Time to upgrade need advise

[Fulmar]

In the past it was sort of a given that ATI worked best with AMD and NVidia worked best with Intel.  Not sure if that is the case anymore, does anyone know about this? (could have been a myth).

Maybe in the past, but it hasn't mattered for a while.  ATI or Nvidia is going to design a card that is going to work on the best on either platform.  Neither would gamble on promoting performance on one CPU over the other, they're both optimized as best as possible.

[Stogie]

I have this system figured out.  Thank you everyone for all your help, I'm amazed at how much I have fallen behind with the technology after working with computers for over 30 years.  I did learn alot going through ordeal.  Thanks again

[Fulmar]

According to this article on the 9600GT (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-geforce-9600-gt,1780.html) the 3850 does an excellent job of holding it's own against the 9600GT.  Some games the difference is only 1-2 FPS (depending on resolution and settings).  Either card will do justice in AH hands down.

I've had more luck with drivers on Nvidia's side over the years than ATI, but that's my opinion and you can call me an Nvidia fanboy.  Like I said, both cards will work flawlessly for you

Now if you have $10-$20 to play with in your budget, I wouldn't hold yourself to that exact 'brand' of video card.  Sapphire offers a 2 year warranty and Chaintech offers 13 months.  I recommend cards that offer lifetime warranties.  Off the top of my head, I know EVGA and BFG do, PNY maybe?  IMO it's worth it.  I've dealt with BFG a few times before - great tech support.  My dying ti4600 was replaced by a 5900XT, free.

 BFG Tech BFGE96512GTOCE GeForce 9600 GT 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card - Retail - Overclocked card.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814143130
$119.99 - $30 Rebate = $89.99

So after rebate, this Nvidia card is $10 more and has a lifetime warranty.

[BaldEagl]

I have this system figured out.  Thank you everyone for all your help, I'm amazed at how much I have fallen behind with the technology after working with computers for over 30 years.  I did learn alot going through ordeal.  Thanks again

Lets see what you're going with.

[Stogie]

Lets see what you're going with.

Its gonna cost me slightly more than I budgeted but that is cause I needed to get a DVD. Here is what I'm gonna order:

Case
 COOLER MASTER Centurion 5 CAC-T05-UW Black Aluminum Bezel , SECC Chassis ATX Mid Tower Computer Case
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119068

PSU
Thermaltake Purepower W0100RU 500W ATX 12V 2.0 Power Supply 115/ 230 V
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153052

Motherboard
GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS3L LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128337

Processor
Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHz 6MB L2 Cache LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115037

RAM
G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231098

Video
SAPPHIRE 100226L Radeon HD 3850 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102715

DVD
LITE-ON Black 20X DVD
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106263

I know I should get a 250 GB sata drive for 60 bucks but I can always get that later.  In case I decide to do that now which will make transfering easier from my old drives I figure this one will do fine.

Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3250410AS 250GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148262&Tpk=n82e16822148262

Total with shipping and not the Hard drive is $550.  I think it's a great deal!

[BaldEagl]

Nice build for the price.  It will be a big improvement for you.  Let us know how it works once you get it done.

[DREDIOCK]

I seem to have come up with a pretty good system thanks to the help everyone here has given.  I'm semi stuck on the video card.  The one Fulmar recommended, SAPPHIRE 100226L Radeon HD 3850 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card or a Geforce 9600 GT.

In the past it was sort of a given that ATI worked best with AMD and NVidia worked best with Intel.  Not sure if that is the case anymore, does anyone know about this? (could have been a myth).

If memory serves correct. and someone correct me if Im wrong. The ATI card tends to run on the hot side.

For myself on my current build I am leaning to an NVidia card for primarily that reason.
I dont want to have to add any more fans then I have to.
More fans usually means more noise.
And I HATE a machine that sounds like a shop vac

[MrRiplEy[H]]

The 2900HD hogs power and runs hot, the 3850 is more power efficient and runs cooler.

If I was building that box I would get a 4 gig ram set from G.skill instead - it will only hurt you 20 bucks but it will give you ram overhead for every possible scenario considering you run 32 bits.

[BaldEagl]

If memory serves correct. and someone correct me if Im wrong. The ATI card tends to run on the hot side.

For myself on my current build I am leaning to an NVidia card for primarily that reason.
I dont want to have to add any more fans then I have to.
More fans usually means more noise.
And I HATE a machine that sounds like a shop vac

Both Nvidia and ATI cards run hot (65-70C idle) as they default to ~30 something % fan speed.  Once built, download RivaTuner and turn the cards fan speed up.  Problem solved.

I run my 512 8800 GTS at 65% and never exceed 55C.

[Fulmar]

And I HATE a machine that sounds like a shop vac

You'd hate my computer.  Since my 3 internal HD's block a good portion of my front air flow, I have to rely on my side window case.  The stock 2x120mm's weren't getting it down as they RPM'd about 1000-1200.  The new ones I have run about 1900-2000 and are the loudest fans I've ever witnessed, but they move a lot of air.  I'll probably be in the market for a fan controller in the near future.

My 8800 GTS 640mb used to run idle at least 60C.  With the new higher RPM 120 next to it, it's down to 53C.
I have 1 80mm intake, 1 120mm intake, 1 120mm exhaust, PCI slot fan exhaust, 1 80mm exhaust at the top, PSU has a 140mm fan, i have 2 x 30mm fans on my northbridge and I have an Arctic Freezer 7 HSF.

[Skuzzy]

Hmmmm,..The only think I might have a concern about is the power supply.  500W just seems to be barely enough.  If you get above 80% of the power supply maximum output the power will start to get 'dirty'.

You are also handicapping the E8400 CPU using PC6400 RAM.  Is it that the motherboard only supports PC6400?  I did not check it.

[Charge]

"If I was building that box I would get a 4 gig ram set from G.skill instead - it will only hurt you 20 bucks but it will give you ram overhead for every possible scenario considering you run 32 bits."

Same goes for 64bit. Had 8Gb and took off half of it and I've still never ran out of mem (and that with Vista).


"500W just seems to be barely enough."

It depends:

Q9300 2.5GHz
GF 8800GT
2x2Gb 800MHz DDR2
3 HDDs (one active during test)
1 DVD-RW
X-Fi Soundblaster Extreme Music
120mm case fan, G15 keyboard, wireless mouse controller

430W Antec NeoPower HE

"Balanced" Vista64 power scheme

Idle 117W, 150-180W during AH, peak consumption during 3DMark06 (result 10450) 200W. Got it to peak at 260W running WW2Online (one core at 100% load all the time).

It does not hurt to have some reserve watts , though. Meaning that even with such low consumption I would not put a smaller PSU in my comp in any case. I'd also like to point out that both my CPU and GPU are made with smaller chip technology than previous models further reducing their power consumption.

-C+

[Skuzzy]

It is not the total power, and I should have clarified that.  If 90% of that power draw is from one rail then that rail better be really beefy.  The power supply he is choosing is around 70% efficiency, so a 30% overhead is needed to provide clean power.

The 3.3V for that supply supplies 22A (max).  That is only 72.6W.  The one 12V rail for the CPU is rated at 14A, which is 168W and the other 12V rail is rated at 15A, which is 180W.

Those are maximum ratings.  Now at 70% capacity which is the true maximum before power is not clean anymore, it goes down to the following maximums.

3.3V = 50.8W
12V1 = 117.6W
12V2 = 126W

The Radeon HD3850 draws 95W peak power off the 12V rail.  In my opinion that is getting very close to the edge.  It just does not leave much overhead.

[Fulmar]

My E6400 at stock speeds, 4gb DDR2, 2x250gb Maxtors, 1 500gb Seagate, 88000 GTS 640mb, SB X-FI, USB PCI card, 2 120mm fans, 2 80mm fans, PCI fan, DVD drive, a few USB devices.

Runs about 260W (taken via the Kill-A-Watt) at 80-100% load on both cores and a good load on the video card.  I run a 600W PSU, but a lot of what I need in needed on the amperage of the 12V rail.

When I listed that Thermaltake, I really didn't take a close look at the power requirements for the 3850.  I would go with Skuzzy on the PSU concerns.

On the RAM note, the E8400 runs at quad pumped FSB at 1333mhz.  Essentially it's 333mhz (quad pumped).  So to maintain a 1:1 ratio of FSB:RAM, DDR2 needs to be at least 667mhz (2x333mhz), or PC5300.  So PC6400 at 800mhz (2x400mhz) would more than do the job at stock speeds.  Overclocking...is a whole different ball game.

[BaldEagl]

On the RAM note, the E8400 runs at quad pumped FSB at 1333mhz.  Essentially it's 333mhz (quad pumped).  So to maintain a 1:1 ratio of FSB:RAM, DDR2 needs to be at least 667mhz (2x333mhz), or PC5300.  So PC6400 at 800mhz (2x400mhz) would more than do the job at stock speeds.  Overclocking...is a whole different ball game.

If synced (CPU and RAM clocks both at 400) at 1600 FSB with (IIRC) a 9 multi that would put that chip at 3.6Ghz, probably as far as you'de want to go on stock air.  If clocking higher with aftermarket cooling then getting faster RAM might be worthwhile.