Tell me about 190s

[PFactorDave]

I'm a few months into my AH2 "experience" and I have noticed that here on the BBs the better sticks are pretty darn knowledgeable about the various strengths and weaknesses of most aircraft models.  So, I decided a few weeks ago to start flying models that i don't have much time in, in the interest in learning their capabilities.  Over the last few weeks I have upped various 109s and read what I can find about how to fly them.  I'm by no means a good 109 stick, but I feel that I have benefited from the experience.

Well, that said, I thought that I might get some time in the various 190 models during this up coming tour.

I'm hoping that a few of you guys with more skill will give me a quick run down and/or any pointers etc for flying the 190s.

I'm curious to hear your opinions and impressions of the different models and how they compare as well as any general tips and techniques for getting the most from the 190s.  Also, any good films will be greatly appreciated.

Thank you in advance. 

[Motherland]

The 190 is known as, and most commonly known used, a cherry picking boom and zoom plane. Why? Well, because that's what it's good at. You generally don't 'fight' in 190's, you 'kill' in them. I've said that the 109 is a fighter and the 190 is a killer. No fancy stuff, just get in, fill the enemy full of holes, and get out, fast.
However, if you want to close-in fight in the 190, keep some things in mind;
Never, ever, ever turn it. The 190 is the worst turning single engined a/c in the game.
The 190 has one of the highest roll rates in the game, try to use this to your advantage.
It has below average sustained climb and acceleration, but great zoom climb and E retention.

[trotter]

Fight in the 190's as if you are fighting on the inside of a straw. IE don't spend time in the horizontal.

Don't be discouraged by the poor over the cowling visibility for setting up shots. The shots will come, but don't compromise a good alt advantage by nosing down for too long to set up a shot. The 190 is in trouble when low and slow.

That said, don't be afraid to hang on the prop a bit (especially in a D9 or A5) when roping a bandit. The Dora (D9) will climb very well in most MA altitudes, and in general the 190's have enough armor to take a few pings from a roped foe that is quickly running out of E. Use flaps at the top of the vert to get the nose back down quicker.

[moot]

Fast roll rate as best asset = fast direction changes =  it pays off big time to have reflexes and make decisions as quick as possible.

[BaldEagl]

First of all, understand the difference in the models.

190A-5: Best turner of the group and probably the lightest.  Like the D-9, only two fuel tanks.

190A-8: Best gun package of the group and thus the best buff hunter.  An extra fuel tank offers extended range, it's heavily aromored and can really take a beating but is, along with the F-8, the slowest of the group.

190D-9:  Among the fastest aircraft in the game.  A pure B'n'Z fighter.

190F-8:  Performance similar to the A-8, the F-8 is the best ground attack plane of the family.  The bomb and the rockets are deadly to GV's.  Don't fire the rockets until the GV has just passed out of sight under your nose.

Ta152-H:  Among the best high-alt fighters in the game.  Very fast over 20K, good gun package and glides forever if the engine quits (It's prone to radiator damage).  The 152 is slowest in a dive (you need to keep it in the 450 range where the others are good for 600+).

That said there are many similarities among them:

Keep the 190 fast whenever possible.  The common "It can't turn" wisdom is false.  You can flat-turn for ~540 degrees before it starts to lose speed and you have to exit.  When turning, never turn so hard that the stall buzzer sounds.  That said, if you sense the other pilot isn't as good as you, you can dump as many as all three notches of flaps and go for it.  The first set will engage at ~175 mph.  If you start to lose ground, pull the flaps in, hit WEP to extend, then turn back and re-set the fight.  I wouldn't do this until you have quite a bit of experience though.  The 190's, particularily the A-8, have a nasty snap-roll when slow that will auger you if you don't feel it coming.

Use the 190's incredible (best of any plane) roll rate to rotate your lift vector for instantaneous changes in direction.  The 190's dont climb that well sustained, but are among the best zoom-climbers with a head of steam.  Use this, along with your roll rate to fight in the vertical rather than sustained horizontal turns.  A zoom climb with a 180 degree roll at the top and a reverse back down will score you a lot of kills (this also works great in the 109K-4 BTW).

Defensively, if you've gotten yourself into trouble and have air under you, a defensive spiral or a straight dive will often get you clear.  Not many planes will hang with you at 600 mph.  If your stuck on the deck with someone saddled-up, then a flat or rolling scissors are your best bets.  Unless the opponent knows what he's doing, you can often force an overshoot or bring it to a nose to nose fight where you can get a high forward deflection.

Good luck.  The 190 is an awsome plane once you learn to fly it.
 

[BnZ]

Some random D9 thoughts:

Its an E fighter vrs everything, an angles fighter vrs. nothing but another 190. Winning maneuvering fights will usually involve having or getting a energy advantage, no ifs, ands or buts.

Find the right mission for it.

Upping from a capped base to tnb among the trees? Not so much.

D9 is a great jabo interceptor, with its climb, speed, dive, and accurate firepower. Remember, if you get them to skin ords and turn, mission accomplished, no matter whether you get them or not.

D9's WEP replenishes faster than any other aircraft I've flown. Must be the big radiator. More on that later... Run the WEP hard and use the climb rate to get above incoming if you have to.

Buff hunting is a little trickier. It can climb quickly to most MA altitudes. OTOH, it has a radiator that likely WILL be shot out if the buff can get in even a few pings. If you buff hunt much in the D9, you'll learn now to glide/nurse birds with holed radiators back to base. Avoid any and all HOs like the plague for this very reason.

The primary strength of the guns is their positioning. The 13mm MGs are cowl-mounted, the 20mm Cans are close together in the wing root (They are synchronized to fire through the prop arc.). This concentrates alot of fire with minimal convergence issues. You can learn to ping straight-and-level targets at 500 yards with them.

Remember, in offense or defense, you CAN bloody well turn in the right range of speeds. That means if that Runstang is trying to dive away at 450mph, go ahead and run him down, cut throttle, and saddle up long enough to get the kill. That means that if are tooling along at 375 and a Spit dives on you, don't panic. You are still fighting at a speed where you maneuver well enough. Go ahead and go a little nose down, cut the throttle, hit a barell roll or a descending spiral. Your faster E-bleed will do the trick.

[Vudak]

The 190 is one of those planes that just about no one "goes for it" in.  You can use that psychology to your advantage.

It's not fantasy to think you can beat a Spitfire in a knife fight with one, assuming you surpise the heck out of him with an aggressive merge.  Miss the first snapshot, however, and you might not get another chance.  The nice thing is, with the firepower you're packing, if you hit that snapshot, you're golden.

Seeing how you're so new, I suppose it's wrong for me to go and tell you that ^, but since you're eager enough about learning to post, I'm assuming that's where you'd like to wind up some day.  There's only one way to get there: keep trying.

(It should save you several hours worth of premature climbouts if you went into the TA with a buddy for the first several hundred tries, however).

[Yenny]

For turnfighting the D9, watch out for its snaproll. If you pull back on that stick suddenly at any speed you'll roll it right into the ground. I have snap roll the D9 at 400 knts before and auger when I try to pull hard to get out of a dive. It snaproll at almost any speed, but it's easier to snaproll when you are doing 200 knts while trying to turn. I tried to turnfight the D9 but not very successful at it. I can usually hang on for about 1-2 min with a spit turnfighting it but I usually don't win.

Your best defend in a D9 otd tnb is that roll rate, which can be use to dodge rounds as the enemy try to get a snapshot at you in the scissor. In the D9, try to keep it off stalling speed, it won't roll right as well at low speed (such as under 100 knts). To counter that you gotta kill throttle to roll right.

If you love the D9 as much as me, try to BnZ it. It will get frustrated if you tnb the D9 and die a gazillion of time. It's good to push its limit and see how far it goes, so you know the plane. It just get old after a while. D9 is probably one of the best BnZ plane out there, plenty of rounds. It handles very well at high speed. It's the 4th best climber to 10k. Killing stuff is very easy in the D9, but staying a live in it is a challenging task. You'll find yourself getting chase by 2-3 turnfighter planes all the time.

[PFactorDave]

So I've been upping some 190s yesterday and today.  Mostly the 190A8 simply because ENY was blocking the D9 today.

I've also started reading what I can on the 190s.  I noticed on Soda's site that he suggests taking the 4 20mm gun package rather then the 30mm package.  I'm curious to hear what some of you guys think on the matter.  I've been flying with the 30mm package but am wondering if I might be better off with the 4 20mm guns instead.  My gunnery skills, shall we say, are still improving, and I wonder if the 30mm guns are a bit wasted on me at this point.

Thoughts? 

Thanks in advance.

[BaldEagl]

I always take the 2x20/2x30 package.  Never leave home without them

[Lusche]

I never take the 30mm gun package. 4x20mm is enough firepower to shred any target while having longer firing time. Also I avoid problems due to the very different ballistic properties of 20 and 30 mm cannons that way.

[Motherland]

I usually take 2x 20mms unless I'm buff hunting.

[PFactorDave]

Discovered the 190A5 this evening.  Got a few kills pretty quickly with it, it felt good.  I'm told that the A5 is a bit more "turny" then some of the other 190s.  Is this impression correct?  It certainly feels more "turny".  What are the biggest drawbacks with the A5?

I've posted quite a few kills in a Mossie and I actually like flying A20s also, I wonder if the 190A5 is somewhat similar in flight cxharacteristics to these two heavier craft.

Just tossing out ideas here.  I find that BBS discussions like these can actually provide a great deal of info.

Thanks in advance.

 

[BnZ]

Keep in mind, while the A5 turns best of the all the 190s, it still turns worse than just about all aircraft that are not 190s.

This means that you stand a decent chance of pwning a lesser Jug or Pony pilot in a pure turn fight, and not much else.

Pirouette and low-yo yo can get you shots people don't think are there sometimes though, because they are "out-turning" you.

Discovered the 190A5 this evening.  Got a few kills pretty quickly with it, it felt good.  I'm told that the A5 is a bit more "turny" then some of the other 190s.  Is this impression correct?  It certainly feels more "turny".  What are the biggest drawbacks with the A5?

I've posted quite a few kills in a Mossie and I actually like flying A20s also, I wonder if the 190A5 is somewhat similar in flight cxharacteristics to these two heavier craft.

Just tossing out ideas here.  I find that BBS discussions like these can actually provide a great deal of info.

Thanks in advance.

 

[DoNKeY]

Also try these sites.

http://gonzoville.com/ahcharts/index.php
http://members.shaw.ca/soda_p/models.htm