Battle of Britain II

[FluffyKitty]

So who would win
everybody knows the outcome of the Battle of Britain in August 1940.  But if it wasn't for Hitler switching his attention to Russia in 1941 there would have been a round 2.  So here is my question, and point of discussion: if a second Battle of Britain commenced in the summer of 1941 would the Germans have won? (And by that I mean gained and maintained air superiority over southern England and the English Channel) The luftwaffe would have been equipped with the BF109F, and the RAF with the Spitfire Mk5, so there is an entire discussion regarding the relative merits of those two planes against each other, and of course let us not forget about the hurricane. 
But there would be many other factors, some subtle and some obvious that could affect the outcome greatly.  Perhaps the most significant of this would be the simple addition of long-range fuel tanks for the 109s.  They lacked these in 1940 and only had a matter of minutes of the South England before they had to return to base.  If this was addressed in 1941 this would have been a significant force multiplier.  But that should be counterbalanced against the increased RAF fight production and pilot training that was on line by 1941 and also the adoption luftwaffe fighter tactics.
So who would win?

[Bruv119]

Britain , Britain , Britain

[Redlegs]

Britain...again

[Guyver]

as we biuld there aircraft id say britain. we would sabotage all teh planes we biuld for them lol.

plus we have the best pilots.    

[Dragon]

Britain , Britain , Britain

No bias there, eh Bruv

[SkyRock]

the DT's had a lot to do with it(1940), plus the british radar, so maybe Germany would have had the advantage by 1941.  In reality, Goering was a self-centered bafoon and blew the first battle with extremely dim-witted planning and execution.  He was still in charge in '41 so outcome would probably be the same.

[BaldEagl]

Britan for a few reasons (listed from least to most important):

1.  Germany didn't have great long range heavy bombers.  Not on the order of the B-17, B-24, Lancaster, etc. anyway.  This would limit their effectiveness on a per sortie basis.

2.  Similar to in AH, the British could RTB, re-fuel, re-arm and re-up relatively quickly while the Germans faced a much longer turn-around time.  This means the Brits could effectively do more with less.

3.  As round 2 continued, the US would have entered the war and come to Britan's aid.

[Kweassa]

 There's a reason why history doesn't deal with "what-if"s.

 Too many variables/premises can be simply supposed to support one's own view.

 What if, Goering finally understood his own mistakes in overall strategical deployment of the Luftwaffe?
 What if Germany came up with a longer range fighter?
 What if Germany went back to the field-pounding raids?
 What if the war lasted longer without US? Can British manpower defeat Germany in attrition rates?

 
 Totally meaningless unless the question comes with specific limitations in our free "supposing everything".

 
 

[saantana]

Britain.
And 308th would have been the best scoring fighter squad, again 
Let the chute killings continue..

[CAP1]

i actually believe that, had hitler kept up the pressure on england, they'd have fallen. even with a small amoutn of recovery time, they may have.

 the 2 biggest things that saved england then, was the united states, and the fact that hitler turned his attention away from them.

 at that point, the luftwaffe still had experienced pilots. england was putting kids with less than 20 hours in the air to fight them off. some kicked ass, a lot died.


this is just what i think though........

[saantana]

the 2 biggest things that saved england then, was the united states, and the fact that hitler turned his attention away from them.

.. and that goering was a complete retard

[CAP1]

Britan for a few reasons (listed from least to most important):

1.  Germany didn't have great long range heavy bombers.  Not on the order of the B-17, B-24, Lancaster, etc. anyway.  This would limit their effectiveness on a per sortie basis.

wasn't the luftwaffe flying their bombers out of france, negating the need for long range bombers?

2.  Similar to in AH, the British could RTB, re-fuel, re-arm and re-up relatively quickly while the Germans faced a much longer turn-around time.  This means the Brits could effectively do more with less.

this is very true, that they could do this, but it would be almost pointless against a steady stream of bombers

3.  As round 2 continued, the US would have entered the war and come to Britan's aid.

THIS would have been the biggest deciding factor. the only problem is that england may have been tooo far gone by the time we got into it IF hitler had kept up the pressure, and IF they had learned from their mistakes the first time round.


<<S>>

[CAP1]

.. and that goering was a complete retard

ok, i forgot him.........

three things

[Furball]

Britain with ease i think.

As Bald rightly said - Germany lacked any effective bombers.  

But also: -

• The RAF was using cannon in 1941 which would have made downing bombers much easier
• The RAF pilots had a lot more experience
• Better equipment
• Better tactics
• Better defences
• Better production
• Better training for new pilots
• A hugely more effective bomber force - including Stirlings, Manchesters, Mosquitoes and Halifaxes

I don't think the Germans would have stood a chance at all.

[Furball]

i actually believe that, had hitler kept up the pressure on england, they'd have fallen. even with a small amoutn of recovery time, they may have.

 the 2 biggest things that saved england then, was the united states, and the fact that hitler turned his attention away from them.

 at that point, the luftwaffe still had experienced pilots. england was putting kids with less than 20 hours in the air to fight them off. some kicked ass, a lot died.

this is just what i think though........

That is rubbish, the RAF had plenty of experience by that point, they had been in the war since 1939 and had progressively improved everything.  We were not saved by the United States at all, it is debatable whether the British could have invaded mainland Europe on their own, but certainly was not saved.  The RAF saved Britain, and by doing that, enabled Britain to be free and made the liberation of Europe possible.  A lot is owed to all those men from all those countries that fought in the BoB.

In May 1942 Bomber Command launched their first 1,000 bomber raid.  The US 8th Air Force began operations some two months later?  Seems strange to me that the entry of the USA saved Britain...