey, I've got a plane full of drunks, can you CAP town?" works wonders.  I have yet have anyone not answer me when I ask those questions, might want to ask yourself why no one responds to you when you ask.

And please, report me to HTC.  I'm sure will all the work they have they can use a chuckle or two your reporting will generate, though you may have to foot the bill for monitor clean up expenses.


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Offline hubsonfire

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #22 on: June 23, 2008, 09:26:57 PM »
Speaking of concealing ignorance, you are doing a really poor job with yours.
mook
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Offline Widewing

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #23 on: June 23, 2008, 09:45:09 PM »
  Nobody inflight can be held "responsible" for knowing what enemy planes are vulching a base he's flying towards if the radar is down.  That kind of "Situational Awareness" simply DOESN'T EXIST.

Sure it does.. Even without dot dar, you can see the darbar, can't you? Situational awareness extends beyond limit of your sight. One has to examine the map and draw basic conclusions. No one can reason for you, you must reason for yourself.

 
Quote
Unless you happen to be GOD, or, you're playing on TWO computers simultaneously.  Because you'd literally have to be in TWO places at one time.  The only way you get that kind of information inflight, is from OTHER players in text or vox who are already at the base.  So the argument about players being SOLELY responsible for their OWN awareness is complete rubbish.  It's FANTASY.  And anyone who's played the game for more than one hour knows it.

I've been playing for many years. I can usually determine if the field is hot without asking. You can too if you assume responsibility for your own survival.

Quote
  See that's the problem with the way you guys respond to complaints.  You just make up unreal, unbelievable stuff and post it like it's the gospel with a few choice insults thrown in.

If you have a legitimate complaint, people will respond accordingly. Your complaint is without merit. It's your own fault....


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Then you wonder why other players don't take anything you say seriously.

I don't wonder any such thing. Neither do any of the others.
 
Quote
I already know why you want my game i.d.  So you can post my score and other comments in other forum threads and do all kinds of childish nonsense in a vain attempt to change the topic so you can try to conceal your IGNORANCE from the forum.  Been there. You already done that in other threads.

People have suggested that your problem is your own doing. You just don't care for the answers. Tough luck...

Quote
STAY ON TOPIC OR STOP POSTING OR YOU WILL BE REPORTED TO HITECH.

By all means, feel free to report the posters to HTC. However, inasmuch as the ice supporting you right now is as thin as cheesecloth, I wouldn't make a deliberate effort to draw additional attention to yourself from HTC.

My regards,

Widewing
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline hammer

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #24 on: June 23, 2008, 09:45:17 PM »
  Nobody inflight can be held "responsible" for knowing what enemy planes are vulching a base he's flying towards if the radar is down.  That kind of "Situational Awareness" simply DOESN'T EXIST. 
Simply not true. While you won't know exactly what planes are there, just a little bit of in-game experience along with some common sense can give you a good idea of what is happening at any base on the map. If your base is flashing, there is anywhere close to even red and green dar-bars, and the friendly dots are clustered around the base, you can bet your paycheck the base is capped. That means you are going to run into enemy on the deck with other enemy coming in with some altitude. You can estimate how high those planes might be coming in by how far away the nearest enemy base is and doing a little math. If you need more help, here is a writeup on situation awareness. The author, I might add, is one of my favorite people. :D

Regards,

Hammer
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Offline stephen waldron

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #25 on: June 23, 2008, 09:46:09 PM »
  I tell you what. Let's try an experiment instead. You claim someone can practice situational awareness in a situation they haven't arrived at yet.  O.K.  So you give me the names of five shoppers who will be a WalMart in Slidell, Louisiana at 11:00 PM tonight.  Right now.  I'll go there at exactly 11:00 PM and page them on the intercom and ask them to come to the customer service desk.  You already know how many of them are going to show up...  ZERO.  But we'll give it a shot since you're so sure you're right.
  Next I'll give you all day and all night Tuesday to "practice" you're situational awareness skills.  And we'll have another go at it 11:00 PM tommorrow night. And we'll see just how long you're going to continue with this INSANE argument.    
  There's no way a pilot enroute to a base with the radar down can know before he gets there what opposition he will encounter, without using a radio to call someone else who's already there.  I don't care how much you practice.  That's why they put radios in airplanes.  Now that IS on topic.
  

Offline hammer

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #26 on: June 23, 2008, 09:50:59 PM »
You will find mostly La-7s, Typhoons, Spit-16s, and P-51s. Anything else will be rare and encountered in 1s or 2s. I have now told you what to expect at any base you go to.

You're welcome.

Regards,

Hammer
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Offline Widewing

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #27 on: June 23, 2008, 09:56:41 PM »
  I tell you what. Let's try an experiment instead. You claim someone can practice situational awareness in a situation they haven't arrived at yet.  O.K.  So you give me the names of five shoppers who will be a WalMart in Slidell, Louisiana at 11:00 PM tonight.  Right now.  I'll go there at exactly 11:00 PM and page them on the intercom and ask them to come to the customer service desk.  You already know how many of them are going to show up...  ZERO.  But we'll give it a shot since you're so sure you're right.
  Next I'll give you all day and all night Tuesday to "practice" you're situational awareness skills.  And we'll have another go at it 11:00 PM tommorrow night. And we'll see just how long you're going to continue with this INSANE argument.     
  There's no way a pilot enroute to a base with the radar down can know before he gets there what opposition he will encounter, without using a radio to call someone else who's already there.  I don't care how much you practice.  That's why they put radios in airplanes.  Now that IS on topic.
 

Stephen, I don't know exactly what the density of your cranial matter is, but I suspect we could coat spent nuclear fuel rods with it and safely bury them under a playground.

Use the link Hammer provided...


My regards,

Widewing
« Last Edit: June 23, 2008, 09:58:40 PM by Widewing »
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline angelsandair

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #28 on: June 23, 2008, 09:58:36 PM »
Consider this, for a moment. Most of the MA population right now is just as clueless as you are (although at least some of them have the capacity for learning and rational thought, traits you obviously lack), and relying on them to babysit you is going to (hopefully) result in your being bitterly disappointed every single time you log in.


Stephan, I don't know exactly what the density of your cranial matter is, but I suspect we could coat spent nuclear fuel rods with it and safely bury them under a playground.

Use the link Hammer provided...


My regards,

Widewing


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Offline SD67

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Re: Clearer Communication in the MA
« Reply #29 on: June 23, 2008, 10:50:45 PM »
What's that noise? :noid
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