Adjustment to Scoring (idea)

[crockett]

Yes, I would like the ENY to be more localized.  Many times I have been at the other end of the map from the friendly horde opposing the enemy horde.  It's frustrating when you are vastly outnumbered locally, AND have a limited planeset.

Which reminds me of one of very few suggestions I've ever made regarding the scoring system vs enemy proxy modifier

Yea I can agree with that idea and sounds like a good idea to me (the vs enemy proxy modifier)  I really do think steps need to be taken to nullify the hoarding that's going on and the lack of fights. I think due to the type of game you can't outright stop it, other than to not reward them for doing it and give incentives to not do it.

[Murdr]

You can't compare apples to oranges. Saying your apple is bigger than his orange is the same as comparing the score-sheet of a guy who vulches to one who does not.

You can when the unit of measurment is "fruit".  Seems to me that people should play to the performance metrics if they wish to participate in that regard, instead of expecting the reverse to happen.

[Zazen13]

Why do you want the game to discourage something that others may find fun, and it just so happens that you don't?
I understand your point. It's just that other peoples views might be different than yours.

I think you're missing something in Strafing's proposal. You can still vulch if you want. Like Murdr's example, if you're just the type that "gets-off", "ripping the wings off flies" or "zapping ants with a magnifying glass", there's absolutely nothing to stop you. The same holds true for those that will likely continue to do it occasionally to make a base capture easy or because they enjoy griefing other players. You can still fullfill yourself if those are truly your motivations, it just won't show up on your scoresheet or his. The people that will likely choose to wait the 30 seconds before they pounce will be those who's motivation is the buffer candy puff piece and score/rank which I strongly suspect are the vast majority.

[Zazen13]

You can when the unit of measurment is "fruit".  Seems to me that people should play to the performance metrics if they wish to participate in that regard, instead of expecting the reverse to happen.

That's reasonable on one condition. We separate vulches from "real" kills in the sub-stats of fighter rank. Showing the person's overall fighter stats with and without the vulches. They can keep the rank for all I care. Then we can compare on both levels with accurate metrics, the apples and the oranges.

[Bode]

First of all if you upping at a base that is under attack you deserved to get vulched. Go to a field alittle ways off climb out and Vulch the Vulchers that is much more fun. We call them Tatics. Yes I realize GVs are differnet. but my solutions is to up a pony with 2k of bombs on it and go drop a bomb on the spawncampers head just to hear the secondary BooM. Spawncampers with 20 kills hate that.

 

[Nutzoid]

Or maybe make all kills a kill, and do away with rank, keeping just the other stats?   

[Xargos]

Some people use the scoring aspect of this game to judge how much they've improved, I have no problem with that.  Others however manipulate their score because of a frail ego and are interfering with the ones who wish to use scoring for legit reasons.  For that reason I think players should only be aloud to see their own score.

P.S.  I find it funny how some players think they're so good because of their score, yet even I can spank them in a one on one.  Truly sad considering how poorly I fly.

[crockett]

First of all if you upping at a base that is under attack you deserved to get vulched. Go to a field alittle ways off climb out and Vulch the Vulchers that is much more fun. We call them Tatics. Yes I realize GVs are differnet. but my solutions is to up a pony with 2k of bombs on it and go drop a bomb on the spawncampers head just to hear the secondary BooM. Spawncampers with 20 kills hate that.

 

Having the attitude of you deserve to get vulched if they are vulching is wrong IMO. That's the same to me, as running from the fight because I think I might die. IMO if you are unwilling to defend against them, then it's just as big of a problem as the hoard it's self. The problem with upping at another field is so many times they capture the base before you get there, so the party is already over.

As for the vulches, you have to pick the vulches you up and there are simply some you just wont get up at no matter what. Overal timing is everything but I can typically get in the air and get kills 60% to 70% of the time. I don't up to die I up to kill vulch tards with K4 tatters.  

[Tr1gg22]

Having the attitude of you deserve to get vulched if they are vulching is wrong IMO. That's the same to me, as running from the fight because I think I might die. IMO if you are unwilling to defend against them, then it's just as big of a problem as the hoard it's self. The problem with upping at another field is so many times they capture the base before you get there, so the party is already over.

As for the vulches, you have to pick the vulches you up and there are simply some you just wont get up at no matter what. Overal timing is everything but I can typically get in the air and get kills 60% to 70% of the time. I don't up to die I up to kill vulch tards with K4 tatters. 

IMO that was one of the most dim witted comments I heard in a while.   Upping and dying 5 times out of 6 times with a couple kills maybe if ur luky, while in the same amount of time  turning the tables in ur favor and getting 3 times as many kills by using ur head makes more sense to me...There is always the lucky chance of upping ,and dashing in for the lucky troop kill at the last  moment if u make it there in 1 peace from a vulched field ,as previously stated this is my own opinion

[Zazen13]

Yes, I would like the ENY to be more localized.  Many times I have been at the other end of the map from the friendly horde opposing the enemy horde.  It's frustrating when you are vastly outnumbered locally, AND have a limited planeset.

Which reminds me of one of very few suggestions I've ever made regarding the scoring system vs enemy proxy modifier

I found my original posts to HiTech before ENY was implimented and shortly thereafter where I addressed this very concern among others...

A few other things to consider before even contemplating implimenting restrictions based on raw roster numbers...

1) What about people on extended AFK? Lots of people stay connected to AH virtually 24/7, even going so far as throwing up their AFK tag to take a 4-hour nap. This is espeically true if their country seems close to a  reset, they want to be "online" to get the reset perks. Perhaps you would need some sort of 'inactivity time-out timer" coded into the game, that would boot people who haven't registered any input in 30 minutes?

2) What about the plethora of dual-accounters that have a 2nd account permanently logged-on with their laptop on an enemy country for the purpose of vectoring themselves and teamates to CV's and their 'favorite' players on the enemy team? While hard to estimate the numbers without looking up IP addresses my conservative guess, based on some long-term carefull observations and note-taking, is this number is significant, perhaps 10 to 20 'snoop' accounts at any given time, mostly poised against the 'advantaged' team obviously.

3) Consider that to a large degree numerical disparities are handled internally by the players thru some common sense. When one country is advantaged the other two countries tend to focus more on the advantaged country than one another. So, in actuality the raw numbers may indicate a disparity, but on the map the numbers are actually equal or even less than equal when viewed from the perspective of 'opposition' facing each country.

Overall, I would caution against implimenting this idea without some consideration as to the ramifications upon gameplay and various ways players can manipulate the raw roster numbers to cause the time-out imposition on other teams. I warn against being naive and underestimating how conniving a determined individual or group can be when properly motivated.

Zazen

and

This is a glaring example of why the ENY system is deeply and irrevocably flawed at its core. It does not take into consideration the disposition of forces. Just because the three countries have an equal number of people logged in does not mean the arena is balanced in terms of gameplay for each of those countries. Conversely, just because the three countries are disparate in terms of people logged in does not in any way mean the arena is in fact unblanced. The presumption of the ENY system is that forces are arrayed in equal and congruent proportion, this is RARELY the case. Often, the country with the most people is not only facing more enemy by far than the other two countries but is also being penalized in the process by the ENY system. This is a profound and deep flaw. Surely, HT, a man of logic and rational thought can comprehend how fundamentally flawed and presumptuous this system is.


Zazen

and

...we're talking a difference of as little as 10% between the countries being enough to eliminate a good portion of the planes from the set. Now if the country with a 20% advantage is getting penalized and is also facing 80% of the enemy from both the other countries, that my friend is a major balance issue. This scenario is quite frequent for countries in the reset corner, or those with a limited number of fields remaining. The ENY system does nothing to address ACTUAL arena balance as it impacts gameplay. Nothing, nada, zip. All it does is crank out some arbitrary penalty based on the relationship of the raw numbers of people logged on for each country.

Zazen

and

That's not true. Think of the maps. All the maps have a reset corner. No matter what, the team in that corner is doomed. Eventually they will be reset. This happens whether that team is numerically superior for a protracted period or not, numbers will just forestall the inevitable. If they occupy this part of the map and are also numerically inferior the reset occurs very quickly. For some reason this is almost always the South, South-East, or East side of the maps. Almost without exception the country occupying that portion will face a much larger percentage of both the two other country's forces regardless of relative numbers.

This phenomena proves my point that the individual country numbers can be perfectly equal but the arena can still be completely out of balance if those forces are arrayed disproprtionately. Conversely, the raw country numbers can be quite disparate, but the actual arena balance can be perfect, with the forces arrayed in proportion to those numbers by the three sides. This is often seen when a country with superior numbers occupies the 'reset corner' of a map. While their raw numbers are in fact superior, they are facing a proprtionately larger contingent of enemy than either of the other two countries are individually, in effect keeping it balanced.

These examples are where the ENY system fails completely. It makes no provision for 'reset corners' or how forces are arrayed. By its very simplicty it implies an exactly equal and proportional arraying of force, this is rarely the case. I won't even mention the fact that it assumes all those logged into the game for a particular country are having an impact on gameplay. Often as much as 25% of those logged in for one country or another are on extended AFK, or ghost accounts that are merely logged in for clandestine purposes.

Zazen

[DMBEAR]

What a bunch of aces. AHII, #1 supporter of Kleenex.

[crockett]

IMO that was one of the most dim witted comments I heard in a while.   Upping and dying 5 times out of 6 times with a couple kills maybe if ur luky, while in the same amount of time  turning the tables in ur favor and getting 3 times as many kills by using ur head makes more sense to me...There is always the lucky chance of upping ,and dashing in for the lucky troop kill at the last  moment if u make it there in 1 peace from a vulched field ,as previously stated this is my own opinion

You didn't read what I said.. I don't up and get killed 5 out of 6 times. I can get in the air and make kills 60 to 70% of the time. With that said of course you can't do it at every vulch and you have to pick the right time. Sometimes I will up and land right away before rolling simply to bait them in so I can relaunch right after they pass, but if there are 10 cons over the field with no flack support then you aren't getting up no matter what.

[Murdr]

Having the attitude of you deserve to get vulched if they are vulching is wrong IMO.

Reminded me of an old addage.  Vulch me once, shame on you.  Vulch me twice, shame on me. 

[Tr1gg22]

You didn't read what I said.. I don't up and get killed 5 out of 6 times. I can get in the air and make kills 60 to 70% of the time. With that said of course you can't do it at every vulch and you have to pick the right time. Sometimes I will up and land right away before rolling simply to bait them in so I can relaunch right after they pass, but if there are 10 cons over the field with no flack support then you aren't getting up no matter what.

  GOTCHA 

[Tr1gg22]

Reminded me of an old addage.  Vulch me once, shame on you.  Vulch me twice, shame on me. 

exactly