Author Topic: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident  (Read 2466 times)

Offline CAP1

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #60 on: July 14, 2008, 11:56:29 AM »
I am not against people riding motorcycles.  I've done it and its a blast.

However, the facts are that you have virtually no protection in the event of a crash, and you are much more difficult to see. (and thats when you are obeying the speed limit...if you are speeding and zipping in and out of traffic you are virtually impossible to see). 

The old saying about there being two kinds of motorcyclists is way too true.  If you ride them long enough (more than a month) you probably will lay it down.

For me its a personal choice.  I choose not to ride because I consider the risk to outweigh the benefits.  (Do a google news search with the keywords 'motorcycle accident' and you'll see why)

riding since i was 26(46 now).

been to florida 3 times, maryland a few times, deleware, ny, pa, conn, and not been down a single time

knocking wood as  hit the send key
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Offline Ripsnort

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #61 on: July 14, 2008, 12:03:28 PM »
I've been in one motorcycle accident. I bought another bike after it was totaled. (I was fine except beat up pretty badly on the skin)
Then I married an ER nurse. (The stories she told were horrific) After we married, I sold the bike, doubt I'll own another one. She rode with me a few times, mainly up to Mt.Rainier (the loop)
The older one gets, the more mortal they feel.

Offline Maverick

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #62 on: July 14, 2008, 12:30:25 PM »
First point. The folks injured were not at fault just because they rode a motorcycle. The person at fault seems to have been first impaired and secondly ran a red light. Both of those situations are illegal,  riding a motorcycle is not. FWIW there are more folks killed in automobiles than on motorcycles. Pedestrians also don't fare well when hit by cars running a red light either. I suppose we should also ban crossing the roadway on foot in a crosswalk so no one gets hurt there.  :rolleyes:

Second point. You can train all you want, demand mandatory performance re certifications annually if you wish. That will not stop someone getting STUPID in traffic between testing and re testing. Training is not proof against negligence only the person's desire to drive properly does that. The person will drive just like they are supposed to while being evaluated or observed then proceed to get stupid again when they think no one is watching them. Ever notice folks driving slower and more carefully when a Police car in near by?  :huh

Thirdly saying that this is a US problem is also disingenuous. Having seen footage from the many cameras in GB it's obvious that there are PLENTY of idiots there even given the reduced number of licensed drivers. This is a situation endemic to all locations that have folks driving on the roadway not just the US.
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Offline REP0MAN

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #63 on: July 14, 2008, 12:46:42 PM »
The amount of "Driving on a Suspended License" tickets I write would make any argument about 'regulating' a m00t point. You can suspend privileges, put people in jail and revoke their license altogether; doesn't mean they will comply. In our area, it's getting to the point where we write a ticket for this once jail-able offense, tow the car and send 'em walkin. Only ones who get the chrome bracelets are the habitual offenders (5+ times) and they can bond immediately. No mandatory stay in the pokey like DUI or Domestic Violence carries.

Regulate all you want, the jail is still overcrowded, understaffed and underfunded. Plain and simple.

:aok
Apparently, one in five people in the world are Chinese. And there are five people in my family, so it must be one of them. It's either my mum or my dad. Or my older brother, Colin. Or my younger brother, Ho-Chan-Chu. But I think it's Colin. - Tim Vine.

Offline 68Wooley

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #64 on: July 14, 2008, 12:49:28 PM »
Thirdly saying that this is a US problem is also disingenuous. Having seen footage from the many cameras in GB it's obvious that there are PLENTY of idiots there even given the reduced number of licensed drivers. This is a situation endemic to all locations that have folks driving on the roadway not just the US.

I'm guessing that's in reference to my previous post. If so, I clearly pointed out that even with stricter driving testing in the UK, "the percentage of imbeciles on the road is about the same", so I agree with you.

I stand by my point that running red lights - while of course it happens elsewhere - is a particular problem in the US.

Offline whiteman

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #65 on: July 14, 2008, 12:50:51 PM »
not reading all 5 pages.

I agree with moot that it is way to easy to get a drivers license here. Some of the things i see on the road to and from work blow my mind as to how that moron could get a license. No way i would get on a motorcycle, theres people cutting off big rigs and SUVs so they can be the first to the red light then leaving the trucks just enough room to stop before they get hit.

That said the last 3 accidents i was in the other person had no insurance or drivers license, so you can make the test as hard as you want and they will still drive.

I had a close call with a motorcycle cop at night once, he got in my blind spot and never saw him. Went to change lanes and thank god he hit the siren to let me know he was there. since then every time change lanes i'm looking for motorcycles in my blind spot even if I've been driving for 50 miles in with no traffic. I treat motorcycles like rigs now i just give them the right away and slow down to let them go where ever they want.

Offline Yeager

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #66 on: July 14, 2008, 01:17:30 PM »
Years ago I dated an emergency room nurse who told me "never sacrifice your life trying to avoid a collision with a motorcyclist, they know the risk they take".

Not wearing a helmet is definately a choice thing, and a stupid choice at that.  Really stupid.  Incredibly stupid.  Shockingly stupid.  But it should be a choice.  A choice to help forward the cause of Darwinism, and to supply other people with organs they desperately need. 
« Last Edit: July 14, 2008, 01:26:00 PM by Yeager »
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Offline REP0MAN

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #67 on: July 14, 2008, 01:19:06 PM »
I have a good friend who is a motor-cop. He told me that they train them specifically to drive 5-10 MPH faster than traffic and train them with the ability to judge what others' may do. It's odd that the Motor-cop in your situation stayed in the blind spot but you experienced some of his training when he bumped his siren to let you know he was there.

:aok
Apparently, one in five people in the world are Chinese. And there are five people in my family, so it must be one of them. It's either my mum or my dad. Or my older brother, Colin. Or my younger brother, Ho-Chan-Chu. But I think it's Colin. - Tim Vine.

Offline CAP1

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #68 on: July 14, 2008, 01:30:08 PM »


I had a close call with a motorcycle cop at night once, he got in my blind spot and never saw him. Went to change lanes and thank god he hit the siren to let me know he was there. since then every time change lanes i'm looking for motorcycles in my blind spot even if I've been driving for 50 miles in with no traffic. I treat motorcycles like rigs now i just give them the right away and slow down to let them go where ever they want.

you only looked in the mirror? and you trust just the mirrors?

i check mirror, then turn my head. i never ever change a lane without being 100% certian that there's no one there. all vehicles have blind spots that you need to double check by actually looking.

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Offline whiteman

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #69 on: July 14, 2008, 01:53:08 PM »
you only looked in the mirror? and you trust just the mirrors?

i check mirror, then turn my head. i never ever change a lane without being 100% certian that there's no one there. all vehicles have blind spots that you need to double check by actually looking.



sorry i didn't spell it out, yes i checked both mirror and looked back never saw him. hence the blind spot

Offline lasersailor184

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #70 on: July 14, 2008, 02:03:01 PM »
I've been in one motorcycle accident. I bought another bike after it was totaled. (I was fine except beat up pretty badly on the skin)
Then I married an ER nurse. (The stories she told were horrific) After we married, I sold the bike, doubt I'll own another one. She rode with me a few times, mainly up to Mt.Rainier (the loop)
The older one gets, the more mortal they feel.

For me its just the opposite.  Of course this may change with time, but I'd like to take up riding a Harley when I get older.  Like 50+ (not even half way there yet).  I'm aware of the risks.  But when I'm older and have done most of the things I want to do, then I wouldn't be so dismayed if I get taken out.

I know as I have driven that I've almost taken out bike riders.  Even though I check mirrors and especially make sure to look myself, I almost hit one that I never even saw.
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Offline lazs2

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #71 on: July 14, 2008, 02:19:42 PM »
laser.. the only thing I can tell you about your thinking is....

We, past 50, have already been where you are at.. you have no idea where we are at.   

Your thinking is flawed because of this.

I am a risk taker..  Life without risk is no life at all for me.   I have mellowed in my old age but some vestiges of my risk taking personality still remain.. It gets harder to forget the hospital rooms and the broken bones tho when they hurt every day of your life.. a good day is just a few of em hurting a little.

I would not do anything different if I could tho.

lazs

Offline Kaw1000

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #72 on: July 14, 2008, 03:29:31 PM »
People are in a big hurry these days. If they only knew they saved just seconds by going through stoplights or speeding,
They would slow down. How many times has a guy come flying by you and you catch him at the next light.
SLOW TF DOWN!! You don't save that much time by driving erratically and fast.You just put your life in jeopardy or
someone else's
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Offline Maverick

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #73 on: July 14, 2008, 03:36:39 PM »
It is also possible that had the riders not been wearing helmets,their increased peripheral and hearing might have prevented this.

You might want to go back and read the original post again, this time reading for comprehension. First off there is no mention of helmet or no helmet at all in it.

Secondly this little bit here is more telling regarding the motorcyclists attention probabilities.

"There are four Bikers in front of me.  One girl, three guys - all under 30.  Light turns green, they wind up their bikes and start to cross into the intersection.  They are talking to each other (fatal mistake)."

Please note that the riders did not seem to have a problem TALKING while riding so therefore hearing would not likely be an issue. Perhaps if they had quiet pipes they might be able to hear something coming.  That of course is a totally bogus assumption since again there is no mention of loud pipes in the original and follow up posts.

Perhaps if the drivers were paying attention to the task at hand they might have seen the threat. A simple side to side scan before entering the intersection is a good insurance policy no matter what you are driving, say like a car with the AC, radio and telephone on while yelling at the kids in the back seat much less a motorcycle.

Blaming the collision on the riders wearing helmets is like blaming the red light for not stopping the car. The equipment does not excuse the rider / driver's lack of attention or inability to follow the basic rules of the road. In this case there is also no mention that they WERE wearing helmets either. Perhaps if they were not wearing them the one dead at the scene might have been alive had one been worn.
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Offline CAP1

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Re: Motorcycle Enthusiasts-Horrible Accident
« Reply #74 on: July 14, 2008, 04:28:25 PM »
People are in a big hurry these days. If they only knew they saved just seconds by going through stoplights or speeding,
They would slow down. How many times has a guy come flying by you and you catch him at the next light.
SLOW TF DOWN!! You don't save that much time by driving erratically and fast.You just put your life in jeopardy or
someone else's


first off......i rarely go through amber lights.....never red ones.

 now, that said, time your normal drives through specific areas. you will find that that 45 second red light generally adds up to somewhere in the ballpark of 5 minutes. each one.  time to de-accelerate, then wait for the guys in front to finally decide to move, then time to re-accelerate.

 it's kinda like a slow motion version of a nascar pitstop. it only takes em 20 seconds(or less) to change 4 tires and add 22 gallons fo fuel, but they're spending almost a full minute out of the race when you combine slowdown, pit road travel, the work itself, then reaccelerate to pit road speed, then to race speed......

 i still don't condone running the lights, but i had timed some of these because a good friend of mine was argueing with me about this, years ago. 
ingame 1LTCAP
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